Bears

[Chief Grey Bear]

....... I always like how they barter with our native animals for ones that cause problems like bears, rattlesnakes, and otters.

Don't forget all those pesky ruffed grouse and prairie chickens we bartered for in the past and are now causing problems all over the state....

Close but not quite. Missouri has never bartered for rattlesnakes or bear. As for Ruffed Grouse it has been many, many years since they have been released here. Only this year did Missouri release some Prairie Chickens. And just for the record did not have to trade for them. They came from KS and were told basically that you can have them if you come and get them. So they did.

Now I will give you otters. Some things are too successful and they have admited that it is was a mistake and wish they hadn't have done it.

[drew03cmc]

If I am not mistaken, the black bears and river otters are both historically native to the state of Missouri, so barter for them or not, they have been there, just not in the numbers they are now. The otters are hellions that MDC is now trying to eradicate from the Ozark streams that they like morons put them in.

Black bears, are native to the Ozark plateau, IIRC.

[Chief Grey Bear]

Not disputing the fact that they are native. Never said they wasn't. What I am saying the MDC or any other agency has never released bears or rattlesnakes within the borders of this state. And all other beings that were listed were aslo native.

As for the otters, they were basically, if not completely, extinct from this state. To keep a more natural balance in nature and to reintroduce an animal that was eradicated possibly due to over harvest among other circumstances, the MDC brought them back.

But as I said before, it was too successful. Many items contributed to that. One of those could be the amount of stocked ponds that now abound through out this state. Nothing more than a free picnic for them. An abundant food source will always increase the survival rates of any animal and increase birth rates. Case in point here.

But to call them morons is not only disrespectful but somewhat juvenile for an agency that provides so much for everyone to enjoy. Think about that next time you slip across the line to hunt or fish. Just my opinion. You are under no pressure to agree.

[jdmidwest]

Bears were around before, then were run or hunted out like most of our native game just like deer and turkeys. MDC is responsible for bringing back the deer and turkeys to the numbers we have today. I don't buy the theory that they came in from Arkansas, I think a few were planted as an experiment and they have took hold. I would not think that they would make it public that they have reintroduced a possible dangerous animal but that is just my opinion.

I don't recall the specifics, but I remember a project that worked with the reintroduction of timber rattlers along I 40 or I 44. I don't think they actually traded anything for them, but I think they released them as a part of the project. The trading part is an inside joke with some of my friends. We blamed the poor turkey season this year on the MDC trapping all the turkeys and trading them for cougars or armadillos.

Elk were native animals, but with our input, MDC decided against the reintroduction of them. So were mountain lions.

Bears in MO would not be a bad thing, I would like to see enough to have an open season on them. The problem with bears is that some people feed them and they lose the fear for humans and can turn on them. Then there is an issue with livestock damage.

Otters should be extinct again. Blue herons take alot of fish also and need to be thinned out also but they are a protected species. When can we decide that they need to be controlled also like the otter? What is the benefit of having the heron population?

[Chief Grey Bear]

I'm not sure of what rattlesnake project you are speaking of. But being that the timber rattler is not an endangered species in this state they may have transplanted some that came from this state. But again I have never heard of that. Doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Rest assured Missouri has never bartered, traded, released or any other thing with bears. I am sure that Mo does have a small population of resident bears. And surely some may have been always here. But I am also quite confident that some have also at one time been Ar bears. I would say the majority of them coming to Mo are juveniles staking out there own claim and some may be making there way back to the north where they originally came from. Much like a house cat that doesn't want to move.

As far as I know, there has never been any talk of reintroducing Mt. Lions. Don't think there ever will be either.

Not sure about herons for sure, but I don't believe their main diet to be game fish. Kind of a catch 22 for some as they do like to dine on snakes. Commorants is where we need to direct our attention. Herons don't bother me.

I have read a few time that there is a small wild herd of Elk here somewhere in SWMO. I think they escaped some time back in the 80's. I don't know for sure if it is true or not.

[drew03cmc]

Well, if it was you Chief, would you have put a species in a stream that contains your "cash cow" trout? If you say no, you sir, are not a moron...Well, are they bright or not?

[Chief Grey Bear]

Well, here is how I look at it. In this world there are coachs who know what they are doing and put their butt on the line everytime. Sometimes a play doesn't work like it should.

Then there are sportscasters who write/talk about it the next day and what should have been done.

Which are you?

[taxidermist]

The bears are most likely overflow from Arkansas. Arkansas has aroound 5000 bears, more or less. Really a pretty high bear population. I have seen several bear over the years on the south shore of Bull Shoals. Several in and around the Omaha AR to Berryville area, when you consider thats not to far from Missouri. You can see its ver possible to catch overflow bear. Esp in the spring when sows are running the two year olds off.

Bear have been found in Texas, Oklahoma, Louisianna and even Mississippi with DNA traced to Arkansas bear.

AGFC is working a bear trap near Promised land area of Baxter County now. So as you can see its pretty easy for bear to travel miles looking to establish a new home range.

[HeavyC]

WOW, I had no idea that Mizz did not really have bear, I am pretty suprised as they are thick as ever here in Colorado. We are actually pretty darn dry in most parts of the state, and there is not a lot of forests in those areas, but there is still seems to be bear there.

They can be a big nuisence if they are allowed to feed on ANYTHING! Pet food is one of the biggest culprits and some areas require feeding to be really tightly controlled and no 'indoor' pets can be fed outside, for livestock as well in some places. They do also require bear proof trash containers in quite a few of the 'upper' end neighborhoods near the foothills. Otherwise most of the mountain folks just never really think about them much, they are so used to them. I have lived in Colorado since I was one year old (now 43) and have ran into ~100 bear over my lifetime. Heck, l almost had to wrestle one out of the infield one morning cause we needed to start our softball game and there were two on the field! The one 'tough guy' boar trying to stare me down finally thought wiser of it and high tailed it into the golf course next door. We watched a couple hours later when the DOW captured him, they never did find the other one! Two summer ago one was tearing up my campsite and could care less I kept poundin him with bog ol rocks! I think he finally thought 'I' was the nuisence and looked right at me with a stupid look on his face and pushed my coolers down the hill and I sware just to piss me off! Did not even bother to eat anything he finally broke open, just ruined a bunch of my food! Little boogger!

Last May though I had my first close encounter with a grizz up near Jackson Lake under the Grand Tetons. (WHILE FISHING OF COURSE! )That was pretty cool, but only managed a couple of APS pictures that I have not scanned to digital yet! Digital was packed in the bag and he was coming directly at me ~40 yards away, so I snapped two pics and then decided I felt the Ford Ranger was better cover than standing right in the open

Now I only have to run into a wolf in the wild and I am good, seen everything else 'north american' except a musk ox & maybe a different type of mountain sheep or two, there are so many and I have seen several different types!

Colorado Division of Wildlife doesn't really care for the bears too much either, I think they are just such a pain for them to deal with. ...and IMHO they really are not a key piece of the food chain since they are basically not a carnivore. Nothing threatens them and they threaten nothing else! EXCEPT MAN!

HC Out!

[Trav]

Heavy,

Good thing those bears dont wander here in my neck of the woods. My dog will freak! She is fed outside and we let her monitor all animals that enter the property. Not that we have a choice...she is an outdoor dog living in the hills and woods. My nearest niegbor is a half mile away. I think a bear would think twice when a redbone hound is barking and nipping at it. She has no fear!

Although it does suck when she kills a skunk. Haha