Roaring River Veteran

I just received this from my state Representative and I thought you all would want to see it. 2008 rains affect 2009 trout stocking (w/pic) Stocking will be down 10 percent in most waters. JEFFERSON CITY–The effects of last year’s record rainfall continue to be felt a year later, with an announcement that the Missouri Department of Conservation will reduce trout stocking. 2008 was the wettest year in Missouri history, with nearly 6 feet of precipitation falling during the year in some areas and more than 12 inches of rain falling in less than 24 hours in others. Conservation Department Hatchery Systems Manager James Civiello said these torrential rains affected trout hatchery operations in several ways. The most significant impact came from the forced release of massive amounts of water from Table Rock Dam in Taney County. Prior to 2008, the most rapid release ever witnessed there was 31,000 cubic feet per second. Last year, the dam let as much as 47,500 cfs pass through turbines and flood gates. “Shepherd of the Hills Hatchery sits right below Table Rock Dam,” said Civiello. “The enormous volume of water pouring into Table Rock Lake forced the Corps of Engineers into record releases in June, and that created less-than-ideal water conditions for trout in our facility.” Civiello said the temperature of water flowing from Table Rock Lake through the hatchery reached 65 degrees at times. This is too warm to spawn trout eggs and keep hatched fish healthy. Water quality became an issue, too. As a result, the hatchery lost more than 30,000 pounds of fish to disease and parasites, compared to the normal annual loss of approximately 7,000 pounds. Most of these were 3- to 6-inch fish that otherwise would have gone to other hatcheries. In most years, Shepherd of the Hills Hatchery produces approximately 1.3 million trout for stocking and smaller fish for transfer to other hatcheries, where they are reared to stocking size. Last year the number fell to 1.1 million. Meanwhile, other hatcheries were experiencing rain-related problems, too. Bennett Spring Hatchery near Lebanon and Maramec Spring Hatchery near St. James both lost fish to floods that compromised water quality and washed fish out of rearing areas. To compensate for losses, hatchery managers “pushed” small fish, feeding them more to hurry their growth to the average stocking size of 12 inches. While this helped keep last year’s stocking near target levels, it amounted to borrowing fish from 2009. The hatchery system no longer has enough fish in the pipeline to keep up with this year’s stocking goals. Consequently, the Conservation Department plans to reduce stocking at Missouri’s four trout parks and most other waters by 10 percent. This includes trout management areas and Lake Taneycomo. Statewide, the cutbacks will result in stocking 180,000 fewer trout this year than expected. “We stuck with the traditional stocking level for opening day at the trout parks,” said Civiello. “Since then, however, we have been stocking about two fish per anticipated angler instead of the usual 2.25 per angler. We should be able to sustain that level of stocking 12-inch fish for the rest of the year.” One exception to the reduction is the trout stocking program at Fort Leonard Wood. Another is the winter trout fishing program at urban lakes, for which the Conservation Department buys fish from other hatcheries. Civiello said he hopes to return to normal stocking levels in 2010. He said the agency will continue to monitor hatchery inventories, trout tag sales and other factors and make adjustments to minimize the effect on stocking. Good luck and Good fishing RRV

I too agree with redbird. used properly litter is as good and safe as it gets I too grew up raising chickens and cattle and I don't have a problem with either. The question is weather this farm should be shutdown. In my opinion, they should not. They did it legally and to specs. Should the state have let them? I don't know I am not qualified to make that determination. That is something for the scientist to decide. Would I have approved it in its current location? Probably not. If you want to prevent it from happening again then by all means file to run for state office and if there are enough people who believe like you and you get elected then you can prevent it. Speaking up for nature is noble. They don't have a voice of their own, and they are God's creatures. But ultimately the thing that God loves most are his children, your fellow man, and I can't help but believe that someday we will all have to answer for the wrong we have done toward our fellow man. Ruining this families lives the lives of their children and their children's, children is something I'm not willing to answer for just because someone doesn't like the smell or they are afraid that there is a chance that it might harm a fish. If you are willing to be judged for that then more power to you and good luck.

