The Bass Thing

[Buzz]

After the reply to send the message about our opinions to MDC I have come up with an idea. The person who writes in as "Straw Hat" has inspired me in the fact that he agreed with my position and outlook concerning the Kentucky Bass in the Post entitled "Missouri Bass". Here is my plan.

1. Buy small fry from the state of Texas who has already proven their Florida Strain Bass( or other large varieties) to be healthy, exhuberent, and prolific.

2. Bring them back to Missouri and grow them into fingerling/stocking size.

3. Introduce them into some of our major impoundments.

4. Put a feasable slot limit on these lakes. One which will not destroy tournament fishing. As I suggested before: Nothing under

16" and only one fish over 22". Implement these until things take off and then adjust accordingly.

5. Put the Kentucky Bass in a category of their own. Increase their creel limit. Lower their length limit. I really like the 11"

length myself. Implementing these things would not require the building of new hatcheries. This would save all that expense we talked about. After all , when we restocked Deer in Missouri we didn't build " Deer Farms" ( New Hatcheries for Deer). Instead we simply got some from another state or two and turned them loose where they had habitat and food. Oh yeah, We put a slot limit on them.(meaning no hunting).

So there it is... low cost... no building of new hatcheries and waiting for money appropriation and construction time...no stepping on the toes of the Tournament Fishermen...Larger Bass for the state of Missouri( I am not looking for 20 pounders just generally increasing the average size appreciably)... and better consumption of the already available food suppply in our lakes.

Walcrabass, when did the Kentuckies become a problem on Missouri lakes? I know and understand the situation on the streams on the eastern side of the state, but have never heard of anything like this on our big lakes. I've not even heard any complaints from any of the guides that the Kentuckies are taking over or causing any problems. If you have any proof of this I would like to see it. As far as I'm concerned, there is a place for them right along side largemouth and smallmouth in the lakes.

[eric1978]

Walcrabass, when did the Kentuckies become a problem on Missouri lakes? I know and understand the situation on the streams on the eastern side of the state, but have never heard of anything like this on our big lakes. I've not even heard any complaints from any of the guides that the Kentuckies are taking over or causing any problems. If you have any proof of this I would like to see it. As far as I'm concerned, there is a place for them right along side largemouth and smallmouth in the lakes.

Totally agree. They've always been there and they belong there. I don't really see a competition problem, and even if they were, well that's just too bad because they're native. And actually...I'm no expert on the White River reservoirs, but I think a couple of them are probably producing at the top of their potential. You TR pros should correct me if I'm wrong, but it sure seems like that lake is just phenomenal. Maybe you could make an argument that the spots are a little more of an impedance to LM on LOZ, but I really don't know about that either.

Now the north-flowing streams on the other hand...just kidding

[Walcrabass]

Walcrabass, when did the Kentuckies become a problem on Missouri lakes? I know and understand the situation on the streams on the eastern side of the state, but have never heard of anything like this on our big lakes. I've not even heard any complaints from any of the guides that the Kentuckies are taking over or causing any problems. If you have any proof of this I would like to see it. As far as I'm concerned, there is a place for them right along side largemouth and smallmouth in the lakes.

[Walcrabass]

Buzz and Eric1978, You guys are exactly right in that there is a time and a place for the Kentucky Bass. Obviously they are a Native species and deserve a place. The way I see it Bass Fishing is at a all time high. The thrust of things today is larger fish. It only makes sense that if there was a decrease of spawning, food consumption, etc.by one species that there would be more for the Bass that were left. I think that sometimes we are resistant to change because of fond memories and just plain old enjoying the past. That ain't all bad either. Here is my point. There are better Bass out there. After reading another article today it is proven that the Florida/Northern Bass Hybrids Females are more successful at spawning as are the pure Floridas. The man who is called "Straw Hat" has put several things to read on this site and I found them fascinating, educational, and true to what I expected from their research. I believe that the Bass Fishermen of Missouri deserve a chance to take a step up with other great Bass fishing states. I found nothing but good in these articles and I encourage everyone to read them.

[eric1978]

Let's see if I can explain my position a little better.

I would rather catch the type and size of fish that Mother Nature intended I catch in a given area than an artificially supplanted one, UNLESS there is an ecological niche that is not being filled, i.e. trout parks, Taney, farm ponds, etc. All those places need human assistance to become highly-productive fishing waters. The reason we have Northern Strain LM, smallmouth and Kentuckies instead of FL strain LM is because those are the species the planet decided should inhabit the area in which we choose to live. If you found some super-warm reservoir somewhere in MO that wasn't able to support high populations of quality Northern Strain LM, and some other species hadn't adapted to and inhabited that reservoir, I'd say go for it...but those reservoirs don't exist. That's why I mentioned power-plant lakes in another thread...how about a FL strain LM program in a place like that instead? Why tinker with already-established and highly productive MO reservoirs?

