Just For Fun, What Would You Like To See Different On Thr Eleven Point If Anything

[ozark trout fisher]

Maybe the best idea would be to stock brown trout alongside the rainbow trout in the White Ribbon area, keep the same regs on rainbows (4 any size), continue to allow bait, and impose a 15" length limit on the brown trout that would be stocked under this plan in the white ribbon area. This would allow good catch and release fishing for browns, with the chance to keep a trophy, and good catch and keep fishing for rainbows. Then have a winter catch and release, artificials only season. Maybe a good compromise eh?

[vandelay]

I'm a bit late to the party on this topic...waitng for the boy to arrive and he's late...anyway, there are some really good thoughts on here and here's my wish list.

1. NO JOHNBOATS! These darn things stir up too much gravel, produce way to much noise for a beautiful river, and I've been almost ran over by idiot johnboat captains at least a dozen times now.

2. More policing of the white and blue ribbon areas - this needs to be done to reduce poaching of trout. If you float from Greer to Mary Decker's, there are plenty of fish. As soon as you are beyond Mary Decker, the fish population seems to dramatically drop. This did not used to be the case.

3. I know there needs to be a balance between bait and fly fishing, but fly fishers do more for the fish population with catch and release than any fishermen on the river. Their really isn't a good way to release a fish when caught on bait because the trout take it too deep. I really don't have an solution, but feel a better balance needs to happen.

4. Either stock more grown fish or more fingerlings...more fish and bigger fish will do more for the river than anything. ALso, I would drop the daily limit to 3 trout in the white ribbon section.

5. Keep is as wild as possible in whatever happens with the river. It is was gives it its beauty and keeps bringing me back.

6. Lastly, naked chicks every half mile! Okay, just kidding on that one!

[superfly]

Bigger fish will bring more $$ into the area. Missouri has the trout parks for the bait and keep guys. The Eleven Point River is only one of the few wild and scenic rivers that you can use a motor boat on I think. I wish the Feds would ban the motors and keep the river wild and scenic. It will be very hard to grow a lot of big fish as long as the Feds and the MDC allows motors and bait in their management plan. Catch and Release both smallmouth and trout... Maybe the Feds and MDC should look at the regulations that Montana puts on their rivers for instance the Smith River. The Smith River is managed by Montana Fish, Wildfife & Parks. The Smith River probably should be a Wild and Scenic River. No motors and bait is for kids. The Eleven Point needs a better plan!

[ozark trout fisher]

I am getting really hung up on the bad attitude towards bait fisherman. It IS a legitimate way to fish, and if done properly, hardly ever hooks a trout deep. Like I say, just set the hook quickly, and there will be no problems with hooking deeply. And bait fishing is not just for kids. Period. Just because it is effective, possibly more effective than fly fishing, doesn't mean that it should be against the law. Just to make it clear, I am all for keeping the Blue Ribbon Area artificials and flies only, but the White Ribbon area should remain open to bait fishers. I am not in favor of banning flies in the White Ribbon area, so why should we eliminate bait? It is a classic put and take fishery, and in most such fisheries, bait is allowed.

[soggyfeet]

I'm not against bait fisng at all, it has its place. Lets just say you are among the best bait fisherman out there(not caus you say so lets just say you are). In a earlier post you said said that you only deep hook one out of ten trout, that equals a 10% mortality rate for the best bait fisherman out there. Now lets say the best the best bait fisherman consist of the top 20% of the type. The next catagory consist of the average bait fisherman (lets say 30% of te bait fisherman) and they deep hook between 2 to 5 of 10 trout. Thats between 20 and 50 percent mortality. Now the last class of bait fisherman that dont care, dont know how, or kids deep hook between 5 and 10 trout. Thats 50 to 100 percent mortality. Most of the people that bait fish are going to fall into the middle I think, so I think an average mortality rate for all bait fishing would be fair between 35 and 40 percent. I have now problem with bait fishing as long as you keep what you catch then quit. Trout are not as strong as bass, cats, or crappie and more likely to die just from a long fight as well as a deep hook will kill them. What I think is that bait fishing should be limited to the parks and city lakes that stock in the winters.

