If You Could Only Have One Fly Rod

[Wayne SW/MO]

When it comes to trout and bigger fly's for smallies, there is no perfect rod. Its no different than baitcasters or spinning rods, the "lure" has a lot to do with the choice. You need a heavy line to throw big air catching fly's, and you need a heavier rod to throw the heavier line.

Sometimes, depending on the rod, you can move up to a heavier line on a rod for a certain application, such as a 6wt line on a 5wt rod to give you a little for push.

I have a 6wt Scott that has no problem throwing a 7wt bass taper.

[Dan Sweeney]

Get you a 8 to 9 foot long 6 weight for now. You can manage the smaller trout flies alright, but still handle decent sized bugs and streamers for bass. BUT, you may as well plan on getting lots more rods. Fly fishing is like any other hobby. Once you decide you like it and start to figure it out, you'll go pick up a 7 or 8 weight for open water bass, then an 8 foot 5 weight for river trout, then a 6 or 7 weight with a slower action for streamers at night for trout (so you can tell when the rod is loaded without being able to see). Then you'll have to have a 6.5 to 7.5 foot 4 or 5 weight for small stream bass and panfish, and maybe pond bluegill. Then you'll develop a soft spot for split cane rods and have to start the process all over again with cane. And woe unto you if you decide that you like something such as steelhead or salmon or saltwater flats...

But, you're already a fisherman, obviously, so you already understand this progression! Enjoy the ride!

P.S. And then you'll read somewhere how much fly fishing resembles the asthetic of traditional archery, so you'll buy an old recurve bow. Then decide to start making your own bows out of hackberry trees behind the house...

[ColdWaterFshr]

There is a lot of wisdom in purchasing 2 lower-priced outfits, say a 5 wt for trout and a 7wt for smallies, as opposed to buying a single more expensive 5 or 6 wt and trying to use it for both. For every $700 rod thats out there, there are plenty of $100-150 rods that cast just as well. And this is more so true with reels. Like others have said, unless you're chasing steelhead or bonefish, or other fish that can make long runs, there is no need for a fancy reel, at least not around here.

Get a good fly-line, of course, but as far as rods and reels there is a WIDE variation in what you are truly getting for your buck. Take it from a fool who knows. Don't buy into the myth of expensive fly-tackle being so superior. It makes you a like a woman buying an expensive purse. Look at yourself in the mirror and axe yourself this, "Do the fish really know that I am holding a StreamDance GLX, or a Cabela's III Forks, and do they care about the cork handles' imperfections?" One is $700, the other is $30.

[eric1978]

Leaders and tippet go by X numbers instead of pound test, although the spools usually have the pound test on them as well. The X numbers (like 3X, for instance) denote the diameter of the line, not its strength. Since you're using a leader that tapers down to thinner at the end, it would make no sense to add tippet that's thicker than the end of the leader. So if you buy a leader that's 3X, say, and gradually lose a couple feet, the end is now probably about 2X or 1x (the smaller the number, the thicker the line--go figure) so you'd add 3X tippet to it to get it back to the taper it originally had. If you've just put the leader on, but want tippet on the end (for fishing a double nymph rig, for instance), you'd add a length of tippet that's either the same, or one number thinner, than your leader. For smallies, 2X leaders and tippet is as thin and light as you'll ever need, and it's no problem using 1X or 0X. For trout, most of the time I use 3X, sometimes if I'm using pretty small flies I'll go to 4X, and if I want to use a really small dry fly like a size 18 or 20 (the numbers get bigger as the flies get smaller, too--go figure) I'll go to 6X, which is about 1.5 or 2 pound test. Personally, I really like to use fluorocarbon tippet for any sinking flies, but you almost have to use regular mono tippet for dry flies because it doesn't sink as quickly and take the fly down with it.

All these replies have been very helpful fellas...keep 'em comin'!

Thanks for taking the time to post such a comprehensive tutorial, Al. That was a big help.

What are the knots that are used to tie backing to line, line to leader, leader to tippet? That's a lot of knots! Do you guys just use the good 'ol palomar knot to tie your flies, or is there yet another knot I need to learn?

Are leaders' sizes determined by the thickest part of the line, or by the tapered part? What I mean is, if I was using a 3X leader, does that mean that it starts out thicker than 3X and tapers down to 3X?

[drew03cmc]

The knots that I use are the arbor knot for tying my backing to my spool, the albright knot for tying fly line to backing, nail knot (if the line does not have a loop) to attach a perfection loop to the line, perfection loop (if I am using a tapered leader) for leader to line, double surgeon's knot for tippet to leader and the Davy knot for tying on my fly. I typically use a furled butt section to eliminate the need to constantly add tippet to a tapered leader, but that is another story.

Your tapered leaders will begin at over .025" diameter and will taper down to anywhere from .011-.009 depending upon your tippet X rating. I like to use nothing heavier than 4x, and often 5x when I am fishing small wet flies for panfish or bass on a 4wt.

