OzarkFishman

I would think there would be some federal rules/laws about seperate states crossing the border without proper notification and protocol. Assuming that both MDC and AGFC would know what the laws are. I have heard of Elk north of the Arkansas border before Missouri got into the Elk game (heard not seen). Why don't we compile a list of questions and I will email some of my contacts at MDC (I teach Conservation and Hunter Ed at Ozark Junior High).

That is the type of question that will help us all figure this out. That may be something that MDC and ADC (if that is what they call themselves) need to figure out. I am pretty sure that Arkansas would not want to use their time and $$ to chase down one of OUR elk (I say OUR as a Missourian, nothing against Arkansasians ... is that how to spell that???).

They are known as nut-crunchers (i.e. they will crunch your nuts off and cause massive bleeding which has been documented to lead to death) ... at least that is what was said River Monsters. Strange stuff.

Let's not forget that we are not making the decision about what animals are re-introduced. There is plenty of data (other states) to see how to implement the elk restoration. While MDC has conversations with the public (via public meetings), they still have the final say. I don't know if other states have ever tried to re-introduce bison in a non-fenced area ... ever seen Dances with Wolves. Those herds would run through a highway full of traffic and the cars would lose. Not saying that an elk wouldn't dominate a car, but those bison stampedes are crazy. Without concrete data on whether or not a bison re-introduction would work, non of us can make an objective decision ... even then, MDC would have to approve and agree to use their $$$ to fund the project (let's not get political on whether their money is their's or our's or both). The original topic of this thread was whether or not it is correct for the MDC to shoot a straying elk. I still haven't been able to come to a conclusion on what I think. There is not enough information on the process of control for me to decide (maybe you all that have your definite opinions can share what you know that I do not). While we can squabble over if MDC should have brought elk back or not ... it is done. Now (IMHO), we should talk about the process that MDC is using to control/grow/maintain the herd.

I still don't have a definite opinion, but can you really make the point about grazing ... How many deer are there??? We can all agree that a moose wreck is worse. How many more deer wrecks will there be??? Numbers don't lie ... I would rather not look up the numbers and do the math tonight, but I can in the morning if you want. Again, no opinion yet ... trying to stay OBJECTIVE.

I think these question could clear up the situation ... just don't know if anyone has the answers ... What was it about this particular case that caused the shooting? Are all shot when they leave the "area" OR is it a case by case thing? These questions would allow all of us to get a better judgement of the situation.

Awesome experiences happen everytime you take your young ones out (I said awesome, not always perfect ). Great catch for your boy!!!

Nice OB, that is a great post. Very logical; sympathizing with some of the objections, yet explaining that they are silly complaints. Defintely post of the week in my opinion (that would be a fun thing to start ...).

I hate to admit it, but I bought most of my flies at BPS. You will get WAY more help with your purchase at smaller, locally owned fly shops.

Just eat your Wheaties and spinach and get ready to drag ..... I will gladly join you for the rain dance ... is there chanting or meditating involved ... that may help

I use a prince nymph (gold beadhead) and small olive or black woolybuggers. The posibilities are endless and most of the Finley fish don't see a lot of flies throughout the days (most people fish plastics/jigs or live bait). As far as technique ... I am not the best to give advice on fly techniques ... I usually just plop the fly down and drift it a little. Usually I am structure fishing, be it timber or a countour change on bottom. Report back and let us know how you do.

I was thinking that the rain got the fish active. While we both went after the rain, I think it was enough of a change to get the fish excited. Looking forward to a good summer on this lake.

Went out this morning for a few hours. Landed 10 fish (6 of them largemouth). All were caught on various plastics. Looking back on a couple of followers that followed all the way to the boat, probably should have been throwing a spinnerbait or fluke ...

