Going Shocking Today

[Oldschoolcane]

Brian, I really don't see anything in either of my posts to get defensive about? You have a lot of people on this forum that are new to the river and flyfishing in general who are overjoyed at having a wild trout river to fish in Missouri......me to. But I am also familar with the river from when Shawn Traylor was guiding on the river, Myrons cabins weren't around and Sunburst was still a small campground floating location. My questions about the river are based upon all the changing land use patterns, vacation homes, cattle pastures and the drainage, more commercial use of the river and everything that comes with that and I'd like to know what effect thats had on the river? I am not reminicing about the old days I am simply wanting a little more information than the average flyfisherman. What would I do if the river was in worse shape now compared to before? Get involved maybe someone needs to care about the area enough to see whats happening and do something about it.

[Nortrad]

We hear this exact "point" try to be proven every-so-often.......my reply......Name 1 wild river in the state that didn't fish better 30 years ago.....or 1 smallmouth river that didn't fish better 30 years ago....lake...pond...puddle that didn't fish better 30 years ago. I don't think people really understand what it takes to be a 100% wild rainbow trout fishery, especially in the mid-west. Wild fish are at the mercy of nature, period. It's not like the trout parks where they stock more fish than were taken yesterday....they haven't stocked this river with rainbows in almost 50 years...numbers will go up and down for the rest of existence.

MDC keeps VERY good track of the NFOW. I may dog them now and then but they do a good job of trying to keep a very close eye on their wild trout. Like others have said, the trend over the last several years have been numbers going UP......but, I ask you this, if you saw numbers going down------What would you do? This is a wild river, there is nothing you can do unless you try to change law and make it a catch and release stream when harvesting probably wouldn't be the problem, mother nature would more than likely be the culprit.

I don't know anyone that really fishes the river, and has for longer than I have been alive, that has anything bad to say about the NFOW right now. If you have fished it for 30 years you saw the drought of the 90's pretty much stop the fishing as there were basically no fish. Then in the mid-2000's we saw a JUMP in numbers. THEN in the late 2000's we saw a boom in numbers. It has fished better in the last 5 years than I have ever seen it fish.

I would kill to have been able to fish these rivers back in the 70's, I really would have. But comparing the rivers now to how they fished in the 70's is like comparing how YOU were back then compared to now. Shoot, I was a 5'8" guy that had a 44" vertical and could dunk when I was 18.......at 31 now, I would pull a hamstring if I tried to touch the net.

Oh yeah? When I was in high school...oops won't go there . You youngsters, please...I wish for the days when I was in my 30's. I'm fired up that Jedi and I are cruising his Green Lady canoe, pulling off, fishing a run, repeat, on Saturday. Come by the cabin, crazy vertical leap Brian, got some hoop stories for you. No we didn't use a peach basket...

[Wayne SW/MO]

I've been around Missouri waters for a few years and fished many of them before the 60's and I don't see anything in Brian's post i could disagree with.

[Justin Spencer]

What would I do if the river was in worse shape now compared to before? Get involved maybe someone needs to care about the area enough to see whats happening and do something about it.

Being born in the mid 70's and Brian the late 70's maybe even 80. We are experiencing the river as good as we have ever seen it. The trout fishing has improved exponentially over the last 10 years, so it is tough for us to see big problems. The river obviously supports good spawns still, and we get good growth from our fish. i think we all wish we could stop the logging and cabin building and other things that could harm the river or the natural experience, but short of buying up all the land and letting it revert back to it's natural state a lot of time can be wasted fighting a battle that will get little accomplished. Any suggestions are appreciated.

I think those who use the river or make a living from it care much more about it than the average person. We all get involved by keeping in touch with various departments trying to make sure they do as much as possible to preserve what we still have.

I guess we need some old timers that saw it when it was a better river get involved and let everyone know what needs to be done to get it back to that state.

I'm hoping with the hellbender now being listed we can put some pressure on the water treatment plant in Mtn. Grove to better clean up their water (if possible) which would help the quality of the water coming out of rainbow spring. I'm afraid many of the chemicals that harm the ecosystem make it through treatment undetected, not sure what to do about them.

Leaving for the Cardinals Game so have at it.

