tjm

Nice fish, if I were you, I'd keep quiet and enjoy the very liberal carp regulations that exist. If all the fish were trophy size it'd be no challenge to catch one that big. Half the challenge is finding that special location.

Mocarp, you don't want to encourage others to fish for carp or to enjoy eating them, at least your posts aren't geared towards that, what you are advocating is getting more regulations and in particular regulations preventing two three user groups from any further practice of their methods. You would prohibit bow fishing. You would prohibit gigging. You would restrict or prohibit carp consumption. You would do this universally, not just in pay to fish ponds that you reference so often in europe/greatbritain. You come across as anti fishing, as do most groups that would restrict my pleasure/sport to possibly increase theirs. Once you have achieved your goals of regulating the carp to one fish a week over 39# as a creel limit where will these hordes of bank fisher-people sit to watch the alarms? 99.44% of the Ozarks seems to be posted private or boating access only. Regulations will eventually end fishing for all but the wealthy elite, just as in your europe the fishing has been since the middle ages. In briton there traditionally are two kinds of fisher-people; lords and poachers. Pay to fish is a relative new thing there, fish still are controlled by the wealthy. And I expect the real fishermen are still poachers. Your ancestors probably fled from that region and that mentality. Considering that in order to make the pay to fish work there needs to be no public fishing allowed, it is not surprising that europeans want to prohibit our pubic fishing for carp so they can build and rent pond fishing. You might gain more converts by describing how good carp taste and how to properly dress a carp. Pictures of heaping platters of delicious fillets being consumed by happy people. I've been encouraging carp consumption for fifty years and have gained a few converts. Set up a Carp fry and invite all OAF, MDC, and any other players for a Carp feast. Need to work on getting lots of stream bank access where we can sit to bait fish too.

See one or three a year in or within a hundred yards of my yard. would see more or more often if I paid better attention they hide pretty well. I have walked to within a few feet (20-30?) of them before seeing them. Have had dogs that would tree a lot of bobcats while coon hunting, they are not as rare as fox. 2207 were harvested in Mo in the 2015-16 furbearer season, CITES tags are mandatory so there are good records. For information on where they are in Mo see this pdf pages 13-18 https://huntfish.mdc.mo.gov/sites/default/files/downloads/2016Furbearers.pdf

NRA backed the gun control laws we have now didn't they? I read some where (several some wheres) that they did. President of NRA spoke to US Congress on the need for National Firearms Act of 1934, in the '20s they wrote the draft of the Uniform Firearms Act (model legislation for states to adopt), I remember the NRA had endorsed the Gun Control Act of 1968 and just recently saw that they want to ban bump stocks . NRA is no friend to firearms freedom.

Good summation, and I fully agree. Might. As to whether it is worth more $$ in research, I wouldn't guess that all the birds in the world contribute much to the invasives being introduced into a flyway, redistribution within a flyway is quite possible even if it is not proven. Yet one boat can move many times more of them intact propagules than a whole flock of geese, and it isn't just a theory that boats do move invasives far beyond any regional borders such as migration routes. And as mentioned above, the ability of birds to poop live zebras can't be controlled , but man's contribution can be. Sure I'd like to know if eagles could stock mountain lakes with German trout as a future feeding area for their unhatched youngins, but there may be research of higher priority to fund first. I am a bit surprised that the percentage of viable propagules appears to be that high, although I have heard that a goose will pass raw bacon intact. But then I'm not sure anything stays inside a goose long enough for transport more than a few yards.

Can't see how anyone could not believe wakes help erosion, any wave action against an unprotected bank is erosion. But who cares, eh? Wind, rain, floods, asteroids could all cause that kind erosion in time.

Guy asks a question, bunch folks said "I don't know", same guy supplies a "translation" of a paper by an unknown student and some people said "oh, yeah, maybe, I think it's possible" ; is this the link or did my computer screw up? If they had any kind of study going on all those university people from all over the world couldn't find it, and the supposed translation alluded to two or three previous such studies that again no one else is aware of? Thanks, but I was expecting something more real.

