Chicken Farm near Roaring River

[Rusty]

Oklahoma pointed this out when they sued Arkansas and won.

Wayne, This has not been won as of yet, as far as I know. 2008 is when this goes to trial. I could be wrong though.

[SilverMallard]

You guys are absolutely right. And my concerns are mostly with location and existing standards for CAFO's. They are often too lax. Federal standards are a "least common denominator" attempt to find a one size fits all minimum. States are SUPPOSED to then tighten where appropriate to a degree appropriate statewide. Then counties do likewise at the county level. Then municipalities and watershed/drainage districts do it again. The idea is that the end result is locally appropriate AND nationally normalized. Unfortunately, SB 364 would eliminate the last two levels AND present lawsuits for state mandate violations. That just cannot be tolerated.

[Wayne SW/MO]

Sorry Russ, I thought it had been, however weren't some concessions made by Arkansas, or am I off base?

I wouldn't give too much praise to the state DNR before they act, while I know that the winds can change with every new administration, but they haven't been the best environmental ally on all issues in the past.

I'm afraid this is also a reflection of the term limits, while they can be a good thing in many instances, this may be a situation to watch in that regard.

[Danimal]

Some concessions have indeed been made but the lawsuit is still on the table. I for one hope they win. The way I see it, if Johnny Tyson can personally offer up 5 million bucks just to buy out the U of A football coach's contract (which has been rumored), then surely Tyson Foods INC. can afford to get together with the other defendants and do more to protect the watersheds. Dan-o

[LostMyWife]

Everyone needs a landfill but no one wants to live next door to one. The same can be said for prisons, pig farms and chicken farms. Everyone wants the meat and they want it as cheap as possible. They don't want to know what goes into producing it, and they don't want to see it. It's like the military's version of don't ask don't tell.

We blame the politicians. They need to get elected. That takes a lot of money. Big business has that money. Unless you're good ole Rod in IL it takes big business to get into office. People want jobs, and that means infrastructure and factories. It also means going away from areas that have the infrastructure because it is to expensive to build there. We have thousands of acres of abandoned factory space in the St Louis area, but these guys are going into rural areas because they can make more money and take advantage of the lack of regulation. It's all about ROI. It's not a huge conspiracy, it's called capitalism.

If you really want to do something, make the local health officials do their job. When we open a restaurant, it's not the city or the building inspectors that cause us problems, it's the health department. They have more power and answer to no one, or at least it seems that way.

Don't get the wrong idea about this post. I am not an advocate for Tyson or Pilgims Pride or anyone else. We all have to protect the environment and they can be forced to follow the laws, we all just have to be willing to pay for it because it is not free and it is not cheap.

[Rusty]

That is a valid point LMW.

I was talking to a person in power here, and his statement about the Ag bill being pushed here was, are you willing to pay $50.00 for a steak. I could tell by his statement his mind was already made up. I tossed the question, what is unpolluted water worth to you?

No apology necessary Wayne. I have been wrong at least once a day for the last 40 years.

[SilverMallard]

Russ,

We need to start answering that question:

If we have to pay $50/gallon for the water our cows drink to be distilled and transported and stored and dispensed before they drink it, that steak will cost more than $50! We can't do ANYTHING without clean water.

This country is facing severe clean water...and even water period...shortages WAY before we're gonna see skyrocketing prices for beef. These guys are deluded.

[Wayne SW/MO]

I'm not anti agriculture, especially the family farmers, but while Missouri ranks high in beef production, the economic value pales when compared to the tourism industry. In fact the finish feeding isn't the total of the industry receipts, and I doubt that it makes up that much of the total, and certainly not enough to make a dent in offsetting damages to tourism. All industries have responsibilities that add cost, and the livestock feeders are no different.

[SilverMallard]

Well, Wayne, most of MO isn't 10 miles from Branson or Lake of the Ozarks. So I wouldn't want to pit tourism against ag in this state. That's even a losing proposition in Hawaii, Florida, and California! That works in Stone and Taney Counties. But it doesn't work in Springfield...35 miles away. It sure as heck doesn't work in Chilicothe or Dexter or Moberly!

We need to educate developers and farmers and even the avg suburban homeowner about the issues facing us if we continue to neglect our water. Ag is DEAD without an abundance of clean water...for their OWN purposes. Real estate is DEAD without clean water. And if you kill ag in MO, you have killed MO. MO is the #2 beef producing state in the nation behind Texas. We are also a major poultry producer, dairy producer, and row crop producer. We are also a HUGE finished ag product and agri-chemical state. And we are one of the most critical ag logistics hubs in the nation due to location.

It is true you don't want to kill tourism, either. And our tourism rises or falls with quality WATER...faster than probably anything else. But to take an ag vs. tourism approach would be like taking on the Chinese Army IN CHINA with a single Stryker Brigade from the US Army. NOT a good strategy!

[Wayne SW/MO]

SM I'm well aware of the agriculture situation in Missouri, I was born here and have lived most of my 68 years somewhere on the west side. I've seen the figures that you have and while they may rank second in cows, its not the beef producer that other states are.

The best figure give the whole Beef Industry here 1.5 billion, and compared to figures that vary from 8 to 13 billion for tourism, they're not anymore important then other industries, including other non polluting agricultural endeavors. You're right that not all towns have the same stake in tourism, but what has that got to do with the fact that the taxes gained benefit all of Missouri, including Trenton where I spent most of my youth, a town heavily dependent on agriculture, but also dependent on shared taxes.

The bulk of the problems that confront the environment come from feeder operations, and I don't believe you can find facts to support an argument that they are a big industry in Missouri, not in comparison to many others. By comparison I mean those that produce taxes, jobs and revenue in general that benefit the state.

The Farm Bureau would support graveling I-70 if the corporate farms did, because their business is selling insurance to rural Missouri, and the large corporate farms rule the organization. Anyone can check the biographies of the board members and ascertain that.