New 8Wt, Need Advice

[Kayser]

I'm mainly building this for streamers, big poppers, and other warmwater, but I'd like to take it for salmon/steelhead or inshore saltwater of given the chance. I want to build it to last, but also look sharp. Keeping that in mind, here's what I've got so far.

Blank: St Croix, 9', 8wt (ordered)

Color: Gloss burgundy

Seat: Undecided

Handle: Full wells, slim fighting butt

Stripping guides: Undecided. Fuji?

Guides: Undecided. Recoil double snakefoot, titanium?

Thread color/trim: Undecided

Reel: Lamson Velocity 3.0x, nickel finish

Basically, I'm looking for help with the components. Definitely open to suggestions on this, as I am drawing a complete blank on how I want this to turn out.

[Gavin]

Go talk to Hargrove

[Nighthawk]

I like an up locking wood seat; just looks classy. Without seeing the actual blank color, I hesitate to recommend a thread color, but try a couple and dab it with a drop of water to see what it looks like with epoxy on it. I use titanium snakes for the guides, but have done single foot before. Didn't notice any difference. Look on Google for single turn trim wraps. They really look great. Russ

[Muddler4]

Personally for an 8 wt I'd go snake guides vs single foot but people do build big rods single foot. Snake Brand are the easiest to work with as they are prep'd and ready to install from the factory while others will require that you dress them up with a file. Snake Brand are not cheap though. Guide and reel seat hardware (color) are of course available in chrome, stainless, gunsmoke, titanium, or even black will look good on burgundy. It's had to make suggestions without knowing if you like subtle or loud, color preferences, etc. Burgundy is a bit harder to pick wraps for. Here is an example of a blank that is very close to St Croix burguny (even though the picture doesn't show it) where I used black main wraps and an old gold look for trim wraps (actually almond with color preserver). I happen to not like flashy rods but that's personal taste. I think picking components to meet your desires is the most fun part of the build. I often play with color combos using Power Point to draw a rod blank and put thread colors on it. The tricky part is finding a thread brand/color that will get you where you want to be after finish is applied. As mentioned do some sample wraps on the blank and wet them with water of alcohol. Alcohol will evaporate quickly and lighten the thread color while it does, so you have to take a snap shot in your head or re-apply often if you want to stare at it for long. Water gives you more time to look at it.

[fishinwrench]

Imperial? I'd go with single foot hard chrome and 2 oversized Fuji strippers (don't worry about weight here....you'll need some heft in the butt section to keep it from being tip heavy when completed).

Same with the reel seat....resist the temptation to go "light".

[Muddler4]

I would think it's an SC II/IV for that application. Kind of a semi-secret custom streamer favorite blank that likely led to them introducing the Bank Robber factory rods.

[Kayser]

That's the one, Muddler. At least, I'm pretty sure it is- been a while since I ordered it... Need to call about it again.

My biggest concern is that if I do ever take it to the salt, will the components hold up? I don't want to take it out once and find out a wooden reel seat is finished after one day, or that my guides corrode before I even get a chance to rinse it off at the marina.

I was thinking double-foot snakes with two stripping guides on it. Is there any advantage to the single-foot guides other than weight savings? Are there any performance drawbacks to them? Hell, I've never even held a rod with single-foots, other than an old 1wt bamboo in a friend's basement, so I have no clue how they act.

As far as thread, I don't know if I want loud, subtle, or just plain slick. I always wet the thread to "preview" the color before I add finish, but I'm curious about CP- will it completely keep the original color, or does it still fade slightly under the finish? Again, never used it.

Oh, forgot my experience level- I've only built 4 complete rods (1 fly), and repaired about 50 others.

Thanks for the tips, looking forward to more.

[Muddler4]

I can’t talk to salt exposure over the long haul but I did live in Florida for two years with the Gulf a mere 100 yards from my doorstep and fly fished it pretty much weekly. I did use some rods with wood reel seats and never had a problem but I cleaned everything thoroughly at the end of every outing. I had a blemish in the chrome finish of a tip top on one rod that salt got under and ruined and I pretty much ruined a Medalist which was not meant for salt anyway (this was in the 80s). If you seal the ends of your wood insert with epoxy when you assemble your seat you should be ok. That’s where I’ve seen problems in salt or fresh water, expansion due to moisture getting in the grain at the end of the wood insert. Conventional wisdom is all metal for salt but it sounds like you will only do salt once in a blue moon.

Snakes vs. single foot, a lot of opinions on both sides there. Custom builders (for sale) love singles as it is half the wraps and half the finish. You can argue that those minimal applications on the rod make it better (lighter, preserves action, etc) but real world tests don’t bear that out. And when you’re talking 8 wt lets face it, you got over 300 grains of line off the tip on a 60 foot cast, unless you are putting full frame guides with ringed inserts on, the mass of snake vs. singles in actual tests is in the noise (on a 1 wt not so much). When Loomis came out with a whole line of rods with single foots another company did a test using identical rods, different guide trains, with 10 casters ranging from advanced to world class competitors because they were considering doing the same. Only one parameter was measured, fly on target under a variety of conditions. No significant difference. That company stayed with snakes. The guide supplier whom they were consulting with leaked the story. Durability over the long haul, snakes hands down, not even close. Even vs single foot recoils because of the pressure you put on the wraps under impact. Snakes just have a natural ramping effect when bushwacking, in a boat with edges, or for some, even putting the rod in the tube. Singles just hang out there precariously. They do perform just fine though and I’ve even built a rod with the smallest, lightest Fuji SIC framed guides. Shoots line real good, but…….I won’t do that again.

Thread, CP, all personal taste. No CP gives a translucent look that you can see the guide feet through (except with black), kind of like stained glass, I like it. But if you want bright colors to “pop” use CP.

St. Croix does have guide size and spacing recommendations on their web site, see heavy fresh/salt St. Croix has always been a big fan of HUGE snakes. I built rods similar to this with one size over standard size. St. Croix is pretty much two sizes over standard on everything. But ask anyone how they like their Bank Robber. They must know something. Just look at the Bank Robber pics on their web site, huge guides, probably size 4s at the tip.

[Kayser]

Well then.... That about answers everything, other than where to look for components.

Never thought about epoxying the ends of the wood. I think that's going to be a must on this build, but I'm not sure if I want the potential problems of wood. I might go with a dark metal or carbon-fiber seat, although I think the chrome/nickle finishes would look better with the reel I have. (Unsure if I should match the seat to the rod, or the reel). I guess I'll play it by ear once the rod comes in and I actually have something to hold in my hands.

I really need to head to the shop and bug those guys...

[Nighthawk]

Try Hook & Hackle for your components. They have a ton. Also thread and glues, tools, blanks, you name it.