Information You May Find Usefull

[Ham]

The problem seems to be that Obama is a lot like Clinton in that he knows the truth, but he and the truth aren't always friends. FOR CLARITY Obama has stated repeatedly that he is not Muslim. He claims to be Christian because he knows that it would hurt him politically to be labeled as Muslim. It is odd that you would honestly consider yourself to be a Christian and make that mistake. Maybe, he just got confused about what group he was talking to that day. Personally, I do not believe Obama has a faith, but to be know as Godless would hurt him politically as well.

Obama has made a lot of moves for political expediancy that to me anyway show a lack of core beliefs to guide himself. He has done what is necessary to rise in the ranks of the DNC.

I believe Obama attended that Hate Church because it would help him politically. I am concerned about how much of that hatred seeped into him while he sat in those pews. Do you really want someone that attended that church for 20 years and didn't notice the behavior and beliefs of the preacher to be responsible for the complexity of running our country? I would have lasted 20 minutes in that church and I am not capable of running this country.

Obama hung out with and worked with the Weather Underground guy because he was part of the Chicago political machine. I don't think Obama was wanting to learn how to build a bomb from him, but I worry that he may not love our country because he has spent so long hanging out and working with people who so openly and deeply either mistrust or hate our great Nation.

Yes, there are bad deeds done by Americans everyday (and don't those get all the press), but America as a Nation and Americans as individuals do as much or more for the world than any other nation or group of people.

Just as am aside I am so tired of hearing about the Clinton surplus. There never were big piles of money laying around. It was a "projected" surplus that never came to pass. I'm not sure who projected the surplus, but I bet they didn't aim low.

The wonderful economy was based on the tech boom and a crazy ride on the stock market that had an over due correction coming. Luckily for Clinton the tech boom happened while he was in office despite him being in office NOT because he was in office. I was well aware that an economic downturn was coming when Gore vs Bush was unfolding. I really do Thank God that Bush beat Gore because Gore being on office when 9/11 happened would have been so much worse than the diaster it was.

[bigredbirdfan]

You're right Dano. I apologize kevinkirk. I shot from the hip and went with my gut feeling.

bigredbirdfan,

There is no burden on Greybear to disprove your post. If we're just going to degenerate into posting comments from talk show hosts we might as well give this pointless debate up right now. Both sides have their rhetorical nut jobs. I'm a registered Democrat, but, jeez I could not stand to listen to Olberman or Mathews...good riddance. Stop listening to the pundits and listen to the men in the campaign. Then vote. I view those pundits and talk show hosts as glorified used car salesmen. They're going to say whatever you want to hear in order to promote themselves in turn.

John Prine sang it best, "Blow up your tv, throw away your paper, move to the country, build you a home. Plant a little garden, eat a lot of peaches, try and find Jesus on your own."

I challenge either you or kevinkirk to provide unbiased evidence supporting a fraction of the portfolio you've presented on this forum. Just a little challenge. Unbiased remember. Good luck. Jimbob

You, Chief and Mark win. May not be so interesting talking to each other.

[Danoinark]

I view those pundits and talk show hosts as glorified used car salesmen. They're going to say whatever you want to hear in order to promote themselves in turn.

Absolutely. What has happened in the 4th estate is that the news business has become show business. I would never call Olberman, Limbaugh, Hannity, Geraldo, O'Reilly, Maddow or others, news reporters and journalist. They are simply entertainers and nothing more.

Dano

[soggyfeet]

Politicians dont run for office to better the country, state, or city for the most part. These are people that are power hungry and only want to get in the history books(more so in this election than others). McCain has allready made history and should be in the books. Obama will for ever be in the books if he is elected and I belive that might be his only goal of CHANGE. I dont need to go look up infomation on McCain he has been around for ever and knows DC. Obama evidently knows people in his party or they are just useing him as a puppet. Biden is the same as McCain hes been in DC for ever and knows how things work. Palin is a fresh look for people because we havent been looking at her for the last 1 1/2yr. I think the bottom line here on this forum is everyone has thier views and no one is going to change them. I dont know anyone who wants to admit that they support the wrong canidate and swich sides and for the most part you arnt voteing canidates anyway most people vote party lines. Only the true independents vote canidates. Personally I am going republican this yr after voteing dmeocrat in the last two elections. Being a union carpenter we are pushed the democrat way. I think the Unions have gone to far and have caused so much of the inflation of today. I think the republicans will try to govern more by people takeing responsibility for their oun actions and not haveing the gov bail them out. I think all kinds of gov programs should be cut FEMA, welfare, and unemployment to name a few. I think we need a sociaty where the people take care of themselves and let the Gov fight the crime and deal with other nations. Today everyone is just looking out for themselves and not the greater good of the people. I think McCain fits this better than Obama at this time. If Obama wants to change things he needs to stay in the senate vote something besides presant and come up with bills that would better our country. The presidancy is a figure head position for forigen countrys. I ust heard today that NATO was basically endorcing Obama. With all the problems we have had with NATO I wonder why they would endorce him. (NATO is like France their flag should be white)

