Buying A Kayak

[grizwilson]

Yeah, it's hard to hide the fact I like my Pack, but it does feel "tippy" at first. It's initial stability isn't very good, but it's actually hard to tip over, just feels "squirrely"

You get used to it.

Some people lower the seat, but I like to sit up higher for several reasons. I would never paddle something for a little while and be able to make a judgment from that, I'd have to get in one for a little while, say, maybe half a day. I wasn't sure about the Pack at first, but it's a great compromise between stability and light weight. Not very many solo craft that are widely available AND weigh less than 40-pounds.

Griz, have you paddled the Pack Angler enough to do a report on it? I haven't seen more than a comment on here about it, so I'm curious how you like it.

Well sir, I took it on a 7 mile trip Tuesday. I should have spent some time in it getting it set up before I took the float. The first bend and root wad I way over steered, and can attest to your statement that it is actually hard to tip over. Not a very forgiving boat if you over steer. My legs got tangled in that "removeable work deck" so it was removed as soon as I hit flat water. After the first two miles I was talking to myself, I said "self why on earth did you buy this thing rather than the 15 ft. Camper and sit in the front seat and run it backwards?" Self said "you were wanting a solo canoe or kayak so get used to it." Once I started treating it more like a kayak we got along very well. Using my hips to twist it and not over paddling and steering. I did not think I would like the seat, but found it fine, sits a bit low but allows you to work the boat in faster water by leaning and twisting. As stated in other post the seat may need moved forward a bit, takes a pretty big cooler to flatten it out, for my 240 lbs. I found it comfortable to fish out of, did both spin and fly. I did not attempt to stand up, I prefer to stop and wade if I want to stand. Have not messed with the anchor or rod holder, looks like stuff I will not use. I happened to get a decent price on the angler addition but if was buying straight away would buy the pack, lower the seat and use a sitbacker. The plastic seat may get hard on long days, and not much of a way to add padding to the formed seat. The removeable work deck is now a removeable rear deck handy to keep some stuff in. I tried both type paddles, fishing the regular paddle was good, rest of the time the kayak paddle was great, but recommend at least a 230 or 240 the 220 was a bit short. If it had not blew up this storm this morning I would have it out again, may go out and move the seat forward a bit. Looks like nice weather this weekend. Think the pack and I will be friends for a long time once we get used to each other.

g

[Al Agnew]

Well sir, I took it on a 7 mile trip Tuesday. I should have spent some time in it getting it set up before I took the float. The first bend and root wad I way over steered, and can attest to your statement that it is actually hard to tip over. Not a very forgiving boat if you over steer. My legs got tangled in that "removeable work deck" so it was removed as soon as I hit flat water. After the first two miles I was talking to myself, I said "self why on earth did you buy this thing rather than the 15 ft. Camper and sit in the front seat and run it backwards?" Self said "you were wanting a solo canoe or kayak so get used to it." Once I started treating it more like a kayak we got along very well. Using my hips to twist it and not over paddling and steering. I did not think I would like the seat, but found it fine, sits a bit low but allows you to work the boat in faster water by leaning and twisting. As stated in other post the seat may need moved forward a bit, takes a pretty big cooler to flatten it out, for my 240 lbs. I found it comfortable to fish out of, did both spin and fly. I did not attempt to stand up, I prefer to stop and wade if I want to stand. Have not messed with the anchor or rod holder, looks like stuff I will not use. I happened to get a decent price on the angler addition but if was buying straight away would buy the pack, lower the seat and use a sitbacker. The plastic seat may get hard on long days, and not much of a way to add padding to the formed seat. The removeable work deck is now a removeable rear deck handy to keep some stuff in. I tried both type paddles, fishing the regular paddle was good, rest of the time the kayak paddle was great, but recommend at least a 230 or 240 the 220 was a bit short. If it had not blew up this storm this morning I would have it out again, may go out and move the seat forward a bit. Looks like nice weather this weekend. Think the pack and I will be friends for a long time once we get used to each other.

g

Griz, you have a couple of choices for padding on the molded plastic seat, and I've used both separately and together. Option number one is a Thermorest type self-inflating foam pad, one inch thick. They make them of the right size to be a seat pad. Two is a shaped gel-filled pad that is made specifically for either tractor style canoe seats or kayak seats...you'd have to look at the shape of your seat and a picture of the pad to see which one would work the best. You can get them from Piragis Northwoods among other places. Like I said, I've used both together for lots of padding, but either one separately will give you enough.

Don't know how easy it would be to move the seat forward with the Angler package, but it really will make a big difference if you can do it easily enough.

Sounds like you're quickly finding out that a marketer's idea of what an angler wants isn't necessarily what YOU want, which is why I advocate getting a regular canoe hull and customizing it yourself.

