32 And Counting....

[Trav]

Most of you know me as an expert on the hardest waters of the area. I focus on the toughest stuff.

You also know I am probably the most straight forward person with the knowledge I have with the public. I don't hide anything. I also don't hold back my opinions....but of course this is about fishing and not the ruling law of the land..

With that said…

Ha-ha.

I am currently working on book to snub the ideal a guide will give you a better day on the water. I really don't expect it to be published but I do have this venue to express some of the highlights of my research.

I have talked to those who have hired guides for the Missouri experience and compared notes. I used comparisons of those who went without a guide while using the knowledge they learned from area fishing reports as well. Reports such as what you read here. I also investigated the results of those who just visit and did everything on their own. To be brief, I will focus on those who are prolific fisherman in their own neck of the woods.

I also fished over thirty bodies of waters using nothing but my own knowledge, which is vast and probably more experienced than even 90 percent of the guides working the same waters. Just to compare a local’s results.

To be fair I spread this research over the last two years, to avoid seasonal influence. I also directed some of my inquiries toward many of our local guides, focusing on Ozark waters. OK…to prove a point…. Also to be fair, I separated my personal studies to include six species, giving me the thirty plus locations. The lakes in the Ozarks can’t be fairly observed without separating them in section by their tributaries. So I also used data by separating the lakes into particular arms.

We all know fishing is a tight subject. Most guys will never give their tactics and locations. Yet, in today’s waters...nobody can really claim a secret. There are just too many humans seeking the same thing. Hence, the point to this commentary is evident.

I have found with a research base of over 300 fishermen nationwide who hired a guide here in the Ozarks, only 20 percent of those who knew the basics of how to catch a fish when at home waters were satisfied. With only 2 of them saying they caught a trophy over 6 pounds.

This to me is a sad result for a fishing destination. I have been a guide and captain in 4 countries. I couldn’t and never take money with such results.

It is not the guides fault …..Missouri law lets locals rape the waters but it is bad advertising.

Local guides who call themselves captains should be ashamed though.

When these fishermen were asked if they were catching and releasing…these top fishermen stated they felt they had to keep fish. Half of all guides encouraged them to keep fish over 3 pounds.

This spanned the major species, Walleye , largemouth Bass, smallmouth bass, Stripers, and musky.

Missouri’s pride.

Facts are facts. Guides don’t really help your success. If you like Missouri waters they won’t help your next trip if they encourage you to keep fish. Most won’t even help you catch more fish by hiring them.

Not all guides are bad but most are about paying their boat payments or supporting their mortgage.

Buyer beware.

Don’t ask me for references either. You will do very good by doing what you do at home or asking for advice here….save your money for some Ruby Tuesdays and extra gas to run the lake.

[raise the motor]

As someone not familiar with fishing on Bull Shoals Lake, this forum has been most helpful. But hiring a guide for a day did more to improved my success than anything else.

Guides in the Ozarks area are very generous in sharing specific tips and information here, as are many other experienced Ozark anglers.

To any for whom this may be unfair criticism, I appreciate your enthusiasm for fishing, the sharing of your knowledge and experience and the great time you so often produce.

Thanks from one of the 20%.

[hawghunter24]

If a guide was capable of regularly putting his clientele on 6 pound fish, he'd be a professional bass fisherman, and a very good one at that. He sure wouldn't be taking people out on guide trips. Maybe those of your research have too high of expectations?

[T-RockJaws]

I have never hired a guide, but I have been strongly considering it... My partner and I have been really trying hard to learn how to drop shot fish and we are starting to have some success with it. It has taken us a lot of time, effort and research to get to the point we are at now with it. I think that hiring a guide with a specific style of fishing that you are trying to learn could help shorten that learning curve. I think we have some great guides on Table Rock and they are very generous with the information they share on this forum. I owe a lot of my success to the knowledge they share and I am very appreciative to them for that!

[Trout Commander]

If someones head swells much more Lilley is going to have to get more server space...

[eric1978]

If someones head swells much more Lilley is going to have to get more server space...

No kidding.

Your only problem, Trav, is that people who write informational books usually have this thing called credibility. I definitely haven't seen more success from you than the guides who regularly post reports and pics here. Until you do that, sorry, I'll be paying more attention to what they have to say.

[techo]

No kidding.

Your only problem, Trav, is that people who write informational books usually have this thing called credibility. I definitely haven't seen more success from you than the guides who regularly post reports and pics here. Until you do that, sorry, I'll be paying more attention to what they have to say.

Usually don't respond to trolls, but what they said. +2

[eric1978]

Trolls make inflammatory comments only for the sake of stirring up arguments. I was responding to the accusation that guides are essentially worthless. See the difference?

[Trevor K]

It's been several years now, but I've fished with a guide before on Table Rock and definitely enjoyed myself. I wish I could remember his name, because I would recommend him to anyone. I feel more than comfortable fishing my home waters, but Table Rock is just so big that it can be intimidating, so it was nice to have an expert there to help. Just my 2 cents.

[techo]

Trolls make inflammatory comments only for the sake of stirring up arguments. I was responding to the accusation that guides are essentially worthless. See the difference?

In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into a desired emotional response^[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

You are not the troll here eric and usually offer some insight or another valid perspective on topics and issues. The original poster would be considered a troll in this case as the original post was about the usefullness, or therefore lack of with guides and then inflamed further with the usual catch and release stuff. The original post seems to be made up of well....... fabricated facts, figures and interviews. This is obviously a forum with many guides, tournament fishermen, catch and release advocates and the forum is even owned or hosted by Lilly a fishing guide. SO the post and the poster in this case is a troll with the general purpose seeming to be to stir up a desired emotional response.

Most forums tend to discourage trolls, but some welcome them. The NY Post is one forum reputed to enjoy the trolls and have fun. Trav is generally one of the more enjoyable trolls I have met, but still never seems to add much other than fun to the forum.

By quoting your post and the post you quoted and adding +2........means I agree with you and your quoted post. Sorry if I wasn't clear and offended you.