eric1978

Can't believe you got your rod back, that was a miracle. That first largemouth you got was a fatty. Perfect looking spinnerbait water...nice job

I've done quite a bit of backpacking and I also enjoy the minimalist philosophy. But unless you're going on a personal voyage to challenge yourself, there are some essentials that I won't go without. It's just too miserable without them. You gotta bring some kind of shelter, whether it be a lightweight backpackers tent or bivy sack or even just a tarp. Ever been stranded in an early fall rain at night with no shelter? I have. It sucks. Unless I'm only doing an overnight and I KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt it won't rain, I almost always bring something. I'll admit, though, that after a couple frosts in fall and the insects are all gone, there's nothing better than sleeping under the stars on a clear, cool night. You gotta bring some kind of water treatment capabilitly on expedition floats. When I'm floating longer than one or two nights and don't want to overload an already packed canoe with gallons of water, I'll take the filter and the chlorine drops, although when I'm backpacking sometimes I'll leave the filter at home and just use the drops if I know we'll be able to access relatively clean, flowing water. The chlorine kills everything (although the water can be a little "chunky" unfiltered), and leaving the filter at home drops about 6-8 ounces, a significant amount in backpacking terms. If I'm just doing an overnight on the canoe, bottled water is fine. You gotta bring a fire source. If you run out of food, you can cook up some sunfish. If you're cold, you can warm up. And if you're lonely, you can build yourself a friend to play with. I can't stress that enough. I like solo overnights, but I've never been as miserable as the few occassions I was alone and couldn't make a fire. Dreadfully boring and lonely. Plus, even in early fall, if temps drop enough and you fall into the drink, hypothermia is still a possibility if you don't have extra clothes and/or a fire. And why make it difficult? If you're gonna bring a flint and striker, you might as well just bring a Bic lighter and keep it in the dry bag. You gotta bring one extra set of clothes, again, purely to safeguard against hypothermia. Plus, it's really nice to take a bath in the river and change into clean undies halfway through the trip. And, you gotta stuff all that junk into a dry bag. The lighter, tent and dry clothes aren't gonna do you any good soaking wet. I did an overnight hike once in August a few years ago, and it was in the middle of a sweltering heat wave, so I left the sleeping bag at home and just stuffed a sweatshirt in my pack. Well, that night we slept down in this valley near a creek, and I FROZE. I've never made that mistake again. Even if it's 100+ and humid during the days, and mid 80s for the lows at night (like it was forecast to be on that trip), I always bring a bag. High-end synthetic and down sleeping bags are so light they don't weigh much more than a sweatshirt, and will pack down to nearly as small. So yes, you really could leave the sleeping bag at home as long as you bring some warmer clothes, I just don't really see the advantage. You of course should have the essentials with you as well, like a good knife or multi and some basic first aid stuff (which I'm guilty of leaving behind). A pint of your favorite liquor. C'mon, give yourself a break. I'll even hike this in in my backpack sometimes if I'm on more than a couple day hike. I'll put it in a plastic or Nalgene bottle so it doesn't really weigh too much. It's great for lifting your spirits if something gets you down (no fish, broken rod, stubbed toe, whatever). Could you do without all of this stuff and survive? Most likely. Would it be fun? Probably not.

Primarily on smaller rivers closer to St. Louis, usually the Meramec and it's tributaries. I try to get down to the Current and Jack's Fork occasionally. I hardly ever fish reservoirs and basically never do in the winter. I fish some smaller lakes and ponds for largemouth in winter but have several tried and true methods to catch those fish. However, the more I fish stream smallmouth, the less interest I have in anything else. So yeah, I'm really looking for info on catching smallmouth in stained to gin-clear streams during periods of cold weather, since this is where I have the least experience and confidence. Thanks for your tips!

With fall rapidly approaching and dropping water temps right behind it, I've been thinking ahead a little about catching those finicky cold-water smallies. I have to admit that I am more partial to fishing during the warmer months for all the obvious reasons: comfortable weather, more active fish, and the pleasure of watching a big fish take a lure near or on the surface. I do love the colder seasons, too. There's nothing like the serenity of being alone on a clear Ozark stream on a crisp, cool day. But for me, the catching is tough. I just haven't put in enough hours on the rivers during these months to really establish any tactics I have tremendous confidence in. I've taken some good fish on jerkbaits, and when the water gets really cold, I've had some luck on hair jigs & trailer and Senkos. I honestly have never had any good experiences with tubes. I've tied them on many times, but after just a few casts I take them off, hence my lack of confidence in them. I just feel like they are so plain and lifeless, I might as well tie on a baby carrot and throw it in the water. I know for a lot of you the tube is your default bait, and will swear it's just magic in cold water. I want to give it another shot this winter and was hoping you tube veterans could enlighten me. All advice is welcome including particular brands, sizes, colors, rigging and techniques. I know this topic has been covered many times before, but I thought it would be okay to reopen it since it is a staple smallmouth bait. Thanks all!

