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BilletHead

Why some people do not like carp!

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    Well put this in your pipe and smoke it. 

   We will start with why some Texans don't want them but I read that there is a trophy fishery there maybe because that might be the only thing that lake can support? 

http://www.tsusinvasives.org/home/database/cyprinus-carpio

They really don't like them in Minnesota either,

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/invasives/aquaticanimals/commoncarp/index.html

  And they really hate them in Australia and Tasmania, 

http://www.clw.csiro.au/publications/controlling_carp.pdf

http://www.pestsmart.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/CPFS5.pdf

http://www.themorayslair.org/european-carp-australias-toughest-invasive-fish-species/

http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/abs/10.1139/f91-302?journalCode=cjfas#.Wbm1HLpFzIU

https://www.ifs.tas.gov.au/about-us/publications/fish-fact-sheets/european-carp

   Sorry you all I did not put up pictures. And again * Disclaimer I did not witness the destruction and impact of carp in these documents. Just copied and pasted what the scientists said.

BilletHead

  P.S I bet some of these places are begging for bowfishers . 

 

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3 hours ago, BilletHead said:

 We will start with why some Texans don't want them but I read that there is a trophy fishery there maybe because that might be the only thing that lake can support? 

Lake Fork???B) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVKqYrDTULk&t=271s

 

 

 

3 hours ago, BilletHead said:

  They really don't like them in Minnesota either,

 

Local Fishing For Carp & Other Rough Fish by the "Minnesota Dept Of Natural Resourses"

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/areas/fisheries/westmetro/rough_fish.html

3 hours ago, BilletHead said:

And they really hate them in Australia and Tasmania, 

since we are talking about other countries, Bass are considered invasive there and they have a growing bow fishing community that shoots bass :o

https://www.nies.go.jp/biodiversity/invasive/DB/detail/50330e.html

 

Euro Style Carp angling is here to stay slappy......so put that in your pipe and smoke it

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I think it's great that Euro style carp fishing is perhaps getting more popular, as long as fisheries managers don't start managing waters for carp at the expense of gamefish.  Seems to me that "wild" carp like we have in the public waters of the U.S. would be a tremendous draw for Europeans wanting to experience something a little different from the extremely managed, more or less domesticated carp found in European waters.

I'm now out in Montana, and there is a public lake about an hour away from the house which is chock full of carp.  (It also has some pretty nice largemouth.)  It's at Three Forks, where the Madison, Gallatin, and Jefferson rivers come together to form the MIssouri River, in a big flat area surrounded by lofty mountains.  How cool would it be for a European carp angler to catch carp in that kind of setting, with the landscape and history?

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4 hours ago, Al Agnew said:

I think it's great that Euro style carp fishing is perhaps getting more popular, as long as fisheries managers don't start managing waters for carp at the expense of gamefish.  Seems to me that "wild" carp like we have in the public waters of the U.S. would be a tremendous draw for Europeans wanting to experience something a little different from the extremely managed, more or less domesticated carp found in European waters.

I'm now out in Montana, and there is a public lake about an hour away from the house which is chock full of carp.  (It also has some pretty nice largemouth.)  It's at Three Forks, where the Madison, Gallatin, and Jefferson rivers come together to form the MIssouri River, in a big flat area surrounded by lofty mountains.  How cool would it be for a European carp angler to catch carp in that kind of setting, with the landscape and history?

I agree totally, the interesting thing here is to grow trophy carp its a MUST to have healthy predator gamefish population and water qualities......most "damaged" waters by carp start by a lack of baby carp eaters ...you need the great gamefish populations to get great trophy carp ..your not going to see common carp managed to the detriment of traditional gamefish..unless its in a water that can't support gamefish because of silt loading or really bad polution issues

4 hours ago, Boobie said:

They are terrible for wetlands. Read article in this months DUCKS UNLIMITED.

too many carp can decimate wetlands vegetation waterfowl need...the big issue is winter kill in those wetlands that are getting damaged...freezing out the baby carp eaters, (eggs and larva too)...when you have winter kill in those areas you have way too much recruitment of carp......the University of Minnesota has tons of research on it....carp recruitment from un-winter killed areas is almost non existent...... over harvest of waterfowl is a huge issue, so typically the "we don't have as many ducks to shoot because of the carp" should be too many ducks are getting shot..is why you have less to shoot...those carp have been in those areas for 140 years.....its only is specific conditions that removing carp effect the changes....many times the waterfowl recruitment don't rebound by just removing carp...I will attach a YouTube video of Prezmek Bajer from the University of MN at the bottom ..but in short

It is documented that waters with an over abundance of common carp are typically DAMAGED waters, 

specifically overfished; that means removing baby carp eaters, 

Source point solution issues, EX. silt from exposed soils 
(Construction & farming & denuding of vegetative cover) 

Increased run off in urban areas; Because of asphalt, concrete etc covering soils, washing road salts. hydrocarbons thats gas and oil, trace elements, heavy metals, and sewage into a water system, Common carp can live better in those environments because of their ability to take O2 from the surface (Alligator Gar as well)

The University Of Minnesota often referenced studies on controls of Common Carp (Cyprinus carpio)
generalize that removing carp = better water clarity and better gamefish populations, increased native vegetation that helps waterfowl populations.

This is in ONLY very narrow and specific situations, I will explain

Prezmek Bajer dept of fish and wildlife studies, University Of Minnesota.
Studied lake Susan in Minnesota 
common carp reduced from 200kg-to about 60 kg per hectare or from about 250 pounds of carp per acre reduced to 130 pounds per acre

a direct quote from Prezmek Bajer "Carp are invasive in SOME places but not invasive in a lot of places 50-100 kg of carp per hectar are ok"  

Lake Susan that stratifies in summer, water clarity increased in May & June but fell back almost no change post carp removal levels July-October

Bayer goes on to say "phosphorus loading blamed on carp in laboratory tests, are not typically shown in real world in the lake results.....so phosphorus is not always driven by carp....... other things are happening we are not sure about".... It should be noted he goes on to warn vegetation along the shoreline usually goes up, this sometimes is a problem for recreational users....Lake Wingra in Madison,  WI.., another poster child for carp removal...weed growth exploded making the lake less usable..so much so they mechanically remove the weeds for hundreds of thousand of dollars...then blamed the geese..(poop) and removed them yet still have water quality issues...the lake HAD 35 some springs that used to feed that lake..most have been covered or tapped for farm applications...at the same time of the carp removals several springs had been located and restored, enhancing the perceived better water quality attributed solely to the removal of the carp,..... carp are still there just not at the larger densities...the WI fisheries has stocked more baby carp eaters (Muskie) to keep things in check

Also of note common carp have poor recruitment in waters that have good populations of native fishes because those fish that feed heavlly on eggs and carp larva; bluegills specifically noted, Bluegills are one of the 1st fishes to die in a low O2 event exacerbating YOY recruitment of common carp.

like most fisheries management situations it usually not so simple..removing common carp (buffalo as well) doesn't always = better fishing or waterfowl recruitment, just in the right situations....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P58Hjr3T6sU <---Prezmek Bajer carp video

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