From the 11 point to Montauk....

[snap]

I spent the early part of the week fishing and floating the 11 point, then spent Thursday and Friday at Montauk. Saw hardly anyone fishing the 11 point, and Montauk had a nice group of fishermen and women. Had to work hard for fish in the afternoon starting at the bottom of the park and walking up river. Repeated the same routine mid Friday morning with better success. Had my son with me and he raised a good question..."why do so many people walk down river instead of upriver?"...I told him that I did know, I guess they don't know any better. Ended up with three nice 15 inch fish...the last two would not have been caught by walking down the river....able to sneak up on them and caught them facing and feeding, of course, upriver ....Does anyone else have any thoughts on walking up or down a river to fish??? Also, it seems that there are more women fishing than what I remember seeing years ago...that is good to see!!! It was my third trip to the park in the last two years and enjoyed it ... but for trout fishing...the 11 point is still my favorite...far less waders...a few jet boats...and more challenging!!!

[brittsnbirds]

Snap,

Back in my early days of fly fishing with my wife's cousin (Native American) in Montana, he instructed me to NEVER walk downstream fishing for trout. The reason was as you explained. It's common sense, they see you coming and they hide or lock up. Even though they are in a Trout Park they still have the instinct of survival. And one of their survival techniques is sight. The other thing he instructed was to walk the bank when you can. They feel the unnatural vibrations in the water. If I had to wade, I should do it slowly and in segments. Wait a minute or two before presenting the lure.

I agree with you. Walking up stream is definately an advantage!

[snap]

thank you britt...I was hoping someone saw it that way too. That also might explain why the fishing was tough that afternoon....many waders passing us from above. Where do you do most of your trout fishing nowadays???

[brittsnbirds]

I just noticed it is 103 degrees in the shade up here today. Not much to do but keep cool and talk about fishing.

Most of my trout fishing has been at Bennett. I went down last Thursday, stayed till Sunday then ran on over to Montauk (1st time). What a differance, it reminded me of Colorado in Missouri. I did Ok, considering I was trying to figure Montauk out. Took off outside of the park on the Current Monday afternoon, as several neighbors in the campground suggested. Long story short, I ended up hiking back to civilization at 1030 pm to get a ride to camp. The fuel pump went out on my '03 Chevy truck on a sand bar. I ended up getting a tow the next morning. Got it repaired at the Chevy dealership in Licking. At this point I was pretty much bummed. Probably would have felt a little better if the other guys that were coming down would have made it. So I loaded up and headed home.

I definately plan on going back but it is a 4 1/2 hr. trip for me! I have a couple other friends that want to fish the White River sometime. We will see.

[MTM]

I will have to disagree with others here. I fish down and across stream 95 percent of the time. I learned this while guiding on the Henry's Fork river in Idaho back in the late 60's. The trick is to not walk right on the bank's when going up or down stream but stay back a good 10 yards or so and see what is going on. If you come into the bank above the fish and keep low they will never see you. You may have to fish off your knees That is why I use basketball Knee pads over my waders a lot. Saves the wader's.

If rising I cast above and past the fish about two feet. As soon as the fly lands on the water I lift the rod tip stright up in the air and drag the fly into the feeding lane of the fish. Two Point's can be made here. 1) You get the fly over the fish on the firt cast every time when you learn how to do this and 2) you know were your fly is every time even if you are fishing a very small hard to see fly. This is becasue the fly will cause a "V" wake and you know the fly is at the point of that "V". When the "V" comes in line with the feeding lane of the fish just drop your rod's tip and throw a little slack to the fly and you are good to go. If you get no take just let the fly swing below and to the side of the fish before picking it up to cast it again.

One point here is that many people cast way to much. You do not need more than one false cast to fish any dry fly made. I normally will pick the fly up and recast it after the first back cast. This way your fly is on the water and not in the air all the time. The only time when I may make more than one back and forward cast is when I am trying to time the fishes rise. Other wise I lay it down on the first go. Never cast over the fish either. Always cast to the side or above the fish as far as possible. Then lay the fly down. If you cast over the fish or to close to it's lie you will of course take a chance on spooking the fish. Or having the spray off your leader and line spook the fish.