Pennzoil

It's such a shame, too, because it really is a great lake. A buddy and I are seriously considering buying a cheap place on a lake somewhere just to take our new families for easy vacations. We both live in St. Louis, so of course our first instinct is LOZ. It has something that none of the other reservoirs have, maybe just a comfort level because it's so familiar. But maybe it's the population that makes it so comfortable and familiar, and that also happens to be the cause of the decline of the quality of the lake. What can you do? Without a bunch of new laws that will make current residents go insane, I don't see any drastic improvements coming in the near future.

I know this is an older thread but I thought I'd add something to it. When I was going to college at Mizzou about 5-6 years ago, a friend of mine there went down to the lake on a field trip for some class (not sure which). They were dumping some kind of neon green eco-friendly dye in the toilets of some of the houses around the lake to test the integrity of their systems. He said within MINUTES the dye was visible in the lake. Nasty. It doesn't keep me out of the water, though. You probably have a better chance at getting e.coli from the door handle in a public restroom than you do in the LOZ. Even though I know it's irrational, I feel like the water in the channels is pretty clean, but when I look down at the water in some of the coves I see nothing but pee and poo. Just swim with duct tape over your lips.

After taking Al's advice, I made the switch from flouro to 4/15 power pro. Casts a mile and STRONG. I've fished it a few times in semi-clear water and a couple times in very clear water and the fish didn't seem to mind it. I casted at a couple fish I spotted and I can tell you they were much more interested in the lure than they were the line. In super-clear water like the Buffalo, I'd be more worried about the fish seeing me than seeing the line, and you can generally cast the braided line farther since you're using a smaller diameter. Also a consideration, if you are fishing faster lures like topwater, spinnerbaits, crankbaits or even jerkbaits or flukes, I don't think the visibility of the line is really that critical, since these are reaction baits and the fish aren't getting that great a look at anything. If I were fishing super-clear water in the winter with slower presentations like tubes and jigs, I'd be more inclined to worry about line visibility and would go with flouro or co-poly, or at least use a leader. I used to obsess over line visibility in clear streams and for a long time used line that was simply too light, and as a result lost my fair share of good fish. Whatever line you choose, go with something that can get in an angry beast whose burying his face in all the rocks and logs he can get to. I'd personally rather get a few less strikes because of heavier line than lose a few more good fish due to lighter line. You never miss what you never had, and it's always the good fish that breaks you off.

Al, don't worry about it. It took a little while, but it eventually took. I guess since there aren't that many administrators, you can't expect one to be on duty at all times. Thanks for your help, though.

I also discovered this forum recently and share your opinion that it is a great resource. My advice to you would be to look up Al Agnew and read everything he has written. The man knows the Ozarks like the back of his hand and has smallmouth fishing down to a science. Have fun on the Buffalo.

Hey Al, I was wondering if you knew what was going on over there at riversmallies.com. I signed up earlier today but still can't access any of the forums. You think the administrators are asleep at the switch or is there a reason my membership can't be approved? Just asking because I saw you were messing around over there a few minutes ago.

Geez, that thing looks almost too nice to use. Are you planning on taking it on shallow, rocky streams?

Hoglaw, I also do about 90% of my fishing in streams and have used just about every Shimano reel made from mid-quality to the most expensive. I would classify a Citica as a very mediocre reel and would only recommend it to someone who is buying their first reel or someone who doesn't fish much. I don't think I would spend the money to get it serviced, but instead put that money toward a new, better reel. For cost to quality ratio, I think the Curado is the way to go. If you compare it to the Chronarch, it's essentially the same reel with some slight differences, but to me it's not worth the extra money for the Chronarch. Like I said in my earlier post, I've never used the new 200E models, but I did just buy a 200E7 from eBay for $149.00, which is a very reasonable price for a good quality reel. For spinning I use only Sustains, and have had very few problems. Had a Stella for a while, but it was so expensive and pretty I hardly ever used it. I felt more like setting it in a platinum ring like a diamond and wearing it as jewelry than I did beating it up on float trips, so I sold it.