[Wayne SW/MO]

What are the knots that are used to tie backing to line, line to leader, leader to tippet? That's a lot of knots! Do you guys just use the good 'ol palomar knot to tie your flies, or is there yet another knot I need to learn?

Wouldn't you know it, it depends? For me it depends on the application, there's little use in tying a Palomar knot when using 2# or 3# test leader. While you might gain some strength with it, 10% of 2# isn't worth losing that much tippet. By the same token if you're using a simple 3 piece leader for throwing large Smallie flies, it could well be worth it. Its pretty easy to throw a leader together for Smallies, they aren't leader shy and you can get better turnover with your own.

The tapered leaders you buy are sold by the breaking strength of the weakest part, I.E. the end section.

[Brian K. Shaffer]

Note to everyone :

If you missed Al's 2nd post on page 1... you should read it.

Extremely well explained and easily understood " crash course " or

introduction to understanding fly fishings basics.

Brian

[Al Agnew]

Eric, lots of fly lines already have a loop on the end nowadays, and I think they all should. So the last couple lines I've bought I've made sure they had the loop. Leaders usually come with a loop as well, so you attach the leader to the line loop to loop. Also, whenever you buy the reel, you should go ahead and buy the line and backing and get the reel filled, that way you won't have to worry about all those knots. The main knots you'll need to know are the double surgeon's knot to attach tippet to leader, and whatever knots you use to tie the fly on. Like Wayne said, with bigger flies and heavier leader/tippet, the palomar works just fine, but with very small flies and fine tippet there are other knots. I usually use just an improved clinch knot with only three or so wraps on small flies...don't want a big knot.

The palomar really comes in handy when nymphing with two nymphs. The way I rig two nymphs is to tie a section of tippet about 18 inches long to the leader with a double surgeon's knot. Tie the first nymph using a palomar knot about 6 inches below the knot between leader and tippet, leaving the rest of the tippet as a long tag end of the palomar, then tie the second fly onto the end of that tag end. Then I put split shot just above the leader-tippet knot, and the knot keeps the split shot from sliding down to the first fly.

[Buzz]

Hey Eric, you really should listen to these guys because they really know what they are talking about. Heck, I've learned a lot just reading this thread.

That being said, I will tell you that I am probably the cheapest fisherman you could ever want to meet. I have an Okuma 4/5 rod and an Okuma SVT reel that was purchased at Academy Sports and Outdoors. Total cost was right at $100.00. Until recently, I had it rigged up with 5 wtf SA flyline ( about $25.00 ), but found a spool of Orvis 4 wtf line that I had bought a while back and forgotten about ( can't remember what I paid for it ). Backing line came from Wal-mart for about $ 5.00. I've used this rig for the last 2 1/2 years and have done everything you are talking about. Dries down to about #20 and big streamers up to #4's.

I don't really get into the tapered leader and all of the knots either, although this year I purchased 4 furled leaders, 1 mono and 3 thread, which I have been using more as an extension of the flyline. Usually I'll just use a 9' length of Fluro in either 2 or 4 lb. test line for nymphs and streamers and as was said earlier, I also use regular mono for dries. The knots I use are the arbor knot, blood knot, and the old tried and true improved clinch knot.

I guess what I'm really saying is, buy what you can afford. Get a rod and reel that feels good to you and go fishing. The really expensive part is the flies that you'll need, even tying your own has a pretty good start up cost.

Just my .02 worth.

[Al Agnew]

For what it's worth...

When I first started fly fishing, it was because I was going to a couple of art shows in Michigan that just happened to coincide with the fall salmon and steelhead runs out of Lake Michigan, so I bought 7/8 wt. fly rods for my wife and myself from Bass Pro...I think they cost about $90 apiece. They were perfectly fine for the purpose. But as I got into it more, I decided to buy a more expensive rod. I bought a two piece 4 wt. Sage. The difference between it and the cheaper rods was like night and day, but I figured it was mostly because the 4 wt. was so much lighter. The next rod I bought was an 8 wt. Loomis. Well, it was about 5 times better than the BPS rod as well.

So my point is that you can fish just fine with rods under $100, but there IS a difference between them and the $250-350 rods...enough of a difference that, if you can afford it, I'd buy the more expensive ones. I've also fished with friends' rods that cost $600-900, and I couldn't tell enough difference to make paying that much worthwhile. So to me, it's a lot like the difference between a $50 baitcasting reel, a $150 reel, and a $500 reel. The $150 reel is worth the money, but the $500 reel is simply not 3 or 4 times as good.

And the thing is, if you really get into fly fishing, you'll be glad your first rod was a pretty good one, because you'll want a few more good ones. On the other hand, the difference between trout fishing and smallmouth fishing is wide enough that a compromise rod just won't do everything well, so the idea of buying two cheaper rods has a lot of merit.

Which, I guess, is a round-about way of saying I agree with Coldwaterfisher. Like he said, don't go overboard on high end fly rods and reels unless you have money to burn.