basska Posted Sunday at 01:26 AM Author Posted Sunday at 01:26 AM 10 hours ago, basska said: Well, I lied. As I type this, I’m at a gas station in Nevada, MO fueling up. I don’t know if I should cut east now or head for glory in McDonald co. The tug is the drug, I guess. Waded the Elk at Mt. Shira access…. Had my best numbers wading one access ever. Probably caught 20 Smallies in one long, awesome looking pool. Problem was, they were ALL small. All in the 8-12 range. Lost one that might’ve been 15 or so…. It was still a blast. Lloyd 1
basska Posted Sunday at 01:27 AM Author Posted Sunday at 01:27 AM 42 minutes ago, WestCentralFisher said: Today I ran into a guy on the middle Current River with a big baitcasting rod spooled with what looked like 20 pound test. He asked if I'd caught any big ones. I said no, not really, most of my smallies were in the 8-12 inch range, but I'd seen one that looked real nice, maybe about 20 inches. He said "Oh, no, I meant real big ones." Either he's a really good fisherman or he didn't know what a danged fine smallmouth bass was. Wild. 20 is definitive trophy status. WestCentralFisher 1
Al Agnew Posted Sunday at 02:47 AM Posted Sunday at 02:47 AM 90% of the people who catch good smallmouth vastly overestimate their weight, and often their length as well. That guy that dismissed 20 inchers probably has never caught a 20 incher, but believes the 18 inchers he's caught were 22 inches and 7 pounds. In reality, it takes a really chunky 20 incher to make 4 pounds. Most 18 inchers won't quite reach 3 pounds. The average person catches a 16 incher and thinks for sure that it's a 3-pounder, when it's probably not over 2 pounds. It's always been this way. Back 50 years ago, I would read the big hunting and fishing magazines, and there would be ads for guide services on the White River. Some of these guides also offered trips for smallmouth on Crooked Creek. They advertised that Crooked Creek was full of 3-5 pound smallmouth, with some reaching 6 pounds. I thought naively that Crooked Creek must be the mecca of big Ozark smallmouth. Later, I figured out that Crooked Creek is no more capable of producing 5 pound smallmouth than any other Ozark stream, and those 3-5 pounders were actually 16-18 inchers, and the 6 pounders might be 20 inchers. You always wonder, though, whether somebody else is catching bigger fish or more big fish than you are. I've caught a heck of a lot of big Ozark stream smallmouth, but there have been guys on here at times that swore they caught a lot more big fish than I ever have; that they catch these 4-5 pound smallmouth every time they go. Who knows, maybe it's true. I used to keep careful records, and when I did, I found that I caught something like one 18 incher per 10-12 hours of angling, and averaged maybe one legitimate 20 incher per 100 hours of fishing. I think that these days, my average on 18 plus inchers might be a little bit better, but the 20s still come darned rarely...seems like I catch a dozen 19 inchers for every 20. Anything that reaches 21 inches is pretty much the fish of a lifetime for most river smallmouth anglers, and a 22 incher is an incredible fish for anybody I know. I've been fortunate enough to catch a 22 incher and a rather slender 22.5, both of which weighed 5 pounds even on a scale that probably wasn't completely accurate. In recent years I've caught a couple that were 21.5 inches or slightly longer, but didn't reach 22 inches. But my heaviest smallmouth ever, no matter where caught, was a 21.5 incher caught in Minnesota where they are a lot thicker and heavier for their length; I didn't weigh it but I'm certain it weighed more than any smallmouth I've ever caught in the Ozarks. However, I consider the biggest smallmouth I've caught in the Ozarks were "better" catches because they come so few and far between. The thing I strive to do in smallmouth fishing is to catch GOOD fish consistently, using the lures and techniques I like to use. If you catch plenty of good fish, a big one will come along now and then. One of my fishing buddies classifies fish like this: there are "nice'uns", those fish that are better than average, like 15 inch smallmouth. "Good'uns", like 17 inchers. "Big'uns", like those 18-19 inchers. And "Holy crap, what a fish'uns", the ones over 20. Lloyd 1