Thanks Al, for the great pointers. Chances are we'll do exactly one of the two floats you described, especially if it's going to be a little cooler that weekend and I feel like the population will be low. Concerning the SPEEDO HATCH. The wife and I took a vacation to Boston this summer and one of the days we took a ferry to Provincetown, Cape Cod because we wanted to take a whale watching cruise. Well, I don't know if you guys know about Provincetown (we didn't), but I can tell you it was a SPEEDO PLAGUE and we spotted a lot more balls than just the beach kind. They were all very friendly and accommodating, but I felt like we had landed on another planet. The whale watching was INCREDIBLE, though. I was on the back of the boat looking over the rail and a humpback surfaced and basically soaked me with its spout. Unbelievable. Note: I hear that Massachusettes has some very good smallmouth fishing, but since my wife's idea of a float trip is reading Huckleberry Finn for the hundredth time, it was out. Too bad.

All I've ever used for baitcasting are Chronarchs and Curados, and honestly I've had more problems with the Chronarchs (very few problems). IMHO they are basically the same reel and suck you in for the extra $80-$100 for the Chronarch just because they're silver and pretty. Never used the new models but just ordered a Curado 200E7 from eBay for $149.00. I'll post the report card after I take it on a stream and drop it in the water and sand. They are fairly complicated and delicate pieces of equipment and I think a certain amount of maintenance should be expected.

I just saw a copy of 200 Missouri Smallmouth Adventures by Chuck Tyron on eBay and they were asking $278.95 for it. Uh...can someone explain that to me?

Don't get me wrong, I put down my fair share of beers on some floats. But I never float with a huge group (no more than four of us, two canoes), I don't get falling over wasted, screaming, playing bumper canoes with other floaters, flipping over and losing a whole day's trash into the river, along with jello shot cups and mardi gras beads. It's not that I don't like to tie on a good buzz (corny pun intended) when I'm on the river, it's just that I don't behave like an butt. What's so hard about that? It only takes one aluminum giant bumping into rocks to ruin fishing there for a half hour or so, which is really the thing that bugs me most. But they have every right to be there. If they would just shut up and stop littering and respect the river, no one could really say anything. I'm surprised to hear the opinion that it's gonna be really packed a couple weeks after labor day. All the kiddies and DCIs (drunk college idiots) will be well back into school by then. If you guys had to float the Meramec during peak season, which stretch upstream from Meramec State Park would you float?

Actually we originally decided on upper Jack's Fork, because it's one of our favorites and don't really see many other floaters even in summer. But it's quite a bit longer drive (equals less time fishing) and I love the Meramec and haven't been on it for a few years because of the drunk college kids. I just wanted to try to revisit it during a semi-warm month. I was hoping if we put in below the Huzzah we might miss the bulk of the people, especially on the second half of the float on Sunday. Maybe I'll wait until Oct/Nov to do the Meramec. Decisions, decisions. Thanks for your tips.

A couple buddies and I are trying to plan a float on the middle or upper Meramec mid to late September. We have to make it a Sat/Sun float to fit their schedules. You guys think the idiots will be done with the river by then? Any ideas on avoiding them if they're still out? We'll be doing an overnight, so any tips on logistics to avoid other floaters would be useful and appreciated. Thanks a lot, Eric