I agree that they offer the heart of the sport ... without them most would never have a chance to hunt quail. In a perfect world, we would be able to walk through a field (with our dogs) and flush wild quail. Those times are gone for most in Missouri ... Here is a small piece of an elk article I found this morning (link is below) ... "Information obtained from the Arkansas Fish and Game Department through MDC shows that state, with an elk population of around 500 animals, averages only one reported vehicle collision with an elk per year. It's important to note, also, that Arkansas' elk area has a road density of 2.1 miles of road per square mile of habitat, while Missouri's proposed area has 1.2 miles of road for the same size area. Arkansas data also shows that, in the last 20 years, there were 25 reports of pasture damage and 27 for fence damage, which amounts to just more than two such complaints per year." http://www.semissour...ry/1659289.html

Keep it simple for sure ... only 1/0 offset hooks and 3 or 4 inch stik-o baits ... he got to pick between green and a green/black flake (with chartreuse tail). Plain and simply the best producing pond bait I have ever fished. Especially ponds that are overrun with bass, since bass eat bass.

Just speaking on the quail thing (as I have a friend that offers controlled quail hunts ... you know, keeps them cages and then "releases" them to be shot). It makes money for my friend and his dad, but I don't see the sport in that (just my opinion ... if you like to partake in that ... no harm, no foul). Anyways, to create good quail country you have to allow native grasses/plants to grow. The problem is that farmers need fescue to raise cattle and other fields are full of soy, corn, etc. While it would be great to let the landowner help this situation out, it is just not feasible for the INDIVIDUAL landowner. I have many family members in Lowry City, Deepwater, Montrose and other places that farm ... plain and simple ... fescue and clover are needed for them to survive. Judge if you want, but quail will not ever be prominent again unless the MDC has a magic wand that can change the reality of the day. As far as the elk, I have no idea what is best ... I will sit back and see how it plays out. Enjoy your day guys and gals! PS - After posting, I LOOKED AT THE TITLE ... guess I didn't have anything to further the original thought ... I blame it on Chief

It was a great trip with my 4 year old. My boy was able to paddle the kayak for the first time, catch 3 bass and enjoy some good outdoor adventures on his first camp out. We stayed at a family friends farm (right on the water). The trip started out in the blazing heat, but no worries ... sunscreen, a tent fan, and shade take care of that ... and some field drives in the AC!!! He started out by hooking a good 3 pounder, but it wrapped him around a log. I did my best to free it (almost falling in), but in the end the fish won. He was a little bummed at that point, so we took the jon boat in and switched to the kayak. Within a few casts, he had a fish on. He went on to catch one more that night. After having our fill of fishing we went on a drive to cool down and to go to Casey's to get some pizza. Made a quick trip to Montrose Lake and walked around a bit and then it was back to camp to start the hotdog roast. Once he had his fill of food and juice, we were off to 3 field walks (just 3 laps around the field, but it was a big deal to him that we got to do 3 of them ... the headlamp and flashlight helped him think it was a big deal ). By this point it was 9:30 and time to get some rest ... took a while for him to get to sleep in the tent (nature makes lots of noises and even a slight moon is bright enough for a 4 year old). Woke up around 6 and went off to catch more fish. He landed one more and lost a few. I probably caught 15 over the 2 days (these pits are full of nice bass and I didn't fish much ... it was HIS trip!!!) As it heated up today we decided to go into Deepwater to get some food ... it was DELICIOUS!!! What a great way to spend a few days with my oldest boy!!! All you dads out there (and moms)... TAKE YOUR KIDS OUTSIDE ... you will surely love the experience!!!

RS, I think I keep seeing you at Wal-Mart ... next time I will say hi. Al, I think it may have been that crazy liger that got loose last week ... Then, it found a mate and had 3 kitties in 2 days and they were hungry ... You've got a point there Al, it actually occurred on a part of the river that I frequent often (guess I don't have balls of steel ...)!! You all are probably correct ... I was probably more frustrated than I thought in my stupid descision to put in so late.

Thanks evnrude. Yes, I just paddle by the dam and down and then paddle back up. The gar had me excited that I had an even bigger bass ... then again, it was exciting enough to see a gar get airborne. I was actually happy it flipped my lure. I don't mind dealing with them in a boat or on shore, but a yak is a different story (not enough room for error).

Took the yak for a few hours while the boys were napping at home with mom. Glad I did, the first cast resulted in the fish you see below. I spent the next 45 minutes catching 11 more bass (one being a smallmouth), 4 turtles (got good at the paddle release) and one 2' gar (luckily it flipped the plastic when it got ariborne). After that, I spent an hour trying to find a different pattern ... no luck. What a great way to spend nap time!!!