basska Posted Sunday at 03:33 AM Author Posted Sunday at 03:33 AM 1 hour ago, Al Agnew said: 90% of the people who catch good smallmouth vastly overestimate their weight, and often their length as well. That guy that dismissed 20 inchers probably has never caught a 20 incher, but believes the 18 inchers he's caught were 22 inches and 7 pounds. In reality, it takes a really chunky 20 incher to make 4 pounds. Most 18 inchers won't quite reach 3 pounds. The average person catches a 16 incher and thinks for sure that it's a 3-pounder, when it's probably not over 2 pounds. It's always been this way. Back 50 years ago, I would read the big hunting and fishing magazines, and there would be ads for guide services on the White River. Some of these guides also offered trips for smallmouth on Crooked Creek. They advertised that Crooked Creek was full of 3-5 pound smallmouth, with some reaching 6 pounds. I thought naively that Crooked Creek must be the mecca of big Ozark smallmouth. Later, I figured out that Crooked Creek is no more capable of producing 5 pound smallmouth than any other Ozark stream, and those 3-5 pounders were actually 16-18 inchers, and the 6 pounders might be 20 inchers. You always wonder, though, whether somebody else is catching bigger fish or more big fish than you are. I've caught a heck of a lot of big Ozark stream smallmouth, but there have been guys on here at times that swore they caught a lot more big fish than I ever have; that they catch these 4-5 pound smallmouth every time they go. Who knows, maybe it's true. I used to keep careful records, and when I did, I found that I caught something like one 18 incher per 10-12 hours of angling, and averaged maybe one legitimate 20 incher per 100 hours of fishing. I think that these days, my average on 18 plus inchers might be a little bit better, but the 20s still come darned rarely...seems like I catch a dozen 19 inchers for every 20. Anything that reaches 21 inches is pretty much the fish of a lifetime for most river smallmouth anglers, and a 22 incher is an incredible fish for anybody I know. I've been fortunate enough to catch a 22 incher and a rather slender 22.5, both of which weighed 5 pounds even on a scale that probably wasn't completely accurate. In recent years I've caught a couple that were 21.5 inches or slightly longer, but didn't reach 22 inches. But my heaviest smallmouth ever, no matter where caught, was a 21.5 incher caught in Minnesota where they are a lot thicker and heavier for their length; I didn't weigh it but I'm certain it weighed more than any smallmouth I've ever caught in the Ozarks. However, I consider the biggest smallmouth I've caught in the Ozarks were "better" catches because they come so few and far between. The thing I strive to do in smallmouth fishing is to catch GOOD fish consistently, using the lures and techniques I like to use. If you catch plenty of good fish, a big one will come along now and then. One of my fishing buddies classifies fish like this: there are "nice'uns", those fish that are better than average, like 15 inch smallmouth. "Good'uns", like 17 inchers. "Big'uns", like those 18-19 inchers. And "Holy crap, what a fish'uns", the ones over 20. I’ve caught quite a few 15s and one 16. they’ve always made my day… Still never got a verifiable 17 this year. I’m not one to lie, of course…. There’s a lot of dignity in stream Smallmouth, I find. I’m curious though Al, what do you think about the guy I met that said there was a state record bass caught out of the Mineral Fork? Is it even possible in a stream that size? At first I dismissed it, but he was a serious angler, and knew what he was talking about. He also referenced it being out of season and beating it by one ounce… Makes me think… maybe? I do think there probably are a couple state record fish in the streams. Jeff Schultz and Tommy Bemch have caught some definitive 6 lbers, and I have known anglers I truly do believe report 23 inch Ozark stream Smallmouth…
