Ladders at Outlet 3

[Danoinark]

On another thread Michael responded to a question about how much water and flow to expect from the new brown trout chute. I have to agree with him and say that area just downstream from the TU stairs will probably see a good amount of water and cover.

But my main concern is that it not become another location for snaggers like #2. I would like to see MDC development some sort of diversion making it almost impossible to access. I think the no fishing sign has been moved further out but do you think some large boulders or other formations would keep the problem curbed. I also believe that eventually fishing below #3 will be one of the best spots on the lake.

Dano

[brownieman]

>But my main concern is that it not become another location for snaggers like #2. I would like to see MDC development some sort of diversion making it almost impossible to access.<

Dano, it will be the 'hot spot' due to the constant water flow i would say...unless you have some yank with the dept. it will be up to the fisherman to police the water i'm sad to say.

This is one of the reasons I don't sight fish, never have.

To me it takes away a little if you can see the fish before the strike...but many can't resist seeing a big one and not being able to catch it...so...you know what happens.

If all were ethical fisherman this problem would not exist, but...not pointing any fingers for each knows who they are, ya know...

Should be a neat change possibly for those of you who fish taney on a regular basis...hopefully.

bm

[Micheal Kyle]

MDC will have to do something if they expect the fish to move up the ladder. I would hope that they could see a problem, I for one can see a high mortality rate right there and I would think that this would defeat what they want to do with the ladder.

I really think that the MDC might want to take a look at at few other states and see what they do for there regulations during the spawn. Now with that said the MDC will argue that the fish do not actively spawn in Taneycomo well I would have to agree to a certain point as science boy looking at the management area.

Now as a fisherman I would have to disagree because there has been several times that I have caught and or seen tiny fish and when I say tiny fish these are fish under seven inches. They have to come from somewhere they will say they escape from the hatchery I say yes maybe a few do but when you start seeing fish that have there paw marks and do not have the race way beat up look. Where did they come from.

Now with all of that said, I guess where I'm going with all of this is, the MDC only looks at the Taneycomo fishery a strictly put and take. Meaning with out the stocking of the fish there would not be any fish in there. I do believe this to a certain extent but I also think that if they would reevaluate their rules and regulations that this fishery would be one of the best tail waters in the nation.

Michael

[brownieman]

Michael,

imo, from personal experience the dept. will admit to little failure and imo will take great effort to cover such things...bad pr is highly frowned upon within the 'powers that be'.

imo the 'educated idiots' will set you straight if need be...being the experts they are or should i say profess to be...whatever...it's been done this way for 30 yrs is the prevalent mindset.

very little i have seen is well thought out...just seems like the thing to do at the moment...generally to appease a pet program imo and an attempt to show us results of our tax dollars...whatever.

give them some 'common sense reasoning' and they'll take it alright...imo the only decision is which round file cabinet to file it in yet a very nice facade is presented.

us 'little guys' just sit back, scratch our heads and wonder...this being the case with me.

imo sad to say the least.

bm

[snagged in outlet 3]

I think the incredible amount of lunker brown trout caught last year was due to #3 being closed. They came up and had no where to go, so it was an unbelievable year. I'm hoping with the ladder open, they will move up stream and go straight up the ladder.

I was talking about this last fall with my fishing buddy. He owned one of the first condo's built at Point Royale, if that gives you an idea of how long we have fished Taney. We've never seen so many browns milling around above rebar as we did last year.

MDC needs to move the cable out so once the fish get in the chute they are protected from snaggers. The past couple years at Bennett they were working on the hatchery and they left the gate open at the bottom, where it enters the stream. The runs below the pens were stacked with browns all winter long. Once the first fish went into the run the rest followed like a salmon run.

SIO3.

[Micheal Kyle]

I have fished Taney for more than 25 years, now with that said I am only 32 I would have to say that only the last 15-17 years count. There were some years that there were a lot of fish up but not like it has been in the past two years. I would have to agree with SIO3 that is the reason for that many fish up and beyond the re-bar. Fish run in herds when they see fish go and see it is safe they will be just like little sheep they follow.

MDC is going to have to do something or there Little project will be a failure in my eyes. Now I do understand that is what they used to have them do but it was not so publicized what it was there for. They would actually have to go down there and manually catch the fish, then take them up collect and return.

Now everybody and brother knows what the outlet is for big fish to go and spawn in the barn and then be returned to the water. Being a former employ of MDC for a couple of years in the Fishery dept. as an assistant I do know how the uppers echelon think. It can be very comical at times, I think that if some of us would ban together we might be able to get something done about the outlet fishing especially outlet three or the new ladder, especially in the fall.

Remember I'm only trying to help protect our beautiful resource and I will be willing to help out with any thing you all decided would be pertinent to do.

Michael

[Danoinark]

Michael and others

I intend to bring this up at our next TU board meeting and general meeting on September 25. Of course everyone is welcome to attend and I wish you would.

Meeting starts at 7:00 pm at the Hatchery visitor center.

I will also make note of all the comments and present them

Dano

[brownieman]

>MDC is going to have to do something or there Little project will be a failure in my eyes. Now I do understand that is what they used to have them do but it was not so publicized what it was there for. They would actually have to go down there and manually catch the fish, then take them up collect and return.<

Michael, imo that actually involved a little work and effort...heavin forbid that, lol. Probably 90% of dept. employees i have encountered are strictly in it for the paycheck and the few that do care are just trying to ride it out till retirement, most have little genuine regard for the things that they should and are paid for...an employee with good work ethic and innovative thinking is not well perceived by the 'good ole boy upper echelon'...imo being comical is putting it mildly, lol.

>Now everybody and brother knows what the outlet is for big fish to go and spawn in the barn and then be returned to the water. Being a former employ of MDC for a couple of years in the Fishery dept. as an assistant I do know how the uppers echelon think. It can be very comical at times, <

10 times over here my friend...most of the things i speak of are from experience not speculation...dis-heartening to say the least but oh well...imo most tax funded agencies are not worried about money being wisely spent...they know if the money in their budgets is not spent it will result in a loss of funding the following year, so...if need be they will waste it by whatever means necessary to ensure they receive it the following year...instead of getting a pat on the back for operating under budget, which seems to me the way it should be, they are penalized by not getting it the following year.

If you worked for them you know (hopefully) the nature of the things of which i speak...it just boils down to if you're willing to play the game...i for one do not play well with that mindset and am proud of it, ya know.

To me some things take presidence over the 'almighty dollar'...but when it comes down to rocking or rowing the boat from what i have seen most learn to row.

bm

[Thom]

Brownieman:

I understand what you are saying to an extent but having fished lots of tailwaters around the USA....Ours in MO and the ones in Arkansas are head and shoulders above most.

I agree that sometimes bad decisions are made but the approach that TU and other activist organizatons has taken can make an impact of govt and administration decisions. I think if you got to know some of the Conservation folks you might find that there are a lot of them that try to make good decisions.

My point being that Dano's suggestion of feeding input back to those in charge can't hurt and if you see what TU has done in othere areas to change bad decisions etc you have to agree.

What those of us that fish the tailwaters have learned can perhaps bring about change if we seek ways to offer the suggestions in good faith.

I think what I am saying is you can catch more flies with sugar than vinegar.

Don't get me wrong we still have a long way to go but what has been accomplished in MO in the way of a Trout freindly is outstanding.

I have asked outfitters and sportsman that I have met where to go for tailwaters and almost every time Mo is one of the first to mention. I have had some say why did you drive all the way out here if you are near Ark or Mo. Our course you know the answer to that question.

Much of the problem out west and in the east is much of the Trout waters are private and their state political powers want to keep it that way.