Tailwater Improvement

[Phil Lilley]

Question:

What can be done to enhance the upper mile of the tailwater in regards to trout.

Examples: Dissolved Oxygen Improvement, Fish Habitat.

It would be great if there were examples given via a website or other valid information.

[loo10]

How much habitat improvement could be done

that would not wash away during generation?

Love to see a plunge pool or two developed.

loo10

[Micheal Kyle]

Phil,

Are they actually going to consider the ideas because I have always been told that they could not do anything because it was a core lake. And that changing the habitat would some how change the flow of water.

I have several Ideas and they mostly are just about structure big boulders,adding lay downs and dredging out some deeper holes.

Is there going to be a meeting about this and if so where and when.

Michael

[Phil Lilley]

There's a meeting tonight but it's invite only. I'm not going but I know several guides who are.

The Corp is concerned about flow- that's true. But I believe we can improve habitat without adversely affecting flow. One thing they will oppose is adding anything to the tailwater that will impede flow like boulders or gravel bars close to the dam face. Any structure that will cause back pressure on the flow and turbines will affect power production. Dredging, on the other hand, does just the opposite.

I hate to pick on the outlets but I believe more big trout are harmed by anglers snagging and stressing large browns in the outflow. If the flow of outlet #2 was dispersed evenly and not channeled as it is now, fish would not be herded up and easily snagged as they are now. Also, other considerations can be explored to make it harder to fish this area, ie. wood structures in and around the flow area. Yes- make is harder to fish! Right now it's like shooting fish in a barrel, no skill involved.

I think a study on freshwater shrimp is in order. Come up with ways to create the ideal conditions for shrimp to grow. I know- that's pie in the sky thinking because not much is known about why gammarus do well in certain lakes and streams and why they don't in others.

Interesting, not sure if I mentioned this but back in June we were exploring a lake up from camp in Alaska and I found thousands of gammarus around a small dock and some sort of pondweed, large ones. I'm sure the lake almost freezes solid for four months out of the year. They are not deep lakes. Imagine if Table Rock has a viable population of shrimp- what they would do for the fishery as a whole!

To answer the comments on generation and flow... it's taken how many years to fill in the channel/holes? Back in the 70's you could not wade across the lake at, above or below outlet #2 because it's go over your waders. That's 30 years. I think a well thought out plan would help the tailwater- make it a 10 or 20 year plan and revisit it after that time to see if additional work is needed.

[snagged in outlet 3]

I'm in full agreement with you Phil. Those outlets, and the methods used there by fisherman are not what ethical fishing is about. Is #3 open? Are fish going up there? Once in the creek they are protected. Maybe something along the lines how #3 is setup? With restricted access in the outlet creeks.

SIO3

[Phil Lilley]

Don't really want to make it an ethical question. Can't. MDC has already shown they aren't interested in managing ethics so going at it from that direction is fruitless. But snagging big browns during low DO periods is harmful and potentially lethal and that should be a consideration. Outlet #2 just happens to be the #1 place where this happens and for reasons that have nothing to do with skill and/or intent of the angler. The best angler will still foul hook a good percentage of trout when drifting a scud through the flow. Just too many fish in a small area. Spread them out, make it harder to run a line through the area, give the trout a place to hide and be safe from anglers.

[snagged in outlet 3]

Okay, sorry about that. I should know better. I think 02 is probably the biggest problem followed by habitat loss. Wouldn't dredging holes and creating rifles help with both? It may not help right at the foot of the dam but work around the cable area would certainly the water below that.

SIO3

[Phil Lilley]

No- we've already asked them about raising the level of the bottom at the cable to create a riffle and they said it's too close to the dam face. The DO issue, I think, will have to be solved at the dam itself in the way of injection or drawing water from higher in the lake where DO is higher. But then you have a temperature issue.

Don't think the DO problem can be solved for those fish in the first 1/2 mile at least by improving the habitat. Just I'd love to be proven wrong!

[loo10]

Let's just make sure we dont put the same "Schmoe"

in charge of habitat that was put in charge of lake levels

during the infamous Landing drawdown.

In the words of Bugs Bunny, "What a maroon!"

[Rusty]

I don't know of anything that will improve the DO levels within the first mile, other than an oxygen injection system after the turbines. I can't really believe that it hasn't happened with the money that is generated from this hobby. Pensicola Dam on Grand Lake even suggested doing this this Summer after the fish kill below their tailwater during the July flood. Granted it hasn't been talked about since, but they did mention it.

Was the Local or National TU invited to this meeting? This sounds like something right up there alley. Somone please correct me if I am wrong, but the local TU did structure implementation along with bank improvements at the Beaver Tailwater.