ness

It's good, but not great IMHO. Bryant's will have the celebrity photos on the wall, and you can have the satisfaction of eating where they all did. Nixon, Clinton, Emeril, whoever. There are a lot of very good BBQ restaurants in KC, so it's hard to just recommend one. Others I like: Oklahoma Joe's, Jack's Stack, Hayward's, RC's, Gates.

Sweet. I haven't been there in the Fall, and really want to do it sometime.

Thanks for that Joe. For the record, I didn't mean that guides don't fish for fun, just that I *only* fish for fun. Sorry if I mistook your question as a challenge -- that was a little carryover from the earlier post. FWIW, and as an explanation of why I'm even involved in the thread, I think the guiding business is pretty interesting. It's a service, and you're working with a wide range of personalities and trying to make all of them happy. No matter how good you are, you're gonna have trips that don't produce well -- and that ain't easy. Having some dolt follow you around and take a shortcut to finding fish isn't fun, but it's part of the deal. So you know where I'm coming from, maybe a little: Last month I fished with a guide in Tennessee with my two 13-year old sons. One guide, three clients, two of which have the attention span of a gnat. We were fly fishing for trout in Great Smoky Mtn. National Park, and early that morning there was a huge thunderstorm that blew out all the streams in the area and knocked out the power. That was the only day we could fish, so we couldn't reschedule. Pretty tough set up, right? He spent a bunch of time working with the boys, and when they lost interest he worked with me. He helped me on a particular technique (very long roll casts with a heavy fly) which was really beneficial. As we drove around looking for fishable water, and there was lots of that, he kept us entertained with stories about the locals and the history of the area. If you boiled this trip down to the numbers, it worked out to about $20 per inch of fish caught. So, was it a bust? Hell no it wasn't a bust, and I let him know that. So, the moral to my story, if you're still reading, is I've got a lot of respect for you guys and what you do. Take care, and thanks again.

You know, I just can't let that one slide by. I didn't bash you or disrespect you or anybody for what you do for a living. No way -- can't lay that one on me. What I did do was respond to this comment: And as to your "Do you?"question above, yes I do. I volunteered for a number of years, and ultimately served on the board of The Dream Factory. If you haven't heard of it, they work with critically ill children. I was also a Cub Master and Assistant Scout Master for 7 years, but I don't work with veterans. I'm not crowing, you asked. Just like before. Am I OK now? I've been a gentleman throughout this thing, and have tried to have a little fun too. I'm not on here to compare jobs, bash guides or smooth things over for Dallas. I didn't read every post, but I don't think the tone was overly negative towards guides. Certainly not from me. A few posts back, I believe the word 'jerk' was used in a context that would include me. Don't feel like that was really necessary, but I'm not really surprised at it given the rising tension here. If I had one negative thing to say about the guides it would be this: I think some here have been a bit harsh, and have fostered an unnecessary us-versus-them tone to this discussion. And, I would add that there have been some that have handled themselves like gentlemen, or simply avoided the fray. My hats off to the latter.

I suppose your point is that all of us non-guides wish we were in your shoes? I've got some news for you -- I fish for fun, and I enjoy what I do for a living (and it's not fishing). If you're living your dream, that's wonderful. But don't make the arrogant assumption that all the rest of us are jealous.

I've seen it said a couple times in this thread that following a guide is stealing, and I think that's a bit of a stretch. When you hire a guide you're not buying a boat ride to some nice water. You're hiring someone to show you how to catch some fish. Sure, part of that is getting to the right spot, but there's more, right? (If there isn't, you're with the wrong guide). So following a guide will only get you a fraction of what the client gets. Sure, it's a crappy thing to do, maybe even $%^tty, but it's not stealing. I suspect this has been going on for a long time, and the smarter guides have figured out ways to deal with it, still get the clients and make some money. I also suspect the smarter ones do what they can to stay ahead of the crowd -- like learning to read the situation and change your location and/or tactic accordingly. Sure, some bozo in the next boat can see where you go, and maybe even what you're doing, but I suggest you let them have it. Give them a wave, maybe even flip them a little $%^&, but don't let it ruin your day. Seems like there's some pretty strong feelings out on Table Rock, and honestly, as an outsider, I wonder why I'd go there when I read some of this. It might be worth thinking about the impression you give when you post on here. This stuff lasts forever, or until Phil deletes it. As to Paul Dallas and his remarks, I think you guys have been a little hard on the old feller. He's a legend and pioneer in the world of internet fishing forum tomfoolery, and the way he's been treated here isn't befitting a man of his stature. He can take care of himself, when he has his wits about him, and doesn't need me to step in here to defend his name or educate this forum as to his credentials. Nonetheless, I'd encourage you to listen to what he has to say, because there's a heap of wisdom and some good entertainment buried in those seemingly irrational posts.

Holy crap...Paul Dallas! I remember you from the old Conservation Cafe. Sir, your reputation precedes you, at least for a few of us. Boys -- this guy is the real deal. But maybe not in the way you're used to thinking about it. May I respectfully suggest you fellers relax, listen and learn.

That there was funny

Point: focused fishing OK Armstrong, whatchoo got?

Eric -- that's a little narrow-minded, isn't it? You're the CEO of your guide service, so you get to deal with all the crap that goes along with it. In every business, somebody is dealing with competitors, patents, trade marks, trade secrets, whatever. You gotta figure out how best to deal with it. See my post a while back for more wisdom.

