Wild Trout

[Flyflinger]

Just out of curiosity....Do trout eggs survive in the Meramec? If not, why? It just seems to me that with all of these cold water streams the Missouri has, that trout should be able to spawn naturally and produce a healthy wild population.

Of course I am no expert, which is why I posed the question. I know the eggs survive in places like Crane Creek, Blue Springs Creek...but why not the Current or Taneycomo?

Any fish biologist out there?

[stlfisher]

I am not sure about the Meramec, but I caught a 7 inch trout out of the Current last weekend...so I am pretty sure there is a small amount of spawning, but that is certainly the exception and not the norm.

Good question's though.

[jdmidwest]

On the Current and the Meramec, Wild Eggs did not survive well in the rivers. Biologist's have set out egg boxes in the past and have not had any luck. In the 11pt, I think spawning is successful in the Greer Spring branch. Some of the smaller streams have some success too. It is all about the water temp and quality.

[Terry Beeson]

Great question and I'd like to hear from someone who is something of an expert - biologist or similar - for an answer.

I'm certainly no expert, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express...

There are many factors that contribute to the success of a trout hatch and when you say trout, you have to be a bit more specific. We know that Browns have a successful spawn in the Little Red and other tail waters and Rainbows have to be stocked. We also know that the very opposite is true in many of the Missouri streams. So why does this occur? What's the difference?

JD has only a portion of the answer - water temp and quality. But there are a lot of other factors that come into play.

[Outside Bend]

I've caught what looked to be wild fish in both the Current and Meramec, and I've seen redds and associated spawning activity in both streams. My guess is there's some natural recruitment, but probably not enough to maintain those fisheries.

[Flyflinger]

I've caught what looked to be wild fish in both the Current and Meramec, and I've seen redds and associated spawning activity in both streams. My guess is there's some natural recruitment, but probably not enough to maintain those fisheries.

I have no doubt that the stock fish do spawn....but I think the eggs die quickly. I'm trying to find our why? Why do rainbows survive wild in the Blue Springs Creek...but not in the larger waters...as far as I know.

[Kayser]

I have caught several rainbows out of the current that I would call wild fish. They have no scarring on their noses or fins, all of the fins are pointed, and not damaged or gnarled, and the colors are spectacular. Fins are red/pink with white tips. Not to mention they pull a lot harder than the hatchery fish. Also, I managed a 4" rainbow and a 3" brown (yes, measured, and yes, I can tell the difference) from a riffle below Baptist Camp. I'm not quite sure about the brown, but I'm pretty sure the rainbow may have been stream born. As far as the brown, there is a VERY low survival of eggs in Ozark spring-fed streams. I think it was like 1% in hatchery trials. But that's from egg to fry, not to fingerling. So by those numbers, it's not impossible for a brown to be stream-born, but I would compare it to winning the lottery. Ten times.

Rob

[jdmidwest]

Hatchery fish are almost always marked, they burn off a fin to keep track of them. Fish flush out of the parks during floods and smaller fish are almost always mixed in with the stockers when they move them around. That is why you will see some in streams. MDC tends to stock a variety of sizes if they have a surplus from fingerlings to brood stock. Browns are stocked as fingerlings in the 6 inch range.

Any stream that supports both browns and rainbow always end up with predation of the smaller rainbows from the Browns. Has anyone ever seen any browns on redds in MO in the Current or Meramec? I have never seen any, usually always Rainbows.

[ozark trout fisher]

I have no doubt that the stock fish do spawn....but I think the eggs die quickly. I'm trying to find our why? Why do rainbows survive wild in the Blue Springs Creek...but not in the larger waters...as far as I know.

I think that trout need to spawn in streams that do not flood violently during spawning season. Blue Spring is a perfect example of a coldwater stream that usually doesn't suffer serious floods during spawning time and supports a viable wild trout population. Same with Little Piney- it often floods badly , but it has several small cold water tributaries that don't. Neither the upper Current or the Meramec have good spawning streams anywhere near the trout stocking points. The Meramec would have a fine spawning stream in Maramec Spring Branch, but unfortunately there is a rock dam at the lower end of the stream, and the rest of the river has been dammed up and channelized. But in it's natural state, I'm sure Maramec Spring would have been a fine spawning stream.

I can't say that I have ever caught a brown that I thought was wild here in Missouri. Not to say there aren't any wild browns in MO, but I'd bet money there isn't more than a few swimming around.

That said,I have caught a few rainbows that I am almost positive were wild from the Current River. They were all young of the year, and there hadn't been a flood the previous year during spawning season. There may be a correlation there. In fact, I have caught some larger fish that I believe to be wild (intact, white-tipped fins, and beautiful colors) in the Red Ribbon portion of the Meramec, but never young of the year. They probably swam all the way up from Blue Spring Creek or some other wild trout stream in the Meramec Basin.

I think, of all of the possibilities, the Current is the most likely to someday support a viable wild trout population, because the spring-time flooding isn't that bad along the Current. I think part of the problem there is just the vast amount of stocked fish crowding out the few wild ones, especially in the upper reaches of Montauk State Park, where some of the best spawning grounds would be. It would be interesting to see how the fishery would turn out if we turned off the hatchery faucet throughout the Current River Basin, and took down all the barrier dams. Not that I'm saying we should actually do it, but it would be interesting to see. I bet it would eventually develop into at least a fair wild rainbow trout stream, but I could be wrong.