hank franklin

Wayne, we're country boys who don't take kindly to a traffic jam when we got the canoe on the truck. About all you can do when encountered with such conditions is write a country song. Regarding Clifford Keith, I suppose he'd be relation to whoever Keith Bluff is named after? We camped at the foot of that bluff a few years back. Nice spot.

"If I could only get through Lebanon...." That's all l remember. No doubt about it: There's no worse trial or tribulation for the stream angler than trying to get through Lebanon at 5 p.m. on a Friday when you're supposed to be on the Niangua River. Sometimes I feel like I'm STILL trying to get through Lebanon. On the topic of shuttles, why don't you climb that bluff accross from Barclay CA and then run Magnolia Road all the way back to Bennett? It's only 7 miles.

Call Yellow Cab out of Lebanon. They'll set you up.

Okay, y'all convinced me. No canoe. Private shuttle out of Scott's ain't such a bad deal. Have done it before. And yes Al, I'm talking about putting in at Woodson K Woods (Hwy 8) and paddling down to the spring and then going from there. Have done it a few times but not in a while. Low water above the spring could be a pain too. Alternate idea: Can you wade up to Dry Fork Creek from the Suicide / Cardiac access? In my recollection the stream is pretty deep at Suicide which would probably mean traversing the north bank quite a while before eventually crossing over to the south bank. I'm thinking about maybe backpacking in, camping at Dry Fork confluence and then wading back the next morning. Just some thoughts. Any advice appreciated. I love that hole just below the Dry Fork confluence. Several years ago, early 90's maybe, there was a huge scour hole there IIRC. All sorts of fish in there. Last time I went through, probably 2000 or so, the hole was not nearly as deep and pronounced. Wonder what it looks like now.

Okay, so Suicide and Cardiac are different? It's been a while since I been there. So, can you wade all the way from Suicide / Cardiac up to Dry Fork Creek? I remember having trouble getting much beyond Cardiac last time I was there, but that might have been a high-water period. I don't like those last couple miles above Scott's. I'd just as soon take out at Cardiac and do a private shuttle with two vehicles, assuming that lugging a canoe up Cardiac / Suicide is within the realm of possibility.

I'd like to float from the Spring to Cardiac over T-giving weekend. It's gotta be possible to pull a boat up the bluff with two guys. Anybody ever done it? Any advice? Thanks....

Lilley, the initiative petition process is relatively new in Missouri. IIRC, only about half of the states allow it. I too am thinking it might not be such a good idea anymore. Either that, or the criteria to qualify needs to be made more strict (i. e. require many more signatures than are required now). The effect of the initiative petition process we have now is to let the hard and difficult issues up to voters, via initiative petition, and not the legislature. The cigarette tax is the best example. By all "best practices" definitions, Missouri's cigarette tax should be higher. Not 80 cents, but certainly more than 17 cents. Missouri has serious health care needs that can't be funded without a tax increase. Many of those needs are due to smoking. Taxing cigarettes makes sense to fund that. The problem is, no one in the legislature has the gonads to make the hard but sensible choice to raise cigarette taxes. I guarandamntee you a lot of politicians will vote for this in the privacy of the ballot box. But they'll keep singing the no taxes tune publicly. That's BS. I think the 80 cents a pack proposal is outrageous by the way. But if I'm one of the petition backers, why not? If you have to go to the trouble of putting the thing on the ballot, why not shoot high? So you've got bad law in the Legislature, which refuses to deal with it, and you got bad law in the initiative petition process, which doesn't lend itself to being particularly sensible.

3wt, I don't have any problem with your position. I wonder, do you oppose capital punishment? I do. I agree there's some situational ethics at play, and the issue can be murky. But the following line from the Amendment is what my point is based on: (2) No human blastocyst may be produced by fertilization solely for the purpose of stem cell research. You start creating lives and then killing them for the purpose of research = bad. Take lives that are not going to live and then use them for some "greater good"? Acceptable in my book. Very dicey ethically, I agree. But once the genie is out of the bottle, you can't ban it. If I was a doctor, would I pursue this research? No way. I'd stay out of that game. But as a government make it illegal? Can't do it. I really don't have any problem with people voting against the amendment. I personally have no strong feeling for the amendment either way. It'll be a tough vote tomorrow. I hate to take a pass on an issue but on this one I just might.

Yr comment is why I say at its heart it's an economic development issue. Business X won't do business in your town if an alderman might pass a law outlawing it after the fact. Stem cell R & D investment money won't come to Missouri if there's not a law protecting it in the first place. The stem cell business couldn't get a law through the legislature so they went the initiative petition route instead, putting it on the ballot. That's all this is really about.

I believe abortion should be illegal, except in some cases. I believe stem cell research should be legal, except in some cases. Amendment 2 actually criminalizes "unethical" stem cell research. What's the difference between abortion and stem cell research? Abortion serves no greater good whatsoever. Stem cell research however has the potential to serve a much greater good. What if we had outlawed atomic bomb research in 1941? We'd all be speaking Russian or Deutsch. The genie is out of the bottle with stem cell research, and we need to be on the cutting edge of it. To ban it would only invite others to use, or mis-use, it at their pleasure, and we would be at their mercy. It's medical research with dicey ethics. No question. But to outlaw it? To me that's extremely short-sighted.