I think some of these guide posts are pretty interesting. I've used a guide on several occasions (though never for bass fishing) and have a great deal of respect for the skill set required. It's absolutely NOT all about catching fish -- it's about giving the client a good time, and that definition can vary from client to client. I think the very best ones are in-tune to what their client is after, and tries his damnedest to deliver. And if he does that well, the word will spread and he'll have earned new business, right? I guess I don't see the big problem with tag-alongs. Sure, it's a kinda crappy way to fish -- but there are always people like that around. Whenever you're successful at something, someone's gonna want to glom on to you and get it the easy way. That's just the way it is, so I'd suggest not losing any sleep over it. If you're getting followed by someone and you're with a paying client, how about you just point that out to your client and let them know it's a pretty common thing. Let them know that landing on the spot is only a fraction of the technique -- that presentation, lure choice, whatever are still important. Maybe demonstrate and make them confident that there's value in being on your boat, and not the one next to it or out on your own. As to the e-mails or phone calls -- just nicely tell them you don't really have any info for them, chuckle and leave it at that. Don't need to lecture or get pissed -- just move along. Your blood pressure will stay in check, and you'll live longer.

Dang! I was just gonna suggest the skin. I changed mine some time ago and all kinda stuff quit working. Macs are beautimous.

Benson's gone

If the primary reason you're considering the kayak is the price, you might end up with something you don't like or want. There was a pretty extensive thread on here a couple weeks ago discussing the pros and cons of kayaks and canoes. I thought there were some very good points made. Might be worth searching for that for some ideas.

I'll have to check that out next time. Sounds interesting. Yep, we're about 10-1/2 hours door to door. Very doable in a day -- sometimes wonder why I don't do it more. That's a little more than two trips to the Current for me. I love fishing for the natives, and got my boys excited about it a couple years ago too. Here's my boy with a Greenback cutt: and a much better picture of a Greenback, held by a friend's son: and here's the only Colorado River cutt I ever caught: and where he lived: I worked my butt off for the CO River one, but I feel like it was worth it. The Greenbacks are in a few places that are pretty accessible (Lily Lake, for one) so they're not as much work. Bear Lake is a sanctuary for them (they're listed as 'Threatened') and therefore is off-limits for fishing.

Greg, I had to look the place up, but I know about where you were. We've stayed in cabins just down the road from there a couple times -- near the YMCA. That's a great area for a family vacation, and I'd put RMNP up against about any other national park. Gorgeous place, absolutely huge -- you couldn't hike it all in a lifetime. Plenty of small stream, alpine lake and even tailwater fishing in the area. Two species of native cutthroats (one on each side of the divide). Go-carts. We try to get out there every couple years -- and this is the off year. Here's me on my first trip to Estes, near the end of the last millenium:

Nice report, Greg. I love CO, Estes and RMNP. I'm trying to figure out where you camped -- was it over at Mary's Lake?

As already mentioned, there's Big Thompson outside the park. There are dozens of opportunities inside the park, and I haven't found those waters to be too crowded -- even the ones close to the roads and entrances. Of course, if there's a parking lot and a well-worn path heading to the stream, you're probably not the first. As a general rule, the farther away from Estes you go, the lighter the traffic; and the west side of the divide will be less active than the east. There are a lot of different types of opportunities too. Meadow fishing for large, wary trout (See avatar - that's the Thompson inside the Park), pocket water and/or high gradient fishing for opportunistic smaller ones -- all fairly close to the road. There's also an opportunity (though slight) of being mauled by a bear, attacked by a mountain lion or 'gored' by a moose. But seriously, it's cool just to see any or all of them. On the west side, there's the opportunity to fish the headwaters of the Colorado, and with a moderate hike, get to a place where you can jump across. If you're into numbers, there are places where it's relatively easy to hook a brook trout on every cast. If you'd like to add one or two species of native cutthroats to your life list, there are Greenbacks on the east side and Colorado River cutts on the west side of the divide. You'd have to do a little homework to find them, especially the latter. Most streams have either rainbows or browns. Grant at Estes Angler or Scott's Fly Shop will help you narrow things down a bit.

Am I correct in assuming that the boat was traveling at a high rate of speed and that there are branches hanging out over the water that knocked this poor guy off the boat? Thoughts and prayers to the family and friends.

Wenonah Vagabond or Wenonah Solo Plus I currently drive a Solo Plus. Got it when my kids were young and could put a couple in there with me. They're big enough now I'd only do one. It's a better solo than tandem canoe -- I would only put a smaller person as second. If I was buying one now, it would be the Vagabond or something like it.

Can't get the link to work. What's the poop?

You sound like a perfect candidate for my new product called Fishing Caddy. For just $20 a day, I'll send one of my 13-year old boys out with you to lug all your crap. If $20 is not enough, I could maybe pay as high as $30.

My interest in glass has been growing some. I'd seen a few custom rod makers offering them, and that's what got it started. I really don't like a fast rod. I tend to favor quieter places -- smaller streams and tighter conditions -- so a fast-action rod is often a liability. The big manufacturers continue to make faster and lighter rods for the most part, so there is a need for a slower-action rod. Aesthetics-wise: I think a bamboo-like look would have appeal, and accentuate the old-time feel of the thing.

Mine has been a mixed bag. The tomatoes are doing fine. None harvested yet, but it won't be to long. Peppers look a little stunted, but healthy. Snow peas were a total bust. Lettuce went to seed real suddenly and the crop was small. Radishes have been very small. Didn't get the netting on soon enough and the birds are most of the blueberries. Bumper crop of weeds though.

Actually -- I'm not that stupid - the options button wouldn't work until I changed the skin back to the OA default. You can have your forum back now.