Fishing Report / Shuffling

[MTM]

The first time I ever saw someone doing the Shuffle was in 1973 on Arm Strong's Sprinp Creek outside of Livingston Montana. It is not a very large stream but there were a lot of fish at the time. I remember wadding in and starting to fish and after about 5 minutes looking down and seeing about 8 or so fish right at my feet feeding on what I was kicking up. And yes I caught two of those fish. We got to talking about it that night and figured it wasn't the right thing to be doing and that was the last time I did it just to catch a fish. I did do it some years later while guiding a client. Hot day (90's) Bright sky's and few fish. He had caught 3 fish early but nothing after about 9 or so. At about 2 in the afternoon he said that no one could catch a fish on that creek at that time. I said I could and he said he would bet me $50.00 that I could not catch a fish in 30 minutes. Being a guide and needing the money. ($60.00 a day at the time) I said I would take that bet if he stayed were he was and I could walk just around the bend. He could see me from the waist up but not my feet. Yep I did the shuffle and caught a fish in about 5 minute's. He was beside himself and he did pay up. I didn't tell him how I did it for about 5 years. He became one of my good clints and I guided him for many years. We still get a laugh over that one. Haven't done it in all of these years now. Don't figure it right. Everyone thinks it started on the San Juan River. Nope it started in Montana on the spring creeks many years ago. And people were doing it here long before I did it. How many people wade the same areas over and over each and everyday? I think the stream is OK because there is so much that can't be wadded. I don't think a lot of people even do it? I could be wrong but I fished a lot of river's over a lot of years and I can remember seeing it being done about 3 or 4 times at the most? Like I said I don't do it and I do not think it is right but I don't like laws passed everytime I turn around either. Kind of like the Gun Laws, we have over 20 thousand of them that they never use but they are always trying to pass new one's??

Ron

[Danoinark]

Well, I said I would be quite about it...but here is another point. If its illegal then that would stop ALOT of people from doing it. Its that simple. If a shuffling law was promoted and when anglers became aware of it there is a good chance some would not 'want to break the law' because most people are (cliche here) law abiding citizens. This despite whether or not it is even enforceable. I mean you would always have some doing it, it's their nature. Just like you have some drivers who won't buckle their seat belts. You buckle your seat belt for two reasons, either you are thinking safety or you are thinking its against the law if I don't. Same with shuffling. You don't shuffle because its against the law or it's not good for the stream bed.

Simply said..if there was a law it would reduce the number of fishermen doing it, and that would have to be good for the fishery.

Dano

[jOrOb]

Lots of good points everyone. I see both sides to some extent. But, I have to believe that outlawing it will spiral. No, it isn't an issue on the White. Noone really shuffled on the White because it isn't productive. Fish don't congregate at your feet like they do on Taney. Also, I feel confident that I could get away with it on the White if I wanted, because the law doesn't prohibit me from walking around.

Someone likened this to gun laws and I agree. It started as assault weapons. Most sportsmen didn't say much because they don't care about full auto weapons. Heck, there were sportsmen that helped pass that legislation. Then it became high capacity weapons and again sportsmen weren't worried. We only need one round to kill one deer right! Then the anti gunners went after our shotguns. Sportsmen drew the line. Shotguns were obviously not the problem, and many very dedicated sportsmen carried one that would be considered illegal. So now it is all gone. High capacity weapons are available again. Imported assault weapons are back on the US Market.

So, where does this line get drawn?

Do we outlaw wading over ankle deep? Can we outlaw dragging your feet? Perhaps the law should outlaw fishing within your arms reach. Wouldn't that make catch and release interesting.

You cannot legislate common sense. I feel that if you try to legislate this, you will simply create a Brady Bill that will spiral until we end up doing away with it again and find ourselves back here.

Prove that shuffling causes damage to the eco system. Then prove that wading alone doesn't cause the same damage. If you can do that, then you might have an arguement for the law. If not, then you just create an arguement for no wading.

This isn't an issue on the White because noone cares enough to fight it. That won't be the case on Taney.

[MTM]

I agree with you jOrOb. Maybe if people are so worried about this why not just ask the state or go through a local club and ask if you can get some sign's made up asking people not to do this. You know something like "Be A Sportsman Don't Shuffle your Catch" Thank You. Then the name of the club.

Give people a chance to do the right thing before you go passing laws that may never work anyway. By the way I only know of a few streams that you can even do this on. I do not believe there are all that many in this country. I think I can name 5. Like jOrOb said were do you draw the line. Fish from the Banks???? Out of a boat????? Ron

[flip4bass]

In another topic I was reading about boats speeding by fishermen in the upper lake. Wonder what kind of bottom damage they do as compared to shuffling.....

This is a very good point. If shuffling is banned then would it also ban boats from the dam area. Trolling motors would easily be able to shuffle the bottom just as well. Put it into the water next to the bottom and turn it on high. That would cause the same problem. I am sure that boats would cause much more of a problem to the bottom of the river, expecially outboards. So if you say that shuffling is going to be illegal due to it tearing up the bottom wouldn't boats be next. I am sure fly fisherman would love not having to deal with boats, unless secretly they have already figured out that boats shuffle and didn't want to tell anyone. Uh-oh.

[rubicon31]

is it just me or has the shuffling topic been beaten to death?

[Phil Lilley]

road kill

[MTM]

Sorry about that I got in on the butt end of it. Ron

[gonefishin]

road kill

How many SHufflers does it take to eat a possum?