I drove by there a while back and according to the sign the park has been pay to use (honor system) for several years, there is a parking area across the road that looks as though the landowner (Bob?) has provided for fishermen to park and hike down from. And of course the MDC has the parking lot at the lower bridge. Creek looks a lot different than when I used to fish it regularly, 10-15? years ago. (before the new bridge was built) I took a little hike and looked a bit, not far though. Wouldn't take much for MDC to provide access at a couple spots, I have the notion that area is meant to be about birds though.

Ollie, same deal; pick a day and you can show me Capps. I've not really fished that since the park started charging for use.

I can imagine that some things could live in the wet parts of a bird for a time. Hard to imagine that any thing could survive a fowls digestive system. Humans are much more likely means of transport, via boat, bait bucket or wet gear. I have heard of guys toting a bucket of fish quite a walk to "stock" a pond, whatever was in the water the fish came from is also stocked, but simply carrying in bait such as wild crayfish or shiners and dumping the leftovers is enough.

MoC, Chinese ringnecks are invasive indeed and I place them with carp as a species that should be regulated as see and kill, no season/no limit, like carp they don't actually seem to do real well in the Ozarks. I have personally never seen a feral pheasant in Mo. German trout are not invasive in Mo. our coldest springs are too warm at their spawning times, we could say that Pacific trout are somewhat invasive, they do reproduce in a few streams. They are limited to those few streams though, they have been introduced in nearly all Ozark streams at some time in the past and have never succeeded. It could likely be argued that whitetail deer are invasive in parts of the Ozarks, as savanna would not have been the ideal habitat for them. Problem with you bringing other invasives to the argument is that they have no bearing on carp. Justifying a bad thing by saying there are other bad things is just a an evasion. Because Jesse James became a hero to some by stealing from others, do you advocate raising all our children to rob strangers? Stick to the carp. All carp, not just the German carp, because Germans are just as good or bad as Chinese or Japanese carp; they are all equal in being foreign. They are here now, we can't extirpate them from all our waters at this point. But because 20 people or 1000 people have fun catching the same fish twice and naming it is no reason to keep 10,000 or a million people from having fun killing that same fish on sight. If you want advocate for protection of carp, you need to establish that they are endangered and that the loss of carp would adversely impact our environment in general. Don't attempt to put the burden of that proof of the public, you stated that the big Carpguy has lots of money and wants to share, so let him/them pay. I would even donate some for restoration, if they can show that American carp exist and are in danger. Need to do the relaunch right, change the name to "The Eurocarp Society of America", more impact with truth in advertising. Give out a hundred bucks worth of Carp tackle with every membership. $500 in Carp tackle with lifetime commitment.

Chief, it has been my impression for many years that most "conservation" organizations are either in it for the money or are anti-consumptive use/animal rights people telling me the hunting will be better if I don't hunt and the fishing will be better if I don't fish. Doesn't make large difference which coast they come from. Some are even home grown. I even donated to some of those groups back in my youth. Yes, I saw where they were doing best fishing of your life trips in groups of 40, imho, 40 anglers on any stretch of stream is way less than a best fishing day.

nah, after a bit of guess and search I think he meant this bunch: http://www.missourismallmouthalliance.org/home.html So, there is no "relaunch" just hype for the youngins on social media to generate more funds ? Launch indicates getting it afloat to begin with and relaunch indicates it either ran aground or was careened. When I asked the question above I thought you'd have a story to tell about how they fell on hard times or something, now it sounds like just a bid for attention. It was sorta asked above "how many lawn chairs" , but I'll come out with it, at this moment how many paying members in the American Carp Society? And just for sake of curiosity, how many of those are American? It seems that every thing about carp is referenced to EUROPE Europe this Europeans that European countries involved in the big contest in NY way back Europe etc. Truth be told there ain't any such animal as an American carp, we got invasive carp from two or three different places one of which is Europe. Biggest claim I found on your website was the 202 people from 17 countries competed for 1 million Dollar purse for breaking the NY State record as well as $50,000 in cash and prizes of 2 Chevrolet Colorado trucks. For a million bucks we could easily get more people than that involved in a bullhead contest or even a carp shooting contest. Americans too, I bet. 2005 was 12 years ago.

