esox niger

and then what happened?

Um...yes i have but...thas mostly an act of desperation ....i sure haven't caught many that way. If you can put a fly deep on the bottom and drift it you might catch a fish. sure helps to know where the fish are though, but if they are thick down there could be killer...but i think you'll mostly be "fishing" and not "carp fishing" if you follow my drift.

I haven't abandonded them at all...just got rollin an a slightly different wavelength. I always tie saltwater for my self but can provide them on freshwater hooks as well. 20lb tippet always, no break offs thats way, no stainless litter in fishes mouth or creekbeds, never have to wory about wet flies corroding and ruining other flies as my boxes often get wet and I'm not the type of guy to dry my boxes. in the Dia-riki 930's they will bend out of log before my perfection loop to fly does. Yes ...perfection loop to fly!!!! try it... Im on a tangent here but people who probably have their tippet attached with a perfection loop will use an improved mono loop knot and claim its a little stronger. well, if you have a perfection loop up top mine as well use one on your fly. (i'd love to hear feedback about that, if you ever try it) One of my claims to fame is that im the first person i've ever heard of doing this...yawn.

straight ball with legs, nothin too it...Grizzly marabou's about it

here's the Shafted Stabber Craw Ball...you can do this as jsut a ball with some legs and it looks good, Wayne maybe this would be good for you in Chartreuse tied as small or as large as you can get it. nice fuzzy little balls with lots of action.

No...maybe a yellow estez ball with a little plume of barbed marabou...but, in my experience throw something in a carps face without spookin him and its on, usually. .there almost like bluegill, just harder to find and cast too. I'd bet cetain shades of yellow will work just fine and they may be partial to it ...hard for me to say. it may be helpful in murky water to get the fish's attention or where fed by corn....

Orange black brown and mixtures of... especialy with a crayfish... I just about never miss a fish with a good presentaiton with black, brown/red (orange) so I never really try to get more crasy than that in my personal fishing life. I tied up some purple flies for my site...and people want purple, do fish? Maybe i should experiment more. As a general rule small and black/brown rocks for all around every species fishing. Had something like 8 species in one day on "my creek" with a Size 6 black fly. oh yeah...bead chain baby! i think the sound of the fly hitting the water is just right....not spooky but inviting.

Here I go again..serial posting. I think some of you may find this pattern quite effective and simple. it typically produces a smaller sized backstabber, use your scrap saddle hackle or schlappen for this one. cut the thick shaft to fit just inside the hook bend. I lay the feather flat on the bench and smash the thick base where the feather is tied in, to aid tie in and to keep the feather in the right plane when tied down, cement helps keep the feather in place. Though i haven't fished this fly much, i had one tied up that was just tits. The wiggle action was so pronounced! I've never had a fly move like that one(can't guarantee same results with these). I Took a large grass carp on it, then i made an impulsive cast and wrapped it around an overhead tree and couldn't get it back! add some rubber or crystal flash for antenae/baitfish sparkle. No brainer. I will do another puff ball style with Grizzly marabou palmered(or any feather you want) instead of dubbing, and show that in this thread later. Thread: 210 Hook: Saltwater (for the monsters, long life) Eye: XL bead chain Body: Red/Black/Brown/Green/clear sparkle yarn mixed Wing: Thick Marabou shaft of saddle/soft hackle/schlappen(the red/orange one is grizzly marabou, the dark olive/brown is shclappen)

I think I have a Thompson model A, at least 20 years old if not more. It was given to me by the guy who worked down the hall from my mother when i was about 13, along with enough tools and feathers that I still have some of the saddle hackle capes today!. I might not have started tying if it weren't for him. So if your reading Mr. Merker...Thank you!

Last one for the Day. I put a weed guard on cus this ones goin in my box! thread: 210 red Hook: Gamakatsu sl45 size 4 eyes:XL bead chain Body: Black and Red yarn blended Wing/Claws: Grizzly marabou Shank , burnt orange Head: Estez , some shade of green Guard: 12? or 16 lb mason hard Cement: Hard as Nails

Ever tried this one upside down? not sure it would work but might be handy if it did

Nice tie, looks killer especially that dark photo from the top. Gives me an Idea or two

Wish i knew how the legs were done on the real Befus Swimming Nymph, if anyone has any advice I'd love to hear it. Im no longer a fan of hook point down flies so i gave this one a try with beadchain. Its a little bit of a _itch. Not perfect but fishable. Wrench and Wayne...first fly with the Hard As Nails...looks pretty good to me. (not sure if its dry though) Hook: Dai-Riki #930 size 6 Thread:210 brown or olive Eyes: XL bead chain Tail: Crayfish Orange Rabbit Flash: Crystal flash: rootbeer/orange? Dubbing: yarn and crayfish orange rabbit Legs: crayfish orange rabbit Wing Case: Brown Turkey /hard as nails over top

Couple hours later and things are looking up. More comfortable with these images. Now how long will this last?

utoh! Someones in trouble....Looks like i've got some organizing and cleaning to do. How embarassing

Second that! Someday I hope to have my own personal fly shop organized in the room next to where i tie, which will still look like one giant ball of crazed dubbing blown up all over everything. Bighorn, you've given us all something to aspire to, even if it not realistic, thank you sir

Got the Sally Hanson hard as nails Clear and xtreme wear in black...all set now. it does smell fierce though, hope that doesn't linger. Appreciate all the feed back...all good advice...I will let you know what i think of it as soon as i hit the bench again. sure it will be nice..clear and strong

Looks like a smallmouth buffalo. Nice One!

