Comment Thread - Shuffling

[johnnymiller]

As i said we need to limit shuffling to only those who need to feed their family. I think a special sign or tag should be sold to someone to allow suffling. Great another tag for fishing. Wonder if we could limit the suffle to one foot only

[2sheds]

Illegal

Intentionally disrupting the bottom of a riverbed is obviously going to distrupt the geology, plant life, and aquatic life of Taneycomo. Long term, it will not improve fishing. So it should be designated as "illegal". No sensible farmer would plow downhill rather than follow the contours. This is the same issue.

However, such a law is eminently un-enforceable. Therefore the main benefit of changing the law would be to provide a foundation of fact to support future communications:

1) Shuffling should receive the connotation of "poor sportsmanship".

2) We will do more to discourage shuffling by education and awareness, than by asking MoDOC to enforce such a subjective law.

3) Those reading and responding to this forum (who care about the future of fishing and outdoor recreation) will have 100x the impact of any MoDOC tickets.

4) The fact that we are not 100% in agreement is interesting in itself and suggests an opportunity to sort out our reasons.

[5cuff]

Shuffling would be impossible if many Taneycomo anglers knew where they were supposed to stand. One of my biggest gripes is people who stand where they should be fishing. The chutes before and after rebar are prime examples. If you can cast at all, you should never venture too far off the gravel. Just keep walking the area with your drift and circle back to the top. People ruin it by standing in one spot all day...usually in the middle of the stream. I've caught numerous quality fish in just inches of water by keeping back from the edge and resisting the urge to wade halfway across the streambed. This is nothing to brag about, it is just Flyfishing 101 to work from the near bank to the middle and then the far bank.

Although it is kind of aggressive, I like to catch fish that are close to the feet of guys who are overly enamored with their waders. Nothing is more humorous than watching a guy waist deep in the water soil his waders when you catch several fish between him and the shore...while barely geting your feet wet. They always seem legitimately shocked, as if you caught the fish on dry land or pulled him out of your hat!

I believe that some of these "waders" are shufflers, and others just don't know how to fish. Maybe we should ban waders on Taney during the Summer months. At least then shuffling would have more of a cost/benefit analysis and it might keep the less accomplished flyfishermen from standing in the prime fishing areas. Tevas and shorts for everyone! (ah...the only way to wade fish) The last thing we need, though, are more people who think that just because you are catching 40 fish in an average morning, you must be up to no good. Don't be jealous, maybe this guy just knows what he's doing.

In sum, I would ban the use of waders on Taney from May through September. I would also make it legal to heckle shufflers, mid-stream standers and anyone who can't catch a fish while in the possession of equipment valued in excess of $1,000.

Off the subject...when someone with really expensive equipment is in the middle of a long drought, and finally asks you for advice it is a golden opportunity:

Fancy Equipment Guy: "So, what are you using over there?"

Me: "Nothing special, just this little home tie, but I will tell ya something...(conspiratorial look)...I'm catching them all in the exact same spot. (long pause...waiting for FEG to take the bait)

FEG: "Well...where?"

Me: (turning back to the water) "Right in the lip." (You can also add an insult for the FEG if he's been obnoxious, condescending or just plain annoying...as in "Right in the lip, ______.")

Classic.

[Snow Fly]

ILLEGAL!

[Snow Fly]

Phil: I could be wrong but I think in Arkansas chumming is legal. I was fishing at North Fork River and while wading noticed a live bait guide throwing corn in the immediate area he had his clients fishing. I was shocked!! When I returned to the cabin I was complaining to some of the group about guides chumming and they showed me in the regs that it was not illegal. I could hardly believe it.

[Danoinark]

Phil: I could be wrong but I think in Arkansas chumming is legal. I was fishing at North Fork River and while wading noticed a live bait guide throwing corn in the immediate area he had his clients fishing. I was shocked!! When I returned to the cabin I was complaining to some of the group about guides chumming and they showed me in the regs that it was not illegal. I could hardly believe it.

This is from the new Ark. Regs ... Dano

No chumming: Chumming is not allowed in trout waters designated as catch-and-release. Chumming is defined as dislodging or depositing any substance not attached to a hook which may attract fish. Chumming in catch-and-release areas is prohibited because normal trout feeding behavior can be disrupted and the stream environment can be damaged. One common example of chumming is tossing canned corn into the water to stimulate feeding. The technique of dislodging material from the streambed to attract trout, known as the “San Juan Shuffle,” is also considered chumming.

Herding trout prohibited: Trout may not be driven, harassed or pursued with noise, objects, boats or by wading to concentrate them.

[Snow Fly]

Thanks Dano ! Does the regs say anything about outside the catch & release areas. On the day this took place {2005} I was fishing in the area of Gene's Trout Resort where the corn was being thrown. Just wondering.

[Randall]

well, its been a while since i posted on here, but i'm drunk and i'm gonna go ahead and break my favorite rule... never argue with an idiot because they'll only drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

gone fishin... you asked how any reasonable person could associate baiting deer with shuffling. you then compared shuffling with kicking up the trail you use to walk to your stand. i was not comparing the acts, but the ethics of the acts. you mis-qouted me once, then insulted me. i gave you the benefit of the doubt when you misquoted me, but i took offense when you could not come up with a better argument to my comparison between baiting and shuffling than a weak personal insult.

i'll be the first to admit that my fly-fishing skills are nothing notable, but i'm getting better with each time i get on the water. why? maybe its because i talk to people and learn new techniques, figure out others, and learn from my mistakes.

after meeting 4 of the members of the forum here, i had the best day on taney since i started fly fishin seriously last summer. i learned to how to swing, fish a some new patterns, a little about entemology, and a few new techniques for tying. thanks to all four of you, you know who you are, i really don't want to drop names here.

i also like to think that i educated a gentleman about shuffling. i began talking to him just before he hit the water. he was telling me how he was set up to catch the fish at his feet, until i told him that shuffling was unsportsmanlike, and taught him some of the same things i had learned since my first visit last summer.

if you want to know why i hate shuffling so much, i'll tell you why. any person that can afford to purchase a fly rod, and every person i have seen fishing the trophy area does not fish solely for the purpose of putting food on the table. they fish for sport. shuffling is not sporting, i believe it to be hard on the streambed, it is unattractive, and it is unnenessary to catch fish. a man i have very much respect for said something i like, "if i want to catch fish, i will, otherwise, i'm gonna play around and perfect my game."

missouri has 4 trout parks for people who want to catch fish on every cast. trophy areas like uppper taneycomo should be reserved for those who truly enjoy the art of fooling their quarry and improving their fishing skills by learning new techniques and perfecting those already learned.

gone fishin, i understand that you are not a shuffler, and you have been okay at playing devil's advocate, but don't put a period where i put a comma, and don't insult me.

[diamond dave]

Lets see how many times we can beat a dead horse. Carefull there

may be nothing left for the buzzards. Ha Ha.

[Danoinark]

Dave

I couldn't find anything in the regs that said you couldn't outside the C and R areas...

Dano