I'm Really, Really Sick Of This...

[Wayne SW/MO]

Fishing with rods and reels is largely catch and release? That ain't what you were screaming in the last thread.

This makes no sense to me? What was I screaming in the last thread?

Yes, to answer your question, bass fishermen who run up and down the lake in the boats with high tech electronics generally practice catch and release. Of course they do use rods and reels, but doesn't the bulk of spot fishing? Do you consider gigging fishing or hunting?

[Chief Grey Bear]

You are splitting hairs. To put all giggers vs. only Lake bass fishermen in anattempt to prove your futile argument is absurb and bordering on delusional.

You know as well as I do that in the last thread you were pointing the finger at rod and reel poachers as cleaning out the creeks and rivers of smallmouth. Now you are pointing at giggers.

The only reason I brought up bass boats and the electronics they have today is that Al suggested that the MDC should have been keeping an eye on giggers and their advancments in lights for the last 30 years. Maybe the same should be said about other electronics too. But boy you talk about causing a stink with that.

Anyway, positive discussion on this subject ended long ago and I am done with it too.

[Wayne SW/MO]

You are splitting hairs. To put all giggers vs. only Lake bass fishermen in anattempt to prove your futile argument is absurb and bordering on delusional.

You know as well as I do that in the last thread you were pointing the finger at rod and reel poachers as cleaning out the creeks and rivers of smallmouth. Now you are pointing at giggers.

The only reason I brought up bass boats and the electronics they have today is that Al suggested that the MDC should have been keeping an eye on giggers and their advancments in lights for the last 30 years. Maybe the same should be said about other electronics too. But boy you talk about causing a stink with that.

Anyway, positive discussion on this subject ended long ago and I am done with it too.

I still have no idea what you're talking about. I've seen early season poaching and I don't like it. It generally targets the breeding fish and harms the population. I haven't seen the season opening free for all and never said I did.

As far as bass boats versus gigging advancements, its still a mute point because very few of those in the bass boats intend to keep a fish.. If a gigger decides to step outside the law and takes advantage of stadium lights on the water, powered by a generator, it means dead fish, period.

As Al said, when it comes to giggers going after other fish it only takes a very few to decimate a population. Smallies are exceptionally vulnerable because of their wintering habits.

I have no problem with you questioning my post, I'll either stand by them or apologize, but I won't do either when it comes to undocumented accusations.

[Gary Lange]

The last two post are totally off the track. The advancement in equipment used by Giggers or by Rod and Reel fisherman has no bearing on the subject. I have no problem with the advancements in equipment. Both groups have a right to improvements in there equipment. I think it is that over the years most of the posters here have evolved into Catch and Release fisherman and have taken on a conservation frame of mind in that the resource needs to be protected. I am quit certain that we have individuals in both Giggers and Rod and Reel fisherman who target the Smallmouth as food and take them. To say that the MDC should have been looking at the advancements in lights for the gigging boats is ridiculous as they have just as much right to improvements as any other group. That includes Boaters, Waders, Fly Fisherman, Spin Fisherman and what ever other group that are out there. You can bet that Gigging is not going anywhere soon so an attempt to get those that do this to thinking in a conservation frame of mind or at least a legal frame is going to do more good then harm.

[Wayne SW/MO]

The advancement in equipment used by Giggers or by Rod and Reel fisherman has no bearing on the subject.

I would disagree with that Gary. The reason being that powerful lights allow those giggers who want to target other fish to hunt areas that would normally be off limits. They're able to go into deeper water and work around cover that holds fish other than suckers.

I don't know how familiar you are with the equipment, but metal halide lamps powered by gasoline generators rival football field lighting in lumen's. I think someone noted that it made for better identification and I'm sure that's an advantage for the large percentage of honest giggers, but it goes both ways.

[Gary Lange]

I don't have any first had knowledge Wayne. However, what you are saying is that they got these big lights and now they are targeting Gamefish that stay in deeper water. You're saying that these big lights identify the fish better and that the users know that they are taking gamefish and not suckers. I guess you have first hand knowledge on this and have been out on the water and viewed this first hand or are you just assuming that this is the case.