okay, obviously Aaron and I don't agree. He has some great ideals but in my opinion not very realistic. Who knows maybe he is right, maybe America will go on a diet. I also respect that he feels the need to stand up for nature, but my question is where was he when the Ozbuns were getting the permit and getting permission from their neighbors? who later changed their minds. Where was he and the opponents while they were building? But now 2 years later everyone shows up to try to shut them down. Everyone wants them to shut down a 500,000+ dollar chicken farm. and who is going to make those payments if they are closed down. When they lose their family farm and everything they have worked for and hoped to give their children, because they can't make the payments, can they come live with you? Has anyone been down to see the location of the farm? I just got back. I made a special trip to see where the farm was so that I could see how terrible it is. Truth be known it was fairly hard to find. It sure appears to be closer to 2 miles out of the park by my odometer. If my odometer is accurate there are chicken farms closer just off of hwy 112 going toward Seligman and a couple that are closer as the crow flys on washburn prairie going toward Cassville. Aaron, If you want to stop them from spreading it on fields due to run off I will get behind you. If you want to keep them from feeding it to cattle and hogs I will get behind you on that too. But if you want to shutdown a farm that was done by the books, then I will have to disagree with you. If you want to make a difference and keep this from happening again then call your congressmen and senators. Get the laws changed. If they won't do it then punish them by voting them out of office. Run against them and stand on your platform, but don't punish a family with a modern day witch hunt just because they have neighbors who know how to raise a bigger stink than a chicken farm. okay I'm throwing away the soap box now.......... RRV

Lilly, thanks you are right. It isn't the problem. My point was that it is hauled off therefore the litter isn't there to runoff therefore the watershed issue is mute. On another note a lot of litter is sold to feed mills who make cattle feed out of chicken litter, there is one in Butterfield. If the old adage of you are what you eat is true and cows eat chicken litter and we all eat cows................ I would be willing to bet that beef will get a lot closer to your mouth than the water from RR so why aren't you concerned about what they are feeding cows?????? Many cities are dumping waste in to the streams. Springfield and James River comes to mind. Cassville and Flat Creek also come to mind. I don't here you complaining about that. When all of you that live in cities that dump their waste into streams start bagging your own waste and incinerating it so not to pollute the water table, you will know how a chicken farmer feels when they have to bury dead chickens or put in an expensive concrete compost and collect chicken litter and haul it off so not to be fined by the state. Then someone gets a lawyer and tells you that your incinerator is polluting the air and that expensive incinerator turns into a lawn ornament. Then you lose your livelihood because you can't incinerate things for a living anymore. if you want to put a chicken farmer out of business, eat more beef......... oh wait we know what they eat too.......... The problem is people believing the crap a lawyer puts out and thinking it is the Gospel. Then using that Gospel to ruin someone Else's life. For anyone who has never been thru a stats class, you can make statistics say anything you want. Then add to that the old adage of don't believe anything you read and only half of what you see, take into account that you are reading and seeing what a bunch of lawyers put together. Then wonder how much is true. If you want to talk about watershed. Look at the chicken processor, Georges in Butterfield. It isn't far from where the water in RR was found to come from and it pumps out thousands of gallons of contaminated water each day. No body is complaining about them??? If the state wants to regulate the use of fertilizer because it harms water quality then I will listen, but It should be left up to studies done by qualified personnel and not a lawyer or a person who moved in here with an ax to grind. that's worth 4 more cents.

I do not know the Ozbuns other than by name. But being from the Cassville area, growing up on a farm and working at Roaring River for several years I have an opinion on this subject. My biggest problem is that the litter doesn't stay at the farm. It is cleaned up and hauled off. It is typically sold to farmers to spread on their fields. Therefore, the watershed argument is a non-issue. According to dye tests done by the corp several years ago the water that runs thru Roaring River comes from the Exeter and Washburn prairie area. There are several Chicken farms in those areas. In addition The cattle farmers in those areas spread turkey and chicken litter on their fields for fertilizer. I wonder where that goes? Additionally, they have a permit from the state. They did everything by the book. Right or wrong they did what they needed to do to build it legally and now a neighbor who moved in here from another state and bought a 1 acre plot 1/2 mile away wants to tell them how to run a farm that has been in their family for years. If they don't like it they should go back where they came from...... Just my 2 cents.

I am in the market for a new climbing treestand. I have owned a couple of Summits and loved them, they are very comfy but they are a bit heavy. I have owned an API, Which was a nice stand, but not as nice as the summit. I have also owned a couple of others that were junk. I have narrowed my search to the Summit Titan and the Lone Wolf Alpha climber. The Titan is new for 2008 but I believe the Lone Wolf has been out for a couple of years. Does anyone have experience with either of these? Thanks RRV

hey perch, a quick formula that I have heard over the years is 3lbs for the 1st 19 inches and 1lb per inch after that. That is a good healthy fish. if he is fat he might be a bit heavier and if he is skinny a bit less but it is easier than trying to take time to measure girth and setting on the bank for 10 minutes trying to remember the formula and calculating it in your head. That formula would make your fish 13.25lbs Nice fish by the way. Good luck and good fishing RRV

