Buffalo Vs Appalachian

[Nightbrew]

Hi guys I need some advice on purchasing a canoe. I recently paddled a friends 16ft buffalo. It was great, I really liked the stability and the rocker made it quite manuverable. I was able to stand up in it with ease. The specs for the old town appalachian show to be very similar, but the buffalo has a flat bottom campared to the shallow arch of the appalachian. On another website I found the app's rocker to be 2.5" which is what buffalo has on their website for their 16 footer. Has anyone paddled both of these? I know everyone likes the discoveries but I dont know if I would like less rocker. I mostly downstream float and would rarely be taking the boat on lakes. Any advice, thanks

[grizwilson]

I run a tripper, a disco 169, a camper and a pack. That said I have paddled the buffalo and the appy, both good boats, in my opinion the buffalo is a bit more stable, but the appy is more agile, cuts n turns quicker. Only time I have ever went down in clabber shoal was in a appy but it was loaded pretty heavy for a 3 day run. Check with Bobber on the Buffalo fourm he can usually hook you up with a Buffalo quite a bit cheaper than the old town..my 2cents

[Nightbrew]

Thanks grizwilson, if I felt comfortable standing in the buffao do you think that I would feel much difference standing in the app?

[grizwilson]

Well, Two of my best friends have apps, if we float together, they want me to bring the old tripper. But both love their apps, one is a sailboat/surf/paddle board guy, he needs to reduce his caffine intake. The other is a very good canoe handler and fisher man. The guy dumped at clabber traded his app for a guide 14 7 about half the value...... you have to stay on top of the app, Buffalo more forgiving. I would not stand up to p out of the app, buffalo no worries.

[Nightbrew]

Well that says alot, did you say that Bobber typically has some buffalos for sale? I wish they still made them, I would like to look at some custom colors.

[grizwilson]

You can pm bobber on this board or contact him through his web site:

http://floatthebuffalo.com/

If he does not have what you need Ozark Mt. Trading Co has some, they have stores in Ozark, MO and Garfield, AR. They have several on the water days each year and you can compare several, I really like that. They will be happy to take the full posted price, but they will dicker, I have had the price and boat I wanted before I left the house last time over the phone.

http://www.ozarkmtc.com/index.html

[Nightbrew]

Thanks again griz, I ended up pm'ing bobber last night and will wait for a response. Unfortunately I have been working w/Larry at OMTC and there is a long waiting list for buffalos, again due to the lack of production over the last 2 years. Hopefully bobber gets back w/me.

[Al Agnew]

I've paddled the Buffalo, not the Appalachian...but just some thoughts on the two based upon specs...

Waterline width of the Buffalo is probably pretty close to 36", while waterline width of the App is 33.5". That's a BIG difference. The App, because it has flared sides, will have more final stability than the Buffalo, which I believe has a bit of tumblehome. But the Buffalo will have quite a bit more initial stability, not only because of the waterline width but also because of the flat bottom instead of shallow arch bottom of the App. It will feel more stable, and you can stand up in it more comfortably, but if you get into trouble and start to tip, you're going on over in the Buffalo while the App will resist tipping.

The Buffalo is very high ended. 25" bow and stern depth, but 13.75" center depth. Those high ends will keep the canoe a little drier in standing waves, but will catch the wind on windy days, and might even get in the way of a sidearm cast to get a lure under an overhanging limb. The App has 23" deep bow, and 15" center depth. That two inches might make a difference on windy days, or on a cast, though it's not too much difference. The greater center depth somewhat offsets the lower ends as far as staying dry in standing waves.

The weight of the Buffalo is 72 pounds, the App is 67. You can't go too much on those figures, because I've found canoes to often weigh a little differently than specs. Not sure I'd make any decisions based upon weight, but five pounds is five pounds, and makes a difference on a long carry at a bad access after a long day of floating.

So...my conclusion would be that if you want a stable-feeling canoe that you can comfortably stand in (I wouldn't because I see no benefit to standing in a canoe while fishing), go with the Buffalo, but understand that you're just as likely if not more so to actually tip it. If you want a bit better paddling performance, I'd go with the App.

[grizwilson]

Well, think Al said what I tried to, much better communicator than I.

[Nightbrew]

Thanks Al. I didnt think that small amount of width would make that much difference, but thats why I am here asking. Standing in the canoe to fish is something that has recently become more important to me, as I have begun to fly fish more and more. It seems way easier to cast the fly rod standing than sitting. I appreciate all your info.