Wayne SW/MO

What are the dimensions of the big one?

Tim I look at things such as this stat. chg unc. 2003 2.20 0.16 2004 1.58 0.06 2005 2.41 0.11 That seems to be a big change and it apparently happened without mans intervention. What happened in '92 or 99', why the big drop in those two years? I haven't seen anything yet to convince me we aren't putting all of our eggs in the proverbial basket and it's the wrong one. We have a plan to replace carbon burning vehicles with one that runs on carbon burning electricity, we have a self proclaimed prophet flying around in a big jet telling us we need to stop burning carbon producing fuel. Willie Nelson travels all over and doesn't need a big jet and in fact burns vegetable oil, but I'm suppose to listen the guy who wants me to do as he says, not as he does. It's all about money spent in all the wrong places.

I see I failed to include the link. http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/trends/global.html If you look at the yearly data you see spikes and if you look at this one, which claims to go back 800K, you see big spikes. http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/trends/history.html So while I have never said the globe isn't getting warmer, or that mankind has never had an impact, it does appear from these figures from the scientific community that there have been other periods of large increases that we know weren't a result of man. All from volcanic action? Even if you buy the whole idea of man and man alone as the villain, we're still getting screwed because in spite of pouring more money than we have into halting the trend, and little into surviving the change, we have gotten know where. We ignore real opportunities to make some difference while we take some slow boat path that will never catch up and make a difference, but will satisfy political obligations or pad some pockets. The electric car in 2012 is an example of the ridiculous attempts to make a change. Run out of cut and paste?

I'm sure you're right, I was confident in the 20 year statement however. It's rare with new tents coming out every year and if you break a pole you may or may not be able to replace it. I know the Timberline will stand up to storms, can be put up by one person and most can enter and leave without crawling in the 4. The 6 is nice, but it is only made in the Outfitter now and cost a lot of $.

If you take a look at these figures for both global and Mauna Loa CO2 data you don't see the smooth upward swing that many try to point out as proof positive. I see an erratic lift with some decreases that need to be explained if man is the cause. If there is any consistency it is that man's output doesn't waver that much from year to year.

PM eric 1978, he can help you.

If you're talking about the immediate area we're not blessed with ponds , I wish we were. For the kids the park in Ozark and the accesses on the Finley and the James would probably work. A big portion of Fellows lake is very assessable on the north side. If it is as low as I imagine it is, you can walk the bank farther then you'll want to.

Isn't there one on the upper reaches of the NFOW, or Bryant?

Many of you want to ignore the debate about how much influence man is having and how much is a natural event. Man made or not there's been little to show for the efforts that effects the average person. Al Gore becoming a billionaire using the debate doesn't help humanity. Sooner or later, for richer or poorer, the attention is going to have to turn to survival in a warmer environment.

If you ever get a case of giardia you'll wish you didn't have bowels, for months!

They aren't cheap but it's hard to beat the Eureka Timberline. They haven't been around for 20 years because they're a so so tent.

Where are you?

That's a tough question, Missouri is a big state. Go to the MDC site and find the Atlas. You will be able to search specifically for fishing ponds by county.

My guess would be the creek, but only because your method sounds like it needs the bait on the bottom. Rip rap is a magnet to fish because it has the same qualities as a brush pile.

I got to thinking that in spite of having a lot of honeysuckle around, I don't see honey bees? I wonder why that is, not enough pollen in the area?

That's a lot of trouble. I take a purifier, but for a bunch of scouts i believe I would make do with the tablets. You could always supplement by using any fire left to boil water and then leave it to cool until morning.

My first thought was crawdads in Mic's case, but they leave marks, turtles generally chomp down and mash the bait up before leaving the hook behind. Cats will bump bait and mess with it, but generally take it eventually, but it's hard to tell. I've seen them do it in clear water, but it's hard tell exactly what they're doing.

Love honey and we would be in trouble without bees. I have to ask though, will that rope fence keep anything out, LOL.