Yeah, thats funny. That would explain it. I've cast and cast and cast to these fish even snagging two which i thought had bitten only to find the fly slightly outside the mouth. what are the chances of snagging two fish within 1/2 inch of their mouths on the same day, while drifting a fly in current? I must be good! and then out of the blue one hits a size 6 damsel type pattern and a few days latter another...I can't explain why these fish are the way they are but, like we've both said, "I don't care" From what you've said I'd kinda expect there to be some common carp around those area's, once you get the eye for them you can sorta tell the difference. Thats the biggest issue is finding fish...once you find them they will usually be there time and again. despite the Carp's supposed prevalance they can be hard as hell to find cus you gotta see them and not all places lend themselves to sight fishing, I've found both grass carp and common carp tend to have favorite hang outs. The grass carp will find a big tree on the bank with half its roots in the water. you may find 90% of the visible fish gathered in these spots. It may be the tree is dropping something...in which case you may find common carp and catfish underneath as well. anyhow i'll quit pointificating...keep your eyes open and good luck.

I've got some new cement from the fly shop...almost got the hard as nails..But for the time being I'm back to the trusty superglue, which has always done me well, soaks in and dries fast and hard. Apreciate the feed back guys.

Thank you for that...

Hello all, I recently got an order with a bunch of back stabbers which i don't usually tie, and they are on gamakatsu sl45 size 8! so small. This fly gives me a little trouble with the head. the technique i had thought was "correct" is less than satisfactory...I've always manualy whip finished but because of the 210 denier and my rough skinned fingers the thread gets all mussed up, so i've been using a whip finish tool. the method i have been using is to wrap to the back of the head and start the whipfinish wraps at the back and wrap forward....with this fly the eye gets crowded easy and i have a habit of using my fingernails combined with thread tension to force the head of the fly back. Im getting some thread slippage and mussy pile ups when i do this. Does anyone have the perfect whipfinish technique down pat. any video recomendations or writen explanations. I suppose i should start with the zimmerman backstabber demo... ...but if there is a master fly tyer around I'd love to get the low down. for now im just going to start at the back and wrap forward, or even in place a couple turns keepin everything towards the back of the head, and finish with ample cement, the last one i did like that turned out well. Just concerned about the whip finish comin undone with that techniqe. while were at it, I've never realy done much cementing but I'd like to produce the best prodoct possible...any recomendations for cement. brands..., should it be thin and added multiple times...that sort of thing. Thanks in advance. -Chris

MFU Missouri flish unit! great name wrench Hmm? sounds like some buffalo i tried to catch here on the meramec....are they really common carp? #1 most important thing is being able to see feeding fish! (allways have polarized glasses or stay home) wich lends itself to minimal trubidity or shallow water. My home waters are quite turb with minimal shallows so i SEE more grass carp because they tend to cruise and dwell at the surface, they may be more prevalent here but i'd estimate a 50/50 split on intuition. #2 is being stealth enough not to allert the carp prior to casting. You need to be able to watch the fish to some degree and feel them out leading too... #3 Getting a good cast. Here's where you feel the fish out. It may take casting to more than one fish to get a feel for the mood and typical behavior of the fish in the area, their tollerance for things hitting the water, how hard is it to spook them, how allert are they. Some fish are so busy rooting you have to put the fly right on the nose...others cruise the shallows and sense a fly 2 ft away. I would start with a size 6 or 8 fly, your fish may take larger flies, but from what i do...i fish smaller flies always with bead chain eyes and often with weedguards. A small crayfish is ideal. the fish must either sense the fly hitting the water or have the fly draged or stripped within a foot or so usualy. you need to find that happy place between getting the fish's attention and spooking it. an you do that by casting and observing the fish's reactions to your presentation. In my experience a feeding carp is a feeding carp...put something in front of him that he see's/senses and he's going to eat it if it doesn't scare him. And they are actually not that hard to catch IMO if you can see and cast too them. 10 ft leader is fine and i typicaly fish 20lb flouro ...if i go lighter i get broke off...but your situation may be different. # presentation ...anywhere form almost no action to a medium pased strip can work. you need to judge the fish...If it hasn't seen you fly a couple quick "crayfish" scoots and then rest, prefearably just ahead of the fish. you may be able to see whats going on or you may have to feel your way through it. If you think the fish is investigating , about to take, or taking the fly. i go to a very slow alost imperceptible stip....1-2 inches per second, this keeps out slack...gives the fly life, and you can feel the take and set the hook if the fish does't do it for you, without taking the fly away from the fish. if you get nothing i will do another couple short crayfish bursts 3-6inc strips, pause and repeat. try try and try again. They may be selective, but i've never encountered this. usually they are eager... you may need to try larger flies, puffyer flies, brighter flies etc. but a feeding carp will almost always take a crayfish from my experience. I'm thinking your fishing to buffalo but i could be totaly wrong. buffalo i havent figured, i've cast to them 1000's of times totaly ignored and then one will take a fly...why? i have no idea what those fish are about and i don't care anymore. Hope that helps a little, its tough at first....but #1 find feeding fish....thats the real hunt, I'd love to hear where you see the carp at, river, lake, stream, and names are nice too:) also, if you can find a mulberry tree late spring early summer you in luck big time. peace

yes.Mason Hard Mono..8-12 lb test on size 8 12lb-16lb on size 6, but you can use store bought.mono..experiment around if you want. the weedguard is my secret weapon fyi everyone. Can't tell you how indespensible they are, I hardly ever lose a fly or a fish.. gives you the confidence to put your favorite fly deep without much fear of losing it.