Lead Ban On All Fishing Tackle

[Chief Grey Bear]

I will offer my services as ref. I haven't fished Stockton lake since the early to mid 80's.

[Stockton Lake Guide Service]

Mr. Bennett, I read all of your comments before I responded. I just get tired of hearing terms like enviromental wackos and gorvernment geniuses. Maybe your reference was just to a narrow group and not a broad generalization, but terms like that only fuel the fire of some who would stereotype all who work for the government as incompetent and all who care about the enviroment as "tree huggers". I appreciate your information and am sure your not disrespectful to your customers. I just get tired of the anti- government, anti- enviromentalist attitudes that I run into around here. In the meantime I will continue to use my lead heads to catch fish until I'm told I cannot or am provided with a better alternative.

I'm retired from the govt and have nothing against them. It's just that it has become so big and we continue to lose rights, everyday. Just like this topic, someone want's us not to use lead anymore. The term environmental wackos and government geniuses mean just that. it does not encompass all that work for the govt or work to better or help the environment. I would consider myself an environmentalist, as far as one that tries and wants to keep the environment clean and safe, but the ones that try to blame humans for acting human are the ones that I am referring. I am sure that all of us can find things we can do better to help out, and I have changed my habits in the past and will probably do so in the future, but so will most other people that care about fishing and hunting. We don't need laws to tell us what type of weight we need to use.

And just so everyone completely understands what I am and was saying, there are some great and awesome people that work for the govt and work to help our environment. there are also those that take it way to far, throw power around because they can, and do things just to get personal recognition. I guess it comes down to the motivation behind what you are doing. As much as I disagree with Eric1978, I believe him to be sincere and think what he is saying and doing is what he believes is best for the environment. I believe different than him and have no problems using lead weights or lures. if it was found to be harmful or a better alternative comes along I would be happy to change.

Now it's way past bedtime, good nite!

[luv2fish]

It is late and I too am retiring. Enjoyed the comments. One last question to be answered some other time. What rights have you lost and which one(s) did you lose today? Losing rights daily, now come on.

[Quillback]

I can see where lead shot or small split shot can be ingested by waterfowl and cause issues. If I was a duck hunter I would have no problem using steel shot.

I don't see where larger lead weights, or lead headed spinner baits, jigs etc., cause any environemtal damage whatsoever. I could see where it mgight be possible for a waterbird to ingest a jig or spinner bait, but if that happened, the hook would probably be more of an issue than the lead. I have not seen in this thread, or any where that I have read about this issue that large pieces of lead that you would see in large weights or lures is causing any significant enviromental damage. If anyone believes so, please provide references.

A note about tungsten - it is not mined in the US, 75% of the worlds supply comes from China. So if lead was completely banned for use in manufacturing fishing lures, we just be sending a little more of our money to the Chinese

If we're going to ban anything, it should be braided line, I drag up balls of that stuff all the time. The problem with these government people making decisions like banning lead for fishing, is that they are not on the water like we are. We see the environment as it is, they see it through a microscope.

[Chief Grey Bear]

Take a walk down the fishing isle and read some lables next time you are at your favorite bait shop. Most sinkers are already coming from china. Hell we don't make anything in this country anymore. I don't want to turn this into a political thread or take it off track so I better shut up now.

[Quillback]

I think most jigs are still US manufactured. Lots of small tackle manufacturers out there making jigs, be a shame to see it all go to China. And do US tackle manufacturers (those that are left) import the lead they use? Probably not. But if they are forced to use tungsten they will have to import tungsten. I guess I'm old fashioned, I support US workers and manufacturers.

[Wayne SW/MO]

I've read through this, and while I may have missed a point, what do we gain from banning lead sinkers? What problem are we facing? This sounds suspiciously like another "Its a possibility if we throw out reason"

[eric1978]

I've read through this, and while I may have missed a point, what do we gain from banning lead sinkers? What problem are we facing? This sounds suspiciously like another "Its a possibility if we throw out reason"

I posted the information below earlier on. Yes, it was a study done by the EPA, so you may not want to believe it since it is a government agency and we know nothing they say is true. I'm not suggesting some jigheads left in a massive reservoir would have any impact whatsoever, but maybe in tiny, fragile ecosystems, it could. At least that's what I think, you be the judge for yourself. Obviously it doesn't carry the impact that a toxic waste or mine tailings spill would have on a small creek, but from what I've read, lead is toxic to animals in aquatic ecosystems, to one degree or another. Perhaps in flowing bodies of water the lead PPM could never reach toxic levels...I haven't found any research that addresses that particular scenario, and I've been looking. So I'll concede that there isn't a lot of evidence available that lead is a major problem. But let's not sit here and deny that it doesn't pose some kind of threat to the environment, and that's been my only point all along.

"Lead shot and lead weight can severely affect individual organisms and threaten ecosystems (WHO 1989). After three to ten days of waterfowl ingesting lead shot, the poison will reach the bloodstream and be carried to major organs, like the heart, liver and kidneys. By the 17th to 21st day the bird falls into a coma and dies. Following the ingestion of lead shot, lead toxicosis has been observed in Magpie geese, Black swans, several species of duck (including Black duck and Musk duck) and Hardhead species (OECD 1993).Organic lead is much more readily taken up by birds and fish (WHO 1989). Aquatic organisms take up inorganic lead through a transfer of lead from water and sediments; this is a relatively slow process. Organic lead is rapidly taken up by aquatic organisms from water and sediment. Aquatic animals are affected by lead at water concentrations lower than previously thought safe for wildlife. These concentrations occur often, but the impact of atmospheric lead on specific sites with high aquatic lead levels is not clear (US EPA 1986)."

[Wayne SW/MO]

"but maybe in tiny, fragile ecosystems, it could."

OK, first what would a "tiny fragile ecosystem" be? I can't really picture one. Second, how much economic degradation should we put on "maybe"?

The waterfowl situation is well documented, but comparing a size 4 lead shot to a sinker or jighead is like comparing a pickup to an eighteen wheeler.

I'm sick of the hypocrisy of some environmental groups frankly. They're narrow minded and have the same mindset that P*TA has. Trust me Eric, the sky isn't falling and I still believe this in spite of hearing most of my life it is.

[eric1978]

"but maybe in tiny, fragile ecosystems, it could."

OK, first what would a "tiny fragile ecosystem" be? I can't really picture one. Second, how much economic degradation should we put on "maybe"?

The waterfowl situation is well documented, but comparing a size 4 lead shot to a sinker or jighead is like comparing a pickup to an eighteen wheeler.

I'm sick of the hypocrisy of some environmental groups frankly. They're narrow minded and have the same mindset that P*TA has. Trust me Eric, the sky isn't falling and I still believe this in spite of hearing most of my life it is.

If I thought the sky was falling, I wouldn't be using lead, but I still do. But suggesting that lead does no harm is just as much an exaggeration as suggesting it's a huge problem. I think we should be realistic about it from both directions. People that scream about how we're losing all our freedoms are Chicken Littles, too, if you ask me.