I would say you are right, but this was in an area where the river split and the "eyes" were on the middle ground. I doubt that any land owner around the Finley would keep cattle without a fence ... The cows would have had to jump a fence ... also the eyes were closer together than cattle. I have a friend that breeds bulls and we have driven around his fields many times after dark with a spot light. Again, not saying I am correct in my assumption, but I can almost certainly say it wasn't cattle. Either way, you are correct ... LIVE AND LEARN!!!

Definitely closer to the ground. I used to go coon hunting fairly regularly ... so being out at night doesn't get to me very much. Not saying that I couldn't be wrong, but I don't think it was deer or cow (I am wrong daily, my wife reminds me of that). Either way, it was an exciting night. Hit the rivers boys and girls, the fish are feisty these days ...

Let me start by saying ... NEXT TIME I WILL DO MY HOMEWORK!!! We put in the canoe at 6 and made it to the park at 9:30, now for story time ... I started out throwing a little lizard and was immediately getting hit by bluegill. After losing 2 tails, I made one switch and that was all that was needed to start catching some nice bass (green bitsy tube). Saw a nice laydown and the eddy that was created just downstream, told the guy with me that I was going to catch a 15 inch largie on my next cast ... FISH ON (pic below). Not the biggest fish, but it was a nice fight. Kept thowing the tube and ended up with 13 fish by 8 o'clock (8 smallies, 3 largies , and 2 Ozark bass). Lost a nice 15"+ smallie at the canoe, but I couldn't complain. My buddy only boated one, but it was a solid smallie on a popper (he was paddling more than me and only fished topwater, thank goodness for great friends). Above is the good part of the story, the real story starts now ... From 6 to 8, we only got about 45 minutes of fishing in since we were dragging so much. Needless to say, by around 8 we were far away from the park and it was getting dark quick. We started paddling through some amazing looking slow pools and came to a bridge that I was hoping would be riverside, then I saw a car go over it and knew we were in for a long night. As the sun faded over the horizon, we both turned on our headlamps and just kept moving. We weren't talking much at this point, since I had obviously got us into something that I shouldn't have (At least this late at night). Let's just say there were parts where we were dragging (ok, we were carrying the canoe) 20 - 40 yards. Did we make a wrong choice at one of the V's of the river... I think so ... As the water is running out in front of us and the gravel bar goes up hill we stop, both of us had a weird feeling and we both somehow sensed it from each other. We both shined our headlamps up into the trees and saw some eyes ... then we looked again and saw 5 sets of eyes. We kept looking and the eyes kept looking back ...the "fight or flight" feeling came on and we both grabbed our oars. No one moved and my buddy told me to get out my knife (which I did NOT do) ... I felt more comfortable with the oar in my hand. Finally, he decided to throw a rock at one set of eyes and I followed suit. We started carrying the canoe and kept a watchful eye. Back on the water and very motivated to get to the park, we started paddling (staying in the middle of the river). Going through a slow pool, when a big commotion starts just feet in front of the canoe ... just a goose, but I think I pooped my pants a little ... We never saw the eyes again, but we did drag a few more times. Looking back on it, they were more than likely coyotes (actually, that is the only thing I think it could have been). What do you all think??? It was quite an adventure that started out AMAZING and ended up the most memorable float ever for me. I can't wait to do this float again, but next time it will be a morning float with more water in the river. The fish are biting and the coyotes are hungry ... Good fishing to all, OzarkFishman PS - the picture of the smallie when it is almost dark is probably 2 - 3 miles above the park ... we did not time that float well ...

To each their own. While kayak fishing sounds great and would offer more opportunities, I loved the wade fishing experience. The stingray aren't too bad to deal with when wade fishing (simply flip them over and keep control of the situation). Of course that only works on land ... Don't quite know how one would unhook them from a kayak ...

Saltwater fish aren't as lure-shy as bass. Use a wire leader and throw jigs (not bass jigs), topwater plugs and big lipless cranks ... you will like your results. Went to Gulf Shores and landed countless blues and ladyfish and 3 stingray (2 over 20 pounds) ... and that was my first time. Can't wait until July when I go back. Good Luck!