Chief Grey Bear

Nice fish there wader! You been holding out on us. It is always good to see some quality fish from region of the state the gets little if any reporting.

How odd you said that. As I was reading your points for fishing this creek, I kept thinking about spin fishing. It sounds like an excellent challenge. I like fly fishing for trout but, I also really like spin fishing for them too.

You are on the right track. It also provides as a host for forage for the minnows and small fry as well as other aquatic species. It really is a win-win opportunity for all.

My mistake. It was the one coke with two straws that threw me.

Plus they stated it will only cover 10% of the area. Still 90% untouched.

Well, I don't recall reading in the Wildlife Code book, that grabbers are REQUIRED to throw rocks. But you just keep looking down your nose at them. We all wish we were as refined as you are. And the next time I see some kids skipping rocks or just having fun throwing them in the creek, I'll be sure to let them know how disruptive and disrespectful they are being to the river. And that is no twist, just your words.

No need to refill that bowl. I predict a quick death.

You call drug dealers, drug dealers because they deal drugs. You call drunk drivers, drunk drivers cause they drive drunk. You are saying what a grabber does is pathetic, therefore calling them pathetic. It is the person that preforms the action you call pathetic. No spin. You are correct, grabbing can be pretty tough. And a heck of a lot of fun. There are two reasons for throwing rocks. Which by the way they are not huge rocks as some seem to think. The rocks of choice are no bigger than a golf ball. But one reason for the rock is to see if there may be some suckers in the pool. It will spook them and then you can see them. They blend in very well with the bottom and it can be very difficult to locate them if they are not on the move. The other reason is if you see some making a run for it, one person can run a head of them, toss a rock and they will turn and head the other way towards those that are with you that have set up while you are sending them back. And there is also quite a technique to the grabbing itself. You are not just radomly casting a treble hook and jerking. The most successful method it to have your hook, which is a single point hook that has been welded on what looks like an old fashioned bottle opener, which always keeps the hook in the upright possision and painted in a fluorescent color for quick and easy viewing, laying on the bottom and as the sucker comes over the hook, you then jerk it into the fish. One down and 19 more to go. You can your limit in less than 30 minutes. That is it in a nutshell.

It is blantantly obvious you have never been grabbing. And now you attact those that enjoy and keep the tradtion of sucker grabbing by calling them pathetic?? Who put you at the top of the fishing pyramid? I hope it never comes to this. But then again, since trout are not native, this may not go the way you think it might.

Can a trout tell the difference between a rock and...say a....walnut?.....hedge apple?...or any number of other objects that naturally fall into the water during the day. But why would they be more afraid of the occasional rock and not a steady stream of waders? Do you honestly think that they don't know you are there??? Every person/animal/bird/fish/what have you has a comfort zone. Cross it and you are finished.

I have fished graphite, boron and still do, and they have their place. But I still love to use my glass rods out on the river. In fact I have 3 of them, 2 fenwick woodstream Fenglass 5 1/2 footers and a 5'2" Shakespeare Wonderod with a gold Shimano BantamProMag 100X SG that is just a blast to use with soft plastics! I also have some glass fly rods. One is a St. Croix and a fenwick. Which can be a lot of fun to toss around sometimes. Like Dano says, Glass has Class! But like you, I do like graphite or boron when it comes to my lite spin rods. About time to break them out for the winter too!!!

I agree with the point of your post. But, if the grabber is their first, is he to give way to the trout fisherman? No. If the trout fisherman was there first, should he give way to the grabber? No. No one has rights over the other as determined by the method of fishing. As far as Roaring River, Zone 3 would be an excellent area for some grabbing. And rightfully so. But comparing trout parks to wild rivers is not realistic. Now that is funny. You got me there! So you are Polka band fan. That explains a lot.

I'd say after packing a lounge hair around all day, a man should be entitled to a little rock tossing. Them things can get awlful heavy.

This is certainly interesting. If I am understanding this correcetly, sucker grabbers are to give way to trout fishermen? It is ok for trout fishermen to "set up on every decent pool"? But not sucker grabbers? It is ok for trout fisherment to work their way through a pool that a grabber was set up because it "may" help the grabber? But what if it doesn't? What if it actually scatters the suckers and they abandon that pool? I guess the highlited statement in your post would depend on which type of fishing you were doing. I wouldn't think the grabbers would agree. When did we develope this whole food pyramid of sorts? And who put the trout fishermen on top? I like trout fishing as much as anyone, but I certainly would never say that I have rights to trout fish over any other form or type of fishing. Now with that being said, if you were on the pool first, they yes, then you should be extended the courtesy of having that pool to your style of fishing, if not just have the pool to yourself. I would would let you have it to yourself personally. I don't like to crowd and I don't like to be crowded. Where has common courtesy gone?