Both sides are distorting the issue, but the worst distortion is this assertion that taxpayer money will fund it. Show me where the amendment says that. Show me the dollar amount. Show me the funding source. Show me the bill in the legislature that authorizes it. Show me how the Republican legislature and governor are going to pass a bill that funds stem cell research. It's crazy. It's an economic development issue folks. The stem cell business needs assurances that the research will remain legal in Missouri. The investment money will go elsewhere if the amendment fails. A no vote won't ban stem cell research in Missouri. It will only assure that the R & D goes elsewhere. The practical effect of a no vote is to ban, or at least strongly discourage, stem cell research in Missouri. But the research will remain legal elsewhere in the U.S., and in the world. If therapies are invented in France 10 years from now, therapies that will cure some dreaded disease, are we prepared to say no to that in Missouri? The genie is out of the bottle, folks. The research will go on somewhere. It's a question of if we want to participate, or not.

I'm just saying it's the pro-life (or anti-abortion, if you prefer) constituency that's leading the opposition to Amendment 2. And the pro-life vote is overwhelmingly Republican. My point is I wonder how many of the Amendment 2 opponents understand the degree of GOP support. My feeling is a lot of the rank and file Amendment 2 opponents would be surprised to know that Blunt is against them on this one.

It's a pro-life issue, and the pro-life vote is overwhelmingly Republican. The last 2 years have seen exclusive Republican control in Missouri yet what pro-life legislation have we seen? Why not a move in the legislature to ban stem cell research? Why not? Because the supposed "pro-life" politicians will buckle when there's money involved. The big-time GOP money people are all behind this. Last thing a GOP legislator wants is his feet held to the fire on a stem cell vote. HIs constituency likely is against it, but the GOP leadership is for it. No way in hell you'd see such a dicey political issue get to the floor.

I wonder if the opponents of Amendment 2 realize that it has big-time Republican support, including Gov. Matt Blunt. And if those who suggest this issue be left to the elected officials, and not the state constitution, are willing to take the Republican governor to task on this one.

Interesting topic. I've never been on the Sprinng and obviously don't plan to any time soon. My only input would be: Don't stop with a message board posting. Write letters to any law enforcement authority you can think of, from the locals on up to state. It DOES make a difference. You can't expect instant results but you can start things moving in the right direction. Don't just make phone calls or informal contact either. Put it in writing. Send it to local police, sheriff, state conservation, state representatives, senators, etc. Try the media too. A letter to the editor can put your neck out there but it can also have real impact. Off my soapbox. Good luck down there.

I'm thinking about an overnight on Bryant Creek yet this month. Never been there, not sure what to expect. I imagine the water level is very low. How would you folks rate the Bryant vs. the Middle Current for the best smallmouth action this time of year? We're looking for a new stream stretch with good fishing, good floating. Appreciate the input... Hank

Thinking of doing an overnight Akers to Pulltite. Anybody floated this stretch? I've heard it doesn't fish particularly well (looking for smallmouth, don't care about trout) but also heard that it doesn't get the aluminum hatch a lot of other sections get. I'll have my kids along and want to avoid the drunks. Any thoughts? Thanks.

Is MoDOT replacing the bridge there? Why would the dozer be in the creek? It might have actually had a legitimate reason to be there. I'm not taking sides, just saying. If I saw a dozer in the creek I'd try to get an idea why it was there. Whose name was on it? Was there a trailer nearby? I wouldn't call DNR until I'd made a few calls in the local area. There may be a good reason for it to be there and the work may in fact have been permitted. Of course, it may not have been. But I wouldn't make allegations until I knew the whole story.

Nothing against the Current but if you're looking for a beautiful two-night trip you oughta consider the Jacks Fork. It should be at prime floating level this weekend and fishing should be good too. A good two-night option is Prongs to Bay Creek or Alley Spring.

I would second Tom's advice on floating during the week and STRONGLY RECOMMEND avoiding the Current on summer weekends. If you have to do a weekend, get out as early as possible and you can partly beat the rush.

I'll add my two cents. If you're after trout only, put in at Baptist and go as far down as Akers. Water levels in July could make for some inconsistent floating, especially with a loaded canoe, but the abundance of good trout water is worth it. Cedargrove on down offers more consistent floating but the trout numbers are going to be more dependent on when the most recent stocking is. If you go below Akers you're looking at more smallmouth than trout in my experience. Having said this, there's a lot of people on this board with much more experience with Current River trout water than I.

I haven't been down to the Black River but Bob Todd in the latest River Hills Traveler says the river is in pretty good shape but effects from the dam breach are still noticeable. Fishing apparently is pretty good. Traveler has been an excellent source for Black River and Johnson's Shut-Ins info following the disaster.

Gavin, I floated the JF in March from Prongs to Bay Creek and the river was at app. 140 cfs (Mt. View gage). Just a bit of dragging between Prong's and Buck, from Buck down was fine. I would think 63 cfs is gonna be a problem however. I believe Al in an earlier post said 100 cfs was about the line between good floating and lots of dragging. You might look in the JF forum. You do get a little extra water from Blue Spring, so maybe putting in there would be the ticket.

How long is the canoe? What kind of seats? How heavy? I'm definitely interested. Wayne, just got the specs from the OT website. 85 lbs. is a bit on the heavy side, and I don't like that wood bar in front of the stern seat. I imagine you could take that off. I like the 16-9 length. I'm interested. I don't suppose your price includes delivery?

Yeah, the old gage at Des Arcs needed 2.0 feet or better to make it floatable, according to the SP concessionaire (forget his name). The year I was there it was low so I waded. Hoping for a float this year. I'll check the Mo Whitewater site, hadn't been there.