WestCentralFisher Posted Sunday at 02:16 PM Posted Sunday at 02:16 PM 11 hours ago, Al Agnew said: 90% of the people who catch good smallmouth vastly overestimate their weight, and often their length as well. That guy that dismissed 20 inchers probably has never caught a 20 incher, but believes the 18 inchers he's caught were 22 inches and 7 pounds. In reality, it takes a really chunky 20 incher to make 4 pounds. Most 18 inchers won't quite reach 3 pounds. The average person catches a 16 incher and thinks for sure that it's a 3-pounder, when it's probably not over 2 pounds. It's always been this way. Back 50 years ago, I would read the big hunting and fishing magazines, and there would be ads for guide services on the White River. Some of these guides also offered trips for smallmouth on Crooked Creek. They advertised that Crooked Creek was full of 3-5 pound smallmouth, with some reaching 6 pounds. I thought naively that Crooked Creek must be the mecca of big Ozark smallmouth. Later, I figured out that Crooked Creek is no more capable of producing 5 pound smallmouth than any other Ozark stream, and those 3-5 pounders were actually 16-18 inchers, and the 6 pounders might be 20 inchers. You always wonder, though, whether somebody else is catching bigger fish or more big fish than you are. I've caught a heck of a lot of big Ozark stream smallmouth, but there have been guys on here at times that swore they caught a lot more big fish than I ever have; that they catch these 4-5 pound smallmouth every time they go. Who knows, maybe it's true. I used to keep careful records, and when I did, I found that I caught something like one 18 incher per 10-12 hours of angling, and averaged maybe one legitimate 20 incher per 100 hours of fishing. I think that these days, my average on 18 plus inchers might be a little bit better, but the 20s still come darned rarely...seems like I catch a dozen 19 inchers for every 20. Anything that reaches 21 inches is pretty much the fish of a lifetime for most river smallmouth anglers, and a 22 incher is an incredible fish for anybody I know. I've been fortunate enough to catch a 22 incher and a rather slender 22.5, both of which weighed 5 pounds even on a scale that probably wasn't completely accurate. In recent years I've caught a couple that were 21.5 inches or slightly longer, but didn't reach 22 inches. But my heaviest smallmouth ever, no matter where caught, was a 21.5 incher caught in Minnesota where they are a lot thicker and heavier for their length; I didn't weigh it but I'm certain it weighed more than any smallmouth I've ever caught in the Ozarks. However, I consider the biggest smallmouth I've caught in the Ozarks were "better" catches because they come so few and far between. The thing I strive to do in smallmouth fishing is to catch GOOD fish consistently, using the lures and techniques I like to use. If you catch plenty of good fish, a big one will come along now and then. One of my fishing buddies classifies fish like this: there are "nice'uns", those fish that are better than average, like 15 inch smallmouth. "Good'uns", like 17 inchers. "Big'uns", like those 18-19 inchers. And "Holy crap, what a fish'uns", the ones over 20. Yeah, at this point unless it's a true giant, which I'll let you all know when it happens, it just call any notable fish "a real good one". It describes what I'm thinking well enough, and has the benefit of being impossible to actually disprove.