You can do the same type of thing when Nymph fishing just cast a bit farther upstream. Say 4 feet or so. This will give the nymph time to get down were the fish is. One other point is don't cast all the time. Take time out to watch the fish and if the fish does not take your fly after 3 or 4 tries change flies as you may have the wrong pattern on. If I know what is hatching I will have the flies on my chest patch ready to go. I will have an Emerger or two a Nymph of that fly and a couple of dry fly pattern's of that fly and a spinner. If the fish are working the hatch you expect one of those flies should work.

I have taught this to many people while guiding over the years and it does work well. You get the fly over the fish on the first cast and the leader and tippet is also above the fly because when you drag the fly it will swing around down stream of the tippet.

Give it a try some time and I think you will find it works very well. Just remember to stay low when moving in on the fish. If wading watch the wake you put off. Make sure it doesn't go over the fish. I bet a guy one time that I could get within my rods length of a rising fish. I did it and he was amazed. Just do not lift your feet when wading Scoot them along the bottom. That way you do not put out a wake and you will be amazed at how close you can get to fish. I was in waste deep water when I did this to. If in shallow water get on your knee's. Now I didn't say you could catch them by wadding so close LOL Ron

[Don]

I waded upstream only once before. It was in the catch and release area of Roaring River State Park and it happened because I didn't really know at the time where the proper accesses were located. I wasn't really successful at that point and I attributed that to the fact that I wasn't getting the proper drift. I usually like to cast between sideways and any angle facing and including directly downstream, mending line as neccesary. Wading upstream limits casting to sideways only. Casting ahead of yourself while wading upstream presents your flyline before your fly, I cannot mend the line. Although I do understand your perspective about sneaking up on the fish, I have always concentrated on presenting the fly before the flyline arrives. Any advice?

Thanks.....Don

[MTM]

Don if fishing upstream try to learn the curve casts. There is a left and right hand curve cast. That will keep your line away from the fish when fishing upstream. But it is still (In My View) Better to fish down to them and be a little sneeky LOL. There are several places on the net were you can get the curve casts. Just do a search.

You can also throw a stright line cast up and across to the fish but you will not get much drag free drift. There are sevearl other casts that will help you out. Like the puddle cast. There are several good books on casting that you might find in your local library. But my advise is for you to go to a FF meeting or a TU meeting and get some help from those folks. They normally have a few good casters in each club. It is always better to get someone to help you than it is to try it with a book. Learning with a book can be done , that is how I started. Being a good caster will up your catch rate by many fold. It is also fun to pratice casting at target's on your lawn or even in the local park. At times I use to pratice on the streams when fishing was slow. Not many will do that they think they have to fish all day LOL. But it pay's off big time. Ron

[Gavin]

I use both upstream and downstream presentations depending on the situation, but when I wade fish, I head upstream first because the current will work to your advantage on a long wade back to your car. Cheers.

[brittsnbirds]

I've been re-thinking my presentation after reading MTM's posts. I may have to try another technique. One thing did cross my mind. I've noticed in some trout parks when you are wadding, kicking over stones, the trout downstream lineup behind you. If they are feeding, as I think they are, then why not wade downstream. Kind of chumming them into a feeding frenzy?

I've been re-thinking my presentation after reading MTM's posts. I may have to try another technique. One thing did cross my mind. I've noticed in some trout parks when you are wading, kicking over stones, the trout downstream lineup behind you. If they are feeding, as I think they are, then why not wade downstream. Kind of chumming them into a feeding frenzy?

[snap]

I guess there are many different ways to catch and fish for trout. We seem to find what works best for us and then do it. I grew up as a redneck fisherman fishing the little creeks and Mississippi River around the Ste Genevieve area. We would do whatever we could to catch whatever might bite. Fishing the White River in Arkansas below the Norfork is nearly impossible to fly fish....the old reliable seems to work great for me, on the White, on the 11 point, and in the trout parks....a minnow or a pattern of power eggs bouncing on the bottom with the current...only fishing the fast water!!!...minnows seem to work the best for large fish...if that is what you are wanting to catch!!!