[Chief Grey Bear]

Just as am aside I am so tired of hearing about the Clinton surplus. There never were big piles of money laying around. It was a "projected" surplus that never came to pass. I'm not sure who projected the surplus, but I bet they didn't aim low.

The wonderful economy was based on the tech boom and a crazy ride on the stock market that had an over due correction coming. Luckily for Clinton the tech boom happened while he was in office despite him being in office NOT because he was in office. I was well aware that an economic downturn was coming when Gore vs Bush was unfolding. I really do Thank God that Bush beat Gore because Gore being on office when 9/11 happened would have been so much worse than the diaster it was.

I won't attempt to address the first of you post due to the fact you refuse to accept the fact that he is not muslim.

Now as for what I quouted from you, please the following AGAIN and you will find that the fact is that it was not PROJECTED but ACTUAL.

"Paying Off the National Debt. In July 2000, the Treasury Department announced that the United States will pay off $221 billion of debt this year -- the largest one-year debt pay down in American history. This will be the third consecutive year of debt reduction, bringing the three-year total to $360 billion."

It is beyond comprehension why some here, refuse to accept the truth and continue to spead factless, baseless information.

BTW, Bush did not beat Gore, he was appointed by the Supreme Court. It's doubtfull the event would have even taken place had Gore been in office as he was duely elected to be.

Redbirdfan - sorry to see you quit again. I'll miss those softballs you have been lobbing.

[soggyfeet]

Asking someone to prove that someone is muslim is like asking you to prove that he isnt. There is no way to know unless he says so and he has said both. Anyway if he was a muslim would it make a difference in your(chief greybear) vote. If not then it does matter if so you might want to find out for sure before voteing because you COULD be disapointed.

[bigredbirdfan]

I won't attempt to address the first of you post due to the fact you refuse to accept the fact that he is not muslim.

Now as for what I quouted from you, please the following AGAIN and you will find that the fact is that it was not PROJECTED but ACTUAL.

"Paying Off the National Debt. In July 2000, the Treasury Department announced that the United States will pay off $221 billion of debt this year -- the largest one-year debt pay down in American history. This will be the third consecutive year of debt reduction, bringing the three-year total to $360 billion."

It is beyond comprehension why some here, refuse to accept the truth and continue to spead factless, baseless information.

BTW, Bush did not beat Gore, he was appointed by the Supreme Court. It's doubtfull the event would have even taken place had Gore been in office as he was duely elected to be.

Redbirdfan - sorry to see you quit again. I'll miss those softballs you have been lobbing.

You don't answer my questions. Typical liberal non-response, attacks and subject changes.

[Chief Grey Bear]

Soggy, I have done the research for you if you care to spend just a few minutes reading. If any of you would spend half the time researching as you do spreading factless rumors, you may be surprised at what you learn. http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

[Chief Grey Bear]

You don't answer my questions. Typical liberal non-response, attacks and subject changes.

Are you kidding? I have answered them all with FACTS. Certainly not what some biased talk show host thinks. Call me what ever you want but I am not the one getting beat up with facts.

BTW, are you back to posting again? You have quit twice.

[bigredbirdfan]

Soggy, I have done the research for you if you care to spend just a few minutes reading. If any of you would spend half the time researching as you do spreading factless rumors, you may be surprised at what you learn. http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

'You Can Put Lipstick on a Pig, But It's Still a Pig' Barrack Hussien Obama on Sarah Palin. Irontic, isn't it Muslims who think pigs are filthy animals.