Members Lloyd Posted Sunday at 06:47 PM Members Posted Sunday at 06:47 PM 18 hours ago, WestCentralFisher said: Today I ran into a guy on the middle Current River with a big baitcasting rod spooled with what looked like 20 pound test. He asked if I'd caught any big ones. I said no, not really, most of my smallies were in the 8-12 inch range, but I'd seen one that looked real nice, maybe about 20 inches. He said "Oh, no, I meant real big ones." Either he's a really good fisherman or he didn't know what a danged fine smallmouth bass was. I'm sure that guy's a REALLY good fisherman, like Jimmy Houston status. And he's not gonna be impressed until you show him a 30 inch smallmouth 🤣. WestCentralFisher 1
Members Lloyd Posted Sunday at 07:07 PM Members Posted Sunday at 07:07 PM 16 hours ago, Al Agnew said: One of my fishing buddies classifies fish like this: there are "nice'uns", those fish that are better than average, like 15 inch smallmouth. "Good'uns", like 17 inchers. "Big'uns", like those 18-19 inchers. And "Holy crap, what a fish'uns", the ones over 20. Totally agree with this classification. Here's the way I see it: 10 - 12 inches: I'd rather catch 'em than not. 12 - 16 inches: hell yeah these are really fun fish. 17 inches: bread and butter big fish. I'm taking a picture. 18 inches: beasts, but still fairly common. 19 inches: elite stream smallmouth 20+: legendary monster
Members Lloyd Posted Sunday at 07:13 PM Members Posted Sunday at 07:13 PM 15 hours ago, basska said: I’m curious though Al, what do you think about the guy I met that said there was a state record bass caught out of the Mineral Fork? Is it even possible in a stream that size? At first I dismissed it, but he was a serious angler, and knew what he was talking about. He also referenced it being out of season and beating it by one ounce… Makes me think… maybe? I do think there probably are a couple state record fish in the streams. Jeff Schultz and Tommy Bemch have caught some definitive 6 lbers, and I have known anglers I truly do believe report 23 inch Ozark stream Smallmouth… I realize I'm not Al Agnew but I can't help weighing in on this. The official state record smallmouth was 7 lb.s, 2 oz., and I don't think it's a coincidence that it was caught in a reservoir, not a creek. I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unlikely. tjm 1
WestCentralFisher Posted Monday at 12:29 AM Posted Monday at 12:29 AM 5 hours ago, Lloyd said: Totally agree with this classification. Here's the way I see it: 10 - 12 inches: I'd rather catch 'em than not. 12 - 16 inches: hell yeah these are really fun fish. 17 inches: bread and butter big fish. I'm taking a picture. 18 inches: beasts, but still fairly common. 19 inches: elite stream smallmouth 20+: legendary monster Yeah, for me to the sense I quantify this, 15-16 inches and I'll really want to put the fish in the net and will spend a minute or two being bummed out about it if I don't, even if it would have been my 20th fish that day. 17-18 inches and it's something of an event, and if I land it, unless I'm close to the beginning of the day, or saw a bigger one chase after it during the fight (which does occasionally happen), I'm liable to stop fishing afterwards and go for a hike or just paddle and enjoy the scenery if I'm floating. I'm probably not going to top that, and what else am I trying to prove? Anything even marginally over 18 inches is a big, big deal and likely to be the highlight of not only the trip, but maybe the season. I've caught a few over the years in the 19-20 inch size class (none larger), and I remember every one well. There is not a single one of those where there wasn't a moment I was absolutely certain I was going to lose the fish. Lloyd 1
Al Agnew Posted Monday at 01:34 AM Posted Monday at 01:34 AM 21 hours ago, basska said: I’ve caught quite a few 15s and one 16. they’ve always made my day… Still never got a verifiable 17 this year. I’m not one to lie, of course…. There’s a lot of dignity in stream Smallmouth, I find. I’m curious though Al, what do you think about the guy I met that said there was a state record bass caught out of the Mineral Fork? Is it even possible in a stream that size? At first I dismissed it, but he was a serious angler, and knew what he was talking about. He also referenced it being out of season and beating it by one ounce… Makes me think… maybe? I do think there probably are a couple state record fish in the streams. Jeff Schultz and Tommy Bemch have caught some definitive 6 lbers, and I have known anglers I truly do believe report 23 inch Ozark stream Smallmouth… Mineral Fork produces some big fish, but some of those are big ones that winter on Big River and come up the Mineral Fork to spawn. I've fished Big River all my life, and have never seen, much less caught, a smallmouth there that I thought would break 6 pounds. I once had a memorable day on Mineral Fork where I and my brother put 13 smallmouth in the canoe that were over 17 inches...the biggest one was 19.5. (That was quite a few years ago, and I wouldn't expect to be able to do that today even though the access problem means some parts of it aren't pounded all that much.) So no, I don't think you'd ever catch a 7 pound plus smallmouth on the Mineral Fork. basska and Lloyd 2
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