I've seen a lot of big fish caught sight fishing, but never one snagged. I have seen some nice size fish snagged in the morning assault however. I think sight fisherman is the wrong term for what is implied. I sight fished a lot in the afternoons, drifting a very small nymph at fish in a lie hoping one would take. Lunker hunters target only big fish and will stay on one fish until he takes and is caught or the angler gets tired. Of all the ones I knew, or knew of, it was rare for most to keep a fish unless it was really exceptional. It isn't hard to figure out why there aren't more big fish, just look off the Rock bridge right after the whistle. In decades past you couldn't see the bottom there and at the whistle big fish would start coming out of the hole and head for the gut piles on the hatchery side. On the other end the hatchery just can't raise them big enough in the time allotted. What I would like to see is everything above the dam catch and release. The hatchery could probably get by with stocking it once every 2 weeks or a month and put the others down stream. There is and always will be a bunch, a big bunch, of fishermen who want get their 4 leave.

I agree with Wrench. Cats like to be where the food comes to them and when the flow is low it will be in front of the dams where the current is slow enough to pile up some food. When the current is strong they will go behind the dams where they don't have to fight the current and the food will be push into the eddy.

If you have a map, I would check out the flats where the old town of Faifield was and KK island. The KK has always been popular for all the temperate bass.

There have been a lot of changes at Bennett, some good some questionable. One big problem that is no obvious is that fact it is only about half a s deep as it was 3 or 4 decades ago and they say the spring outlet is less also. It is what it is and I'm not confident that it will ever improve, but holding the line could be considered a win. The MDC has done a much better job then DNR in the overall protection of the focus of the park, trout fishing.

But you said anyone who buys a fishing license would slide, so fishermen get a by. I suspect that fishermen and kids, fishermen defined as someone with a license, would make up the majority of floaters. I agree with the multiple approaches. You have at least 3 agencies in charge of some aspect of the rivers, the DNR, MDC, and MOHP. You could even slide MODOT in there also. So who get s the money and for what? I see and have seen for decades 3 serious threats. The largest is is riparian damages and destruction and that would be in the hands of lawmakers at this point because it is mostly on private land. Pollution and overuse which is the DNR's responsibility. The MDC's responsibilities don't go much beyond the fisheries and protection of the natural resource. They are minor players in overall scheme of protecting the rivers. I lived very close to a popular float river and watched it go from overcrowded at times to a circus. I wish someone could film the launch at the 64 access on the Niangua around 10 AM Saturday morning, mid summer. I guarantee most on here would be very surprised at what they saw. The real problem is in getting enough interested people to campaign long enough and hard enough to make changes in a few laws and heavy enforcement of others. If that requires more money then the legislature will have to hash that out. If you're not familiar with the battle over gravel mining and the beating down that our side took on that one, take a look and you'll see how monumental the fight will be to protect the rivers. The unruly individuals that plague some rivers could care less about them, they see them in simple terms, an isolated place where they can be a moving target with virtually no law enforcement able to catch them as it now stands. Law enforcement can help by cutting down on litter and making the rivers a comfortable place for those that do care, and would support protection a place to float and a reason to care.

Sorry stlfisher, but there are problems with your logic. But they are paying, remember the 1/8th cent sales tax and the accesses it has made possible? I would hate for it to go down next time it comes up because people say they are already paying for a float license. Isn't this already being done? There have been signs telling people not to leave plastic can ties, cans and bottles in the streams for decades, but you can only reach so many and then you have to go hands on. The bottle law is a good example. You can say I'm a cynic, but I've been around these waters for a long time and the big boost in trash and unruliness has followed the overcrowding. Cut the numbers and add some law enforcement and that will help. Many of the other problems need to go to other agencies, but many have been brought to battle and been defeated by other self interests with more money. Like it or not, money drives most of the DNR actions.

Mic I have never tried it with cats, no reason, just haven't. I don't know that it would make much difference though because it underwater shots of cats fooling with bait they don't seem to take it in their mouth and spit it out. I would however think that a cat would get hooked the normal way. I've caught quite a few cats on my carp rigs using flavored corn. The rig is set up as a slip weight, but it doesn't slip until a swivel is pulled from a tube like piece. Hitting that weight sinks the hook before being released from the tube device. The reason for the big weight is twofold, one is to offer enough resistance to drive the hook home in a carps tough lip and second to cast a mile, well maybe a half mile. I've found that a 2oz is enough to sink the hook and cast far enough around here. It's really not hard to have some really good days with a little planning. Bait ahead of time and fish with a rig that doesn't miss many fish is about all it takes. I've had some make me really uncomfortable trying to thumb a baitcaster, they don't call them the Golden Bones for nothing.