So you go from wanting to close down sections of white ribbon streams from the catch and keep club and now you don't think those that like to fish for suckers should fish certain sections of creeks? But you don't have a problem with it???? That whole post sounds like you have a problem with it.

Sucker grabbing is not done blindly such as snagging for spoonbill. It is quite the opposite. Sucker grabbing is done in relitive shallow water that is gin clear. There is no mistaking any other fish for a sucker.

What???? How is a grabber supposed to know when the next guy will be coming through? I'd say first come first served. Should we just close all waters in this state to only the holy flyflinger? I know that is not what you are saying or even meaning, its just when you read something like that it widens that cavern between the fly fisherman and the spin/bait fisherman.

It was definitly a great time. What a beautiful creek. I will be hitting that one again. Yeah, the was slow but, I did complete the trifecta. Not something I thought would have happened on that water. And I did see some really nice fish, it was just hard to make a connection with them. And we had a really nice group of...uh...really well lubricated followers following us. Everytime we stopped to let them pass, they would stop just up stream. Then when we would take off again, here they would come. Then towards the end, we were all floating together. But I really didn't care. They were very nice and when Dylan had one on, they all started hooting and hollering. But the fish got off and everyone was disappointed. Later on, I was able to hook in to one and I stood up in the canoe and took a well deserved bow to the crowd. When we got back to camp, we got down to business and began the evening meal. The menu consited of Ribeye steaks, baked tater, salad. With the fire down to good coals on went the taters. About 45 minutes later, on went the steaks. As you all know, everything taste better cooked out doors and this meal was no exception. We all ate like kings. And after a few night caps, we all turned in, well, KC went first, I hit the sack about 1:00 and who knows when Andy and Mike finally turned in. Andy was the first up though. And he had me a perfect fire ready for cooking breakfast. Sunday morning we had pancakes, bacon, sausage, fried taters and fried eggs. And yes Andy, I have to agree it was pretty tasty. I think it was the secret seasoning for the taters that really makes it so good! We went through 2 dozen eggs, 2 lbs sausage, 10lbs taters, a couple dozen pancakes, about 7 lbs of ribeyes, and a few gallons of the finest imported whiskey all the way from Kentucky. Not to mention the shore lunch we all enjoyed on the float. Some of the best sandwiches to be found anywhere. I can't wait to do it again.

I have to agree. Something does not seem right. Why did the Spots pick the Meramec and seeminly go on by other similar waterways??? Why did they only swim DOWN the Missouri and UP Mississippi and only UP the Meramec and certain tribs of? There are definitely alot of questions.

Who is going after who here? You stated I was talking out both sides of my mouth. I simply pointed out that I have never made any statment about the regulations regarding the Spotted Bass. I have spoke about the theories of their movements. You on the other hand would like to change the regulations on water you may or may not ever fish. Can you see the difference?? Remember this, there is no guilt in expressing the thoughts and ideas you have about your interest and passion.

Oh yeah, I know that is right. I see them thumbing their way north all the time. And being the good samaritain I am, I alway give them a ride. Unless I see one of those signs warning me they could be escaped convicts.

The only thing for certain, is we are not certain. I really only brought it up to make a point. The armadillo has been moving north for 1000's of years. If we would have shown up 300 years later, we would consider them native. And maybe the same can said of the spot.

I am not hell bent on changing any rules. In fact, I have never addressed the issue of the rules. No double standard at all. Nice try on the spin. I won't deduct points for running out of bounds while claiming to have scored. Is the armadillo native to Missouri?

Actually there is a fourth possibility. It is not a very popular one but, one that is just as credible as any other three theories presented. Since Spots are native to the Mississippi River it is very possible that just as you stated, once the water in the Mississippi began to clear, they began to move north. I don't know that there is any way to assert weather they came from the Diversion Channel or naturally from a river from which they are native. I would say a likely possibility is both. So I don't know that we can clearly say that "one way or another, human actions" were the cause. Unless you want to allow the building of the dams and the Clean Water Act as a part ot the that. Which brings me to some other spot questions. Why did the Mississippi Spots appear to move up stream but, the Missouri River spots only moved down? Why haven't they moved up towards KC and beyond? Why don't more south flowing tribs of the Missouri have spots? It is my understanding that the spots that were stocked into the Grand River actually moved north to Iowa? It is also my understanding that spots were stocked into the Sac River in the early 40's. At least 5 years after Truman dam was completed. And that is the only stocking that I can find of any Osage River water shed. And that certainly does not mean that there were not others, I just haven't located any evidence of such. I don't know that any one of the 4 scenarios can be pinpointed as being the one. And it certainly could be a combination of any or all. They seem to certainly all have possiblilites.

Hey that is really cool woodman! I am sure you had a great time there. I haven't been to that type of festival in years. Wow that was always a great time with great culture. We will have another float this spring. Hopefully you can join us.