Didn't see a Big River sub-category, so I figured I'd put it here since it's the Bourbeuse's tributary partner to the Meramec. (Why no Big River sub-cat in the forum)? Anyway, I've backpacked along some of the middle stretches of the Big River, and always wanted to fish it, but never have, so decided to give it a shot. Drove to an MDC access on an upper stretch, and arrived around 9:30. The weather was absolutely beautiful, and I felt like I was in Canada in August instead of Missouri. Caught two smallmouth right at the access, a 12 incher and a 13 incher on a 4 inch Dog-X. Waded downstream a bit, but the water was a little big to wade for my liking. Long stretches of slack water 4-5 feet deep made mobility a little less than ideal, so I headed back to the truck. Caught no other fish in about an hour and a half on that stretch. Will definitely come back with a canoe some time. Drove quite a bit farther upstream and parked at an unmarked access a little before noon. The water was much skinnier and I was a little worried that it couldn't even hold bigger fish, but it was clearer and cleaner looking water and was very inviting to wade so I gave it a shot. Spent the rest of the day wading this stretch. Not sure how far downstream I went, but I would guess somewhere around 2 miles. Started with the Dog-X and caught a 13 inch largemouth and about half a dozen smallmouth under twelve inches on my way downstream. The fishing seemed very slow; lots of half-hearted strikes. On my way back upstream I switched to a 4 inch fluke (pearl belly/golden-brownish back) and had better results. Caught about half a dozen largemouth and 15 or so smallmouth; three of the smallmouth went between 13-14 inches. I never came across any water that got me very excited. Lots of riffles, but they never spilled into water more than a couple feet deep. Caught most of the fish in semi-slack stretches between riffles (I'm sure the fish weren't all that thrilled with being trapped in these stretches, either). Made it back to the access around 7:30 and stopped to thoroughly fish the pool under the bridge, which was the best water I had encountered on that entire stretch. I was convinced of my suspicions that the water was too small to hold bigger fish when I caught a fat, healthy 18 inch smallmouth. He was in about two feet of water, tucked under the bank in the mouth of an eddy, and he creamed my fluke the second it touched the water. That made my day. Kept fishing until dark and caught a few more smallmouth under 12 inches and saw a monster that had to go 20 inches, but he saw me before I saw him, so needless to say, he wasn't very interested in my offering. Forgot to mention I also saw 2 fish swimming together that I'm 99% certain were spots, both about 8-9 inches, but caught none all day. So, summary: Temp: 78 deg. F, sunny, slight breeze Clarity: 3-3.5 ft. upstream, 2.5-3 ft farther down Current: normal Depth: all fish caught in 1-5 feet of water Largemouth: 8, all 13 inches or less Spots: 0, saw 2 Smallmouth: about 25 at 13 inches or less, three between 13-14 inches, one 18 incher One sunfish who thought he was a bass Not what I would call a great day of fishing, but the one 18 incher, the perfect weather and the isolation was all I needed to call it a great day in general. Eric

I posted this same question in the intro section, but I thought I would stick it here as well for better results. I'm planning on taking a buddy fishing this weekend who probably can't handle a marathon day of wading. We're a little tight on time this weekend, so we're planning on leaving the canoe at home and just walking a few miles up or down from an access. I was thinking of trying Mineral Fork, upper Big River, Joachim Creek or the upper Bourbeuse since they're the closest. You guys know any stretches that are easily wadable on these streams? We're just looking to hit a few pools and land a couple of the brown ones. C&R only, of course. Thanks guys.

Hey Tom. I took three trips to Lake Fork in my late teens (about 10-12 years ago) and I give that lake credit for changing my love of bass fishing to a passion. It was an incredible place, with all the timber and GIANT fish. Being from MO, it was the first time I experienced feeling so casual about landing 3 and 4 pounders, which happened all day, every day. Also the first time I caught a fish whose mouth I felt like I could fit my whole head in, an 11.2 pounder, my biggest still to date. I only know of one place in Missouri that can produce numbers of quality fish like Lake Fork (smaller on average of course), but it's a private lake (actually a series of small lakes) and it's $100 a day. I heard shortly after my last trip to Fork that the fish got sick. How's the fishing now? I've always wanted to go back, but have been scared off by rumors that fishing isn't what it used to be. Take care.

Hey everyone. Just wanted to introduce myself before I started posting elsewhere. I live in St. Peters, MO, fish almost exclusively smallmouth in MO streams, and don't get out nearly enough. My favorite float is the upper Jack's Fork, but can usually only get down there once a year. My dad just sold his house and property right on the Huzzah, so I've spent most of my time fishing that area of the state. Since the luxury of having a place down there is now gone, I've been thinking about branching out. I'm planning on doing some wading this weekend, and thought about trying Mineral Fork, upper Big River or Joachim Creek, since they are so close to St. Louis. Also considered the upper Bourbeuse, but kind of get the sense from reading older posts that it's not the most wader-friendly stream. How about higher up like the Mint Spring access? I plan on taking a buddy who isn't in terrible shape, but tends to tire out faster than I do. You guys have any ideas for these areas? I'll also disclose immediately that I use only artificials and always always catch and release. I don't even keep spots in areas where they're considered problematic since I don't care to lug around dead fish and I couldn't bring myself to toss any bass on a shore to die. My friends and I do a lot of backpacking and we are very strict about the "leave no trace" philosophy. So I pledge an oath to you all to leave your beloved streams and forests in better shape and cleaner than I find them. Thanks to all of you who contribute to this forum and especially Al Agnew, who appears to me to be an absolute gold mine of information on smallmouth fishing in Missouri. Sorry for the long post, I can be long winded when I'm excited . I may post this question in another area for better results, sorry if that's irritating. Thanks for your help!