Whack'em is right on. Use a slow presentation. The bite after dark has been really slow for us lately. The best bite has been the last couple hours of daylight. Good luck and good fishing. RRV

Jaybird and I took out about 6:30 from the upper end(eagle rock, big M area) got into a nice topwater bite right away. We caught several dinks on top but when we threw swim baits, spoons, and other various lures under the top action we caught several nice fish. We had 4 keepers in the first hour and a couple of more that got off at the boat. We had several that would have been close to keepers that we didn't measure them. The top water bite slowed down about 8pm so we threw some jigs. had a few bites on chunk rock in the 25ft range but never got any to the boat. We only fished 2 1/2 hours but a good trip. good luck and good fishing rrv

Well I bought one of these last week. TD-Pro I loved the way it felt in the store the size looks retrieve, ETC. I loaded it with 14 lb floro and went fishing. I was very disappointed. On the first cast It sounded terrible. Gears grinding and lots of noise. This all led to short cast. I'm going to take it back this week. Maybe I'll spend the extra money and get a curado. Good luck and good fishing RRV

Got out Saturday evening. we put in at Shell Knob about 7pm. The water was still rough and lots of big boats out making it a real pain in the rear to fish. As soon as we got to our starting point(long sweeping main lake point) we got into a topwater bite. In the first 30 minutes we had 12 fish in the boat. 1 good keeper and 1 that was so close he probably would have measured. It slowed a little but we had a good topwater bite till dark. After dark it got tough. We only had one more keeper after dark, and very few bites. We were throwing jigs and hula grubs for the most part but we also tried some plastic. Good luck and good fishing RRV

Hey all, I just wanted to take a minute and thank all of you for your input on this topic. It was very educational. Although several models and brands were listed it seemed that Shimano was a reoccuring theme throughout the thread. So I wanted to let you all know that I have made my initial purchases. I have purchased a 7' Medium Heavy fast action Shimano Compre casting Rod and a 7' Medium fast action Shimano Compre spinning rod. I also happened to find a place that was clearencing out their Shimano Curado's so I bought the last one they had. It is a 100 DSV. I have a new 5 bearing mitchell spinning reel that I got as a gift. I don't think it is a high priced reel but it is very smooth and very nice. It will go on the spinning rod. I hope to purchase a couple of more rods and reels in the following months but hopefully this will be enough to get me started. I guess I can still take my old rods too but I would guess they won't get much play time. I am suppose to fish a Tourny with a friend Saturday night out of Shell Knob, so now I need fishing reports and ideas on what to fish and where. Thanks again RRV

well all I want to thank you all for your input. I have been looking at rods everyday and I am still planning of buying 1 good rod, but I haven't decided if it will be a st. croix, a gloomis or a shimano. I have however found a place on the internet that has the shimano compre 15% off with free shipping. I think I am going to order a couple of them until I make up my mind about a better rod. I also looked at the shimano clarus series. They are very reasonably priced and feel very nice. does anyone have experience with the clarus series? I may buy one just to try it. Thanks Good luck and good fishing

Well I have been looking for a few days now. I have looked mainly at Daiwa, Shimano, and Quantum reels. All make nice reels but right now I am leaning towards the Shimano Curado and the Daiwa advantage 153 HSTA. The HSTA is suppose to be new for 2008. Both seem to be very impressive in the store. I have heard lots of good things about the curado but I haven't heard anything about the HSTA. Does anyone have experience with it? I have looked at several rods. I really like the feel of the Shimano Compre series. I also looked at the Crucial but the Compre feels as good and is $40 less, But I also know that what they feel like in the store is not the same as fishing them. I have heard a couple of y'all say you liked the Crucial but how about the compre? I was also impressed with the loomis and ST. Croix rods but the Shimano had a better feel in the store. Thanks Good luck and good fishing

Trav, I believe he said the reel cost him about a $120 compared to other reels in that price range how does it rate? Capt, When you talk about fast or super fast tip, are rods labeled as such or is it just a feel thing? is a super fast stiffer that a fast? elaborate please. Thanks Good luck and good fishing

Don, Thanks for the link. I think I may go to springfield tomorrow so maybe I can get time to stop by BPS. I'm not planning on buying anything but hopefully get my hands on a few rods and reels and get some ideas. All, I went to spend the fourth with friends and a buddy of mine had just bought a new Daiwa 153 HST It was blue in color and it had 8+1 bearings. It was very nice, very smooth. does anyone have experience with that model? Thanks Good luck and good fishing.