Rwren, beautiful fish. Well done.

I will fish bait on a fly rod, the long rod is about all I ever use, but bait is a catch and keep tactic, imo, for any fish. One of the things I disagree with in our fisheries management.

You likely know the area better than I, haven't been too active for a few years and a lot of the access I once had is sold off to 'furriners' now. Pick a day and show me the secrets of Hickory?

Last activity they mention in the 'about us' is IGFA hair rig approval. Jan-Feb 2007?

You got me Chief, not even aware of either group til now. He said a relaunch, that to me indicates some interval of inactivity. What is MSA?

They been dead for how many years?

So, the felt wader stuff; I haven't read all the things about how that supposedly works and I should/shall, but in the mean time if the bad things are sticking to felt why aren't they sticking to clothing and sneakers of wet-waders? As to the trout in high remote lakes, many of the western trout waters had no trout before the stocking programs. About 1960 I asked how the trout got in a glacial lake on an Idaho mountain top and learned that fry were dropped from light aircraft, similar to crop dusting or fire fighting. People that told me this claimed to have been involved in such stockings. Also heard stories of pack horsing fry/fingerlings into remote areas. Been a while, but iirc, only the bull trout and cuts were native in the Rockies and Great basin. In that time and place I never heard the term "Brown trout", they were normally called "German trout" just as the carp was called "German Carp". Some place I met a guy that called them "von Behrs" or a similar German name.

Just noticed the "hi there" forum. Not much to tell, older guy that used to know a lot about fishing and fly tying .. I seem to know less each year and to forget a lot of that. You may find me at RRSP or in the Elk or Shoal Creek drainage, I might have fly rod in hand. Rarely stray past the three southwestern counties. So, hey y'all

Thought you said yourself that they didn't live well/reproduce in these streams? May be hard to believe but I think you are wrong about this because old people commented "where did them things come from?" and "I saw the biggest fish yesterday and don't know it was" It is true though that some NY politician got carp imported and stocked so his hatchery buddies could make money from the guberment. It is true that carp were widely stocked for many years, it is not true that carp were stocked in every body of water in the USA and like the other german the trout they were often stocked in places that they did not survive. The Mississippi is not actually even a concern of mine, whatever is right or wrong with it is the fault of several states so blame Minnesota and Illinois. I did read some place that Mississippi river commercial fishermen killed and sold a ton or two carp every year' Have fun with your campaign. And if you go after all tournaments, so that every fish put in the boat has to be killed and removed from the site for consumption, I be there to vote for that.

So are you against all tournament fishing? Or just when the method is not the one you chose?

nope had no idea, seriously don't care, a couple of Medalist is all the reel I have ever needed. When it comes to talking about the money in recreational fishing, tournament fishing and such like I am opposed to it all. So, you instantly lose my support for any of it. Though I do release most all catch, I truly believe in consumptive use. If that mulit dollar business was in sales of fish flesh, I might be on board. We could get rich exporting good carp bait to those places that already have the sort of fishing that you favor, and still have our waters as is . Texas is big enough to hold all the trophy carp that are needed in the entire universe. Carp are food, should leave it at that. Carp on flies fishermen indicate that crawdads are one of their favorite foods. Til you get some one at masters/doctorate level to study crawdads and carp devastation of them I will blame carp for the loss of my local mudbugs, we had 10# carp in this creek for 20-30 years, may still have, idk. Last one I saw caught (12#+) was on a crawdad about 15 years ago but I haven't fished it much since then to know.

hm. I don't recall ever seeing any native fish muddy up a flowing stream by rooting and I have seen carp do that many times. Those dumpster pictures are in Mo? I think our wanton waste regulation would prevent that, maybe not.