[Wayne SW/MO]

I think the lesson is that it can and will happen if nothing is done. There is little to no hope of reversing what has been done, but stopping further damage is. If you look at the summer homes on the NFOW now and the disruption of the natural dependence of the river on the border of land, picture it with homes and clearings along with septic tanks and the trees that normally slow water absorption from one end to the other.

[Brian Wise]

Brian, I really don't see anything in either of my posts to get defensive about? You have a lot of people on this forum that are new to the river and flyfishing in general who are overjoyed at having a wild trout river to fish in Missouri......me to. But I am also familar with the river from when Shawn Traylor was guiding on the river, Myrons cabins weren't around and Sunburst was still a small campground floating location. My questions about the river are based upon all the changing land use patterns, vacation homes, cattle pastures and the drainage, more commercial use of the river and everything that comes with that and I'd like to know what effect thats had on the river? I am not reminicing about the old days I am simply wanting a little more information than the average flyfisherman. What would I do if the river was in worse shape now compared to before? Get involved maybe someone needs to care about the area enough to see whats happening and do something about it.

Exactly, and no offense taken or meant, seriously. I keep up with a lot of the rivers on this forum and this debate comes up more often on the NFOW than any other river listed here. I guess to see what is happening with the NFOW now (which everything is trending toward the BETTER) you would have to compare another river in the state (or mid-west for that matter) that has similar boundaries, a similar drainage, similar structure, and totally wild rainbows..........and there is no comparison in the Mid-West. The closest thing we have is the 11 Point but the only thing that makes the NFOW and 11 Point comparable is the river itself and not the fish because obviously even with absolutely NO homes, cabins, septic tanks, etc that river cna't truely support wild fish, they have tried their best to make that happen and it doesn't happen. I think that is the craziest thing in the world because if you take the NFOW back 40 years which is basically what we are talking about..............you have the 11 point in current day.

I remember the river fishing better. One of my first memories of fishing was a certain day with a zebco 33 and I was around 4-5 years old and able to catch fish (TRUST me it wasn't skill, and still isn't now ) it was easier, period. But, in my life the biggest thing that ever happened to the river was the drought. That is the only thing you can physically point your finger at on a timeline, in comparison with water levels, and say "THAT hurt the river." The mid-90's brought the building boom on the river...when fish numbers were LOW. After that we had good water for several years and our numbers skyrocketed with each years spawn being bigger and better than the last and that is AFTER all the building started. Now you look at this year's young of the year numbers (which aren't out yet but trust me here) and they are going to be down. During spawn last year we hadn't had a flush since the previous spring.....the leaves from LAST Fall didn't get flushed out of the river until the massive floods we had this spring so water was LOW during spawn.

In my eyes, and if you look at everything in the past and what is right in front of us the main problem is water levels. You know how I said that every river in the state fished better in the 70's? If you look back at water levels then compared to now....they were higher. When you look at what happens when we have "above average" water for several years (or what is "above average for us anyway)right now, we instantly see more success both in fishing and our spawn.

This is kind of cool...something I hadn't sat down and put on "paper" or is it just my feable mind that can wrap around the jibberish I just wrote?

[Chief Grey Bear]

I remember the river fishing better. One of my first memories of fishing was a certain day with a zebco 33 and I was around 4-5 years old and able to catch fish (TRUST me it wasn't skill, and still isn't now ) it was easier, period.

I have wondered if it isn't the skill that gets in way sometimes????

[ColdWaterFshr]

I'm still stuck on the 44 vertical leap.

[Nortrad]

I'll press him on that, if he shows up at Sunburst. Justin can vouch for him, I'm not sure that the guy on the sticks, Mr. W., knew how to drive the lane and throw down...

[Oldschoolcane]

Brian & Justin, now that I have the NFOW 2009 Trout Population, (MDC report) in front of me which doesn't reflect the latest survey all of this makes sense. My latest fishing trips all occurred within that recovery from the drought window and I probably understated the affect of the drought on the rivers trout. Talking Rainbows here. But still, I do think there should be a real grassroots effort to watch and improve the river whenever possible. I think development and increasing use along with additional nutrification are something that we should all be concerned about. Plus, any additional habitat that could be created for spawning trout could only help. Not sure if this is realistic or not but its definitely something for those that value this river and its fishing to consider.