Capt. Joe, you made a reference to your height. I had never thought about that. What does the longer rod do for you because of your height? The reason I ask is I am 6'2" in your opinion should I be looking at longer rods? Don, I am not familiar with ardent reels, Can I get those at BPS or do I have to order them? All, I see most of you like florocarbon line. I have used florocarbon at RR but never bass fishing. Why do you like florocarbon over mono? Thanks and keep the opinions coming Good luck and good fishing.

Okay all I want to start a topic talking about rods and reels. I started bass fishing with friends about 4 years ago. At that time I bought a couple of rods and reels from bass pro. The reels were a couple of cheap shimano's and a couple of cheap daiwa's. The rods were the cheap bass pro rods. a couple are 6.5' and a couple of 7'ers. They have proven to be functional, because I didn't want to get to deep into something without knowing if I would like it. Well I've decided it is time to purchase a new rod or two and a new reel or two. I use mainly bait casting rods and reels but I may also look at a spinning rod or two. I will mostly be dragging plastic at night. I have never tried to drop shot but I am going to start. I also enjoy a crankbait just before dark. What I want to know If you were going to have 3 rod reel combos what reels would you have? what length rods would you have? and what weight rods would you use? What lb line would you use and what situations would you use each of them? Seriously, all lets hear some opinions. Good luck and good fishing.

Skeeter, I think we should all just get along too. Why don't you offer to take the thief skiing? When you catch him. If he doesn't have any skis I'm sure he could barefoot. It would be really exciting for him to ski at night it may be hard to see if he falls but I wouldn't worry about that. Just remember to mind the night speed limit............ Good luck and happy skiing.

Skeeter, I feel your pain, and if I end up on the jury they will have a hard time convicting you but please mak sure it is really a theif and not just a fisherman enjoying an evening of fishing at a time when he doesn't have to worry about the seadoos and skiers..... Good luck

C5, Thanks for the info. I don't fish many night tournys but I do enjoy fishing nights. Not to worry I'll leave em where I find em Thanks again RRV

here are your pics jaybird

I have heard for years that the Walleye run up kings in January. Has it started yet? how far above the bridge at hwy 86? Thanks RRV

Well all I just wanted to ask for your help for some friends of mine. I found out Wednesday at church that one of my friends wives was diagnosed with stage 3 aggressive breast cancer. They are currently in Little Rock going through the test and treatment options. They have 3 kids the oldest is a senior in HS and the youngest is a 1st grader. Her name is Carmen and they could all use your prayers. Today I received the following email from another friend of mine. They too could use your help. My brother Gerry and his wife Jenny are expecting their first child due in January, a little boy whom they have decided to name Cameron Jake. Jenny was admitted to the hospital last night after some cramping and they found some fluid in the baby’s bowels and even though his heartbeat is irregular, it is still strong. After talking to Gerry, Jenny has high blood pressure and has preeclampsia. She is going to remain in the hospital until she delivers, but the doctor’s are giving them worse cause scenarios, along with talking about possible developmental problems and Down syndrome. Right now Jenny is 25 weeks along, but if they can keep him in the womb until 28 weeks he has a better chance of surviving. If Cameron is still having problems pumping the blood back thru and runs into complications they are going to have to deliver him early. Thanks in advance. RRV

Brownie, You make some very good points, But I don't believe the ground water contamination that you speak of comes from the farm itself. The chicken houses (in this case) will have to be cleaned to the specifications of the company that the growers work for and DNR. I feel the problem comes when people are allowed to spread the litter on the fields as fertilizer. Most chicken growing productions I know of sell the litter to farmers and they spread it. The contamination that you speak of could possible come from the fields of the neighbors who are complaining about the growing operation. Secondly, They are using scare tactics talking about how it will affect the spring of RR but dye studies done several years ago by DNR proved that the water coming thru the spring of RR is coming from the Washburn, Seligman, Exeter areas. Those areas are littered with chicken growing operations, and farm land that have chicken and turkey litter spread on it frequently. In my opinion that is where we should focus our efforts if we want to stop contamination of RR. Like I said I don't know anyone involved in this case, but I am bais because I hate to see one neighbor try to control another. I have seen several people move to the area that think because they bought a 1/2 acre a mile from you they can tell you how to run your business and financial well being. If it is a problem and they can prove it, find people that feel the way they do run for office get elected and do something about it. but don't screw with peoples livelyhood because you don't like the way they look. Sorry for the soapbox. RRV