[Guest]

deleted

[Wayne SW/MO]

I haven't been in a gigging boat since headlights left the scene. I have been very close to boats with these lights, when we we're leaving and they were starting, and I can tell you that in about 4-5 feet of water and 15-20 feet away I could see every rock on the bottom. Yes I'm speculating about how deep they can reach and about hunting cover where other species hide, but I don't see them finding a lot of bass in the open because its not where they are as a norm.

I'm in the same camp as Al, and have been for years, that it only takes a few to cause havoc. It was reported, I never did confirm absolutely, that several years ago they hit the Niangua pretty hard and confiscated several boats over game fish being gigged. I don't know who they were, but I do know there were some in the area that had no qualms about gigging game fish and it wasn't any secret.

It seem to depend a lot on the rivers and the amount of activity. I've never heard of any trouble on the James, that doesn't mean there hasn't been some, and if true I suspect its because of the heavy traffic. A lot of boats will likely make it too risky, for fear those giggers who don't want the attention will turn on them. That's also a guess, but its also part of my belief that's its a small number of people and they should be that much easier to stop.

[cwc87]

Just a couple gigging stories to back up the 300 fish kill in and hour and a half.

Back in 80 or 81 my father and the boys from troutt and sons had the only gigging jet boat in steelville. On a particlular Huzzah trip we launched in the hole to be gigged and there were so many suckers when the gigging boat pulled in to the beach suckers were literally swimming them selfs out on to the beach and some were laying with there backs out of the water. Of course as a little kid I grabbed them up as instructed for the fish fry that night.

Another trip was around 98 or 99 Three of us gigged 60 fish in about 20 minutes. We put in the hole we intended to gig and one trip up and down then back up and we had our limit of 20 fish per person. The hole was on meramec above hwy 8 and about 400 yards long with the deepest spot about 7 foot. The reason I know the numbers so well is that one of the giggers was aspiring to be and eventually became a conservation agent. For some of us gigging is a way of social night out and a great table fair. Hence, I never freeze fish and may keep fish on ice no longer than 48 hrs. Frying suckers the same night you gig them is like no other fish fry bar none. The clear ozark streams purifies the meat in the suckers and brings a mouth watering taste as I type this. Anyhow some insight. And for the record I've not gigged this year but have been to 3 fish frys. No bass or trout were mistaken. All suckers.

[Kicknbass]

Just a couple gigging stories to back up the 300 fish kill in and hour and a half.

Back in 80 or 81 my father and the boys from troutt and sons had the only gigging jet boat in steelville. On a particlular Huzzah trip we launched in the hole to be gigged and there were so many suckers when the gigging boat pulled in to the beach suckers were literally swimming them selfs out on to the beach and some were laying with there backs out of the water. Of course as a little kid I grabbed them up as instructed for the fish fry that night.

Another trip was around 98 or 99 Three of us gigged 60 fish in about 20 minutes. We put in the hole we intended to gig and one trip up and down then back up and we had our limit of 20 fish per person. The hole was on meramec above hwy 8 and about 400 yards long with the deepest spot about 7 foot. The reason I know the numbers so well is that one of the giggers was aspiring to be and eventually became a conservation agent. For some of us gigging is a way of social night out and a great table fair. Hence, I never freeze fish and may keep fish on ice no longer than 48 hrs. Frying suckers the same night you gig them is like no other fish fry bar none. The clear ozark streams purifies the meat in the suckers and brings a mouth watering taste as I type this. Anyhow some insight. And for the record I've not gigged this year but have been to 3 fish frys. No bass or trout were mistaken. All suckers.

Your story still doesn't justify the 300 / 1 1/2 hour quote. Sure the 60/20 ratio meets the statement, but the 20 fish limit caps the number of fish at the limit. Even the most insane game-hog will look a the tub of fish and realize that they must clean the nasty mess and stop killing fish.

I guess if your counting every boat on the river, or every boat in the state in a given 1 1/2 hour period the quote could be deemed accurate. I don't believe that was the intend or the way the message was received.

I've had nights that we have been on a 3 fish per minute rate for a period of time as well, this is rare, and not sustainable for long. I can't imagine cleaning a mess of 300 fish.