[jdmidwest]

Nothing against bait fishing at all here either. It is not a method for catch and release fishing, it has too high of a mortality rate, no matter how careful you are.

Bait fish till you reach your limit and then change to an artificial to catch and release.

[ozark trout fisher]

Nothing against bait fishing at all here either. It is not a method for catch and release fishing, it has too high of a mortality rate, no matter how careful you are.

Bait fish till you reach your limit and then change to an artificial to catch and release.

I'm afraid I am going to have to respectfully disagree with that point. The bait-fisherman who kill released fish are those who hook on dough bait, put their rods in pole holders, and sit and wait. Deep hooking is likely to happen in that case, resulting most likely in the trout's death. However, for those of us who drift fish nightcrawlers or such, and always have a have the rod in their hand, waiting for the slightest twitch to set the hook, rarely deep hook the fish. I consider myself both a catch and release fisherman, and a bait fisherman, and at least ninety percent of the trout I release are not deep hooked, and are released completely unharmed, at least as much so if I was using a fly. I have no problem with setting aside areas for artificials only, catch and release only fishing, If I had my way, the Eleven Point's Blue Ribbon section would be catch and release, artificials only, and the white ribbon stretch would have a tougher length limit, which would make up for the occasional fish that was deep hooked. Maybe like a 12" or 14" minimum in the White ribbon area. These are just rough ideas though. I do agree with you in that there would be no way to not allow the sit and wait powerbait anglers, and not allow those of us who drift fish, and are less likely to gut hook trout. But if you know more about the river, and the trout population is being dropped from bait fishing, ban it by all means. I like to bait fish, but not to the point that I would be willing to ruin a trout fishery just so I can do it.

[Greg]

I am a dedicated fly fisherman and have been for a long time. However I don't look down on bait fishermen at all and most of the fly fishermen that I know don't either.

But I have to agree with the others that bait fishing is just not conducive with catch and release in my experience. When my kids were little I used to take them bait fishing on taneycomo. Probably 75% or more of these fish were hooked very deep making catch and release almost impossible. But in 30 years of fly fishing I can only remember a handful that were hooked deep - probably a fraction of 1%!! That doesn't make fly fishing better or fly fisherman superior - except at catch and release.

I've never been to the 11 point but I'd sure like to make it down this coming year.

Greg

[ozark trout fisher]

I am a dedicated fly fisherman and have been for a long time. However I don't look down on bait fishermen at all and most of the fly fishermen that I know don't either.

But I have to agree with the others that bait fishing is just not conducive with catch and release in my experience. When my kids were little I used to take them bait fishing on taneycomo. Probably 75% or more of these fish were hooked very deep making catch and release almost impossible. But in 30 years of fly fishing I can only remember a handful that were hooked deep - probably a fraction of 1%!! That doesn't make fly fishing better or fly fisherman superior - except at catch and release.

I've never been to the 11 point but I'd sure like to make it down this coming year.

Greg

I with that I agree to disagree.

[ColdWaterFshr]

I'm fine with the bait fishing restrictions as they currently exist - keep it in the White Ribbon area and manage it and enforce it as is.

The Blue Ribbon area just needs more enforcement. But I will say it has improved in the last couple years -- it seems like I've seen a game warden down there on almost every trip in recent memory. But I've also witnessed poaching on every trip in recent memory. The problem with enforcement down there is its a lot of river to cover and I don't think the agents venture much further than the area around Hwy 19 bridge down to the first island downstream, or the other accesses. My last trip, about 3 weeks ago kind've confirmed this -- yes, we saw an agent up in the woods near the 1st island, but at the end of the trip we saw a couple hiking out with a couple fish 12-14 inches on a stringer just upstream about 1/4 mile from Turners.

I think the locals know what areas are patrolled and to some extent when. And I think certain baitfishin locals with jetboats also know this, and the jetboat allows them to do their damage relatively quickly away from the Hwy 19 area. And I'm pretty sure a few nice trout get "accidentally" gigged whenever someone wants a taste of trout. Lots of nice folks with jetboats that use the river, and I don't mean to generalize them all as poachers, but as others have said -- in keeping with a wild and scenic river, it would be nice to have an area off limits to jetboats.