As long as our fisheries are producing good numbers of mature fish (within size ranges according to the limitations of the species), I'm happy. I prefer to keep things natural. If I want to chase FL strain monsters, I'll drive down to Fork. Catching a 5 pound LM here in MO is just as satisfying to me as catching a 10 pound FL strain beast in a southern state. I don't need my rod to be bent in half to thoroughly enjoy catching a fish. Again, everyone likes bigger fish, but I'm not willing to sacrifice tens of thousands of years of natural selection to accomplish it. I'm all for improved creel regulations based on scientific data, as well as aggressive social regulations and laws to protect and improve the habitat of our native fishes. Let's start with that, and if there is still room for improvement, we can talk about radical genetic changes then.

...IMHO

[Buzz]

I will read them when I get the chance, but that doesn't explain why you would want to put the spots on the chopping block. Have you ever caught a 3 or 4 pound kentucky on a topwater bait. They are great fighters and I don't think I could get behind your proposals at thier expense. As far as the rest of it, I'm skeptical that we would see anything better than what already exists. Stockton and Table Rock are known all across the country, if not the world, for being great fisheries. For the climate that we have here, it would be extremely hard to introduce another strain that would benefit what we already have.

After the big fish kill a few years back, the lakes are finally coming back. I think if we would just give it a little time you might see that these drastic ( IMO ) changes would be of no more use than introducing Triploids in to Taneycomo.

[Walcrabass]

I have attached a few web pages which address the stocking of Florida's in states near us.

http://www.arkansassportsmanmag.com/fishing/AR_0406_02/index4.html

http://www.fishingtennessee.com/Articles/Summerlin/Florida%20Bass.htm

http://sports.espn.go.com/outdoors/bassmaster/news/story?page=b_fea_bt_news19_0802

http://okiefish.com/OklahomasLARGEMOUTHBASS.htm

http://www.oklahomabassfishing.com/largemouth.html

If I find any particular research that has been done on this subject that I think you would be interested in then I will pass it along to you. Obviously you have been reading on this issue. If you are truely interested in dealing with this subject your first step would be to contact the fishery biologist for the MDC and talk to him. As far as my involvement... well if you have read my bio then you know my health is not good but I would certainly be glad to help with any advice or research that I can. You might consider sending me a pm with your phone number and maybe we could talk in more detail over the phone. Be prepared though, this could be a very long, aggrevating process with a lot of politics.

[Walcrabass]

I have had another idea creep into my small cerebral sphere. What if I proposed the introduction of a certain Crappie into our lakes that would grow faster, spawn more eggs, have a greater survival rate, get 50 per cent larger, and all we had to do was purchase them from another state and stock them? I would have to guess that virtually 100 per cent of the Crappie enthusiasts would say "Let's Get R Done". Why is it then that we might be getting "Hung Up" concerning the Bass?

[Walcrabass]

Let's see if I can explain my position a little better.

I would rather catch the type and size of fish that Mother Nature intended I catch in a given area than an artificially supplanted one, UNLESS there is an ecological niche that is not being filled, i.e. trout parks, Taney, farm ponds, etc. All those places need human assistance to become highly-productive fishing waters. The reason we have Northern Strain LM, smallmouth and Kentuckies instead of FL strain LM is because those are the species the planet decided should inhabit the area in which we choose to live. If you found some super-warm reservoir somewhere in MO that wasn't able to support high populations of quality Northern Strain LM, and some other species hadn't adapted to and inhabited that reservoir, I'd say go for it...but those reservoirs don't exist. That's why I mentioned power-plant lakes in another thread...how about a FL strain LM program in a place like that instead? Why tinker with already-established and highly productive MO reservoirs?

As long as our fisheries are producing good numbers of mature fish (within size ranges according to the limitations of the species), I'm happy. I prefer to keep things natural. If I want to chase FL strain monsters, I'll drive down to Fork. Catching a 5 pound LM here in MO is just as satisfying to me as catching a 10 pound FL strain beast in a southern state. I don't need my rod to be bent in half to thoroughly enjoy catching a fish. Again, everyone likes bigger fish, but I'm not willing to sacrifice tens of thousands of years of natural selection to accomplish it. I'm all for improved creel regulations based on scientific data, as well as aggressive social regulations and laws to protect and improve the habitat of our native fishes. Let's start with that, and if there is still room for improvement, we can talk about radical genetic changes then.

...IMHO

[Buzz]

I can't speak for crappie fishermen, since I don't fish for them. I do fish for all species of bass. I don't mean to get on you or anything,I'm just asking for some kind of reasoning for putting the Kentucky so high on the list of fish that should pay for this proposal. I enjioy catching them just as much as I do largemouth, and I feel they have earned thier place in our lakes and fill a niche that would otherwise be lacking.

Just my 2 cents worth.