[RSBreth]

Well sir, I took it on a 7 mile trip Tuesday. I should have spent some time in it getting it set up before I took the float. The first bend and root wad I way over steered, and can attest to your statement that it is actually hard to tip over. Not a very forgiving boat if you over steer. My legs got tangled in that "removeable work deck" so it was removed as soon as I hit flat water. After the first two miles I was talking to myself, I said "self why on earth did you buy this thing rather than the 15 ft. Camper and sit in the front seat and run it backwards?" Self said "you were wanting a solo canoe or kayak so get used to it." Once I started treating it more like a kayak we got along very well. Using my hips to twist it and not over paddling and steering. I did not think I would like the seat, but found it fine, sits a bit low but allows you to work the boat in faster water by leaning and twisting. As stated in other post the seat may need moved forward a bit, takes a pretty big cooler to flatten it out, for my 240 lbs. I found it comfortable to fish out of, did both spin and fly. I did not attempt to stand up, I prefer to stop and wade if I want to stand. Have not messed with the anchor or rod holder, looks like stuff I will not use. I happened to get a decent price on the angler addition but if was buying straight away would buy the pack, lower the seat and use a sitbacker. The plastic seat may get hard on long days, and not much of a way to add padding to the formed seat. The removeable work deck is now a removeable rear deck handy to keep some stuff in. I tried both type paddles, fishing the regular paddle was good, rest of the time the kayak paddle was great, but recommend at least a 230 or 240 the 220 was a bit short. If it had not blew up this storm this morning I would have it out again, may go out and move the seat forward a bit. Looks like nice weather this weekend. Think the pack and I will be friends for a long time once we get used to each other.

g

Very, very cool.

I do lots of portaging upstream and then floating back, so weight was the major priority, but I've come to like the little bugger. It won't be my last solo (I'm wanting a good 14' tripper solo) but it'll do for around here just Smallie fishing, and sneaking up on Ducks.

Keep us all posted on how you're liking it the rest of the summer, as you have time.

Al's advice is good, you'll need to make sure you butt doesn't fall asleep!

[grizwilson]

Griz, you have a couple of choices for padding on the molded plastic seat, and I've used both separately and together. Option number one is a Thermorest type self-inflating foam pad, one inch thick. They make them of the right size to be a seat pad. Two is a shaped gel-filled pad that is made specifically for either tractor style canoe seats or kayak seats...you'd have to look at the shape of your seat and a picture of the pad to see which one would work the best. You can get them from Piragis Northwoods among other places. Like I said, I've used both together for lots of padding, but either one separately will give you enough.

Don't know how easy it would be to move the seat forward with the Angler package, but it really will make a big difference if you can do it easily enough.

Sounds like you're quickly finding out that a marketer's idea of what an angler wants isn't necessarily what YOU want, which is why I advocate getting a regular canoe hull and customizing it yourself.

You are exactly right, if I had not got the angler edition for less than I could buy a straight Pack I would not have got it. Thanks for the heads up on the padding I am ordering one today. As I get older that is the only place on my body I can lose weight. The weather is great, got off work think I am gone to the creek.

g

[Wayne SW/MO]

Put me in the catagory of the Wilderness boats too. Hey Wayne, wanna get rid of that Pam 100? Had mine over 5 years now with a patch on it and it is still going strong!

I would Ollie, but I'm afraid when you came to get it my grandson would bite you, and he hasn't had all his shots. :lol:

[bigredbirdfan]

I took the ultimate 12 out on a float this weekend using a demo from a retailer. Overall I guess I liked it. It is stable in current like a canoe as everyone here mentioned. I am use to fishing from a john boat and therefore I found sitting down on the floor of this boat hard to get use to. I missed lots of good spots bc I wasn't as accurate on my casts given this seated position. It required quite a bit of correcting in slow water. Keep in mind this is my first experience in anything close to a kayak. I think if that darn seat where up about 8 inches I would have loved it. I spent most of my time on my butt because I didn't feel stable standing up which ultimately (pun intended) lead to a sore back on day two. Anyway I'm probably as picky as they come and I have the worst time pulling the trigger on any purchase and I did not buy the boat yet. I would like to try the raised seat that can be purchased. It did require two of us to load on top of a car. I think I could have loaded in the back of my pickup with no problem. Would like to ride in a 14' one of these but they only demo the 12'. I want to try a solo canoe before I make any decisions. Wondering if there is somewhere I could demo one??

[Wayne SW/MO]

Big red the casting is something that comes with experience. As to positioning, many including myself carry a 2' paddle which can be used with one hand to make corrections.

I'm small in stature but I have no problem loading mine. I use a cart to get it to my SUV and I have an extension that slides out of my rack, I then only need to lift one end, set it on the extension and then lift the other end.

[RSBreth]

The seat height is another reason some of us like the canoes better. I don't know of any store that would let you demo, but some of us are close, you could P.M. and see if one of us solo guys could let you paddle around for a while. To bad Al A isn't closer.

[bigredbirdfan]

Thanks RS. I think I want a solo due the the seat height and Al's big point of open floor plan. Really want to do a 3 day float on the James this fall and I will need plenty of gear to make it two nights. I need to sell a 14' Richline V bottom boat first and my budget is like $8-900 (with plenty of accessories) less would be better. Pro Bass would have to special order a Pack. I saw a guy on here bought a Field and Stream for $350 and I would buy one today at that price. Other suggestion of solos are appreciated.

[ness]

Other suggestion of solos are appreciated.

Wenonah Vagabond or Wenonah Solo Plus

I currently drive a Solo Plus. Got it when my kids were young and could put a couple in there with me. They're big enough now I'd only do one. It's a better solo than tandem canoe -- I would only put a smaller person as second. If I was buying one now, it would be the Vagabond or something like it.