I'm Really, Really Sick Of This...

[Gary Lange]

I am sure that some of the Giggers don't care what they get as long as it swims they figure it is fair game. We have a few bad apples in the conventional fishing world so I am not surprised that we would have a few in the Gigging world also. They may even be the same persons. Some people just could care less about the future or the environment and see it as it is there's and they are going to take all they want.

Just like we try to police our own conventional Spin fisherman and fly fisherman by education I am sure that there are some Giggers that do only take Suckers and that are honest and straight forward in there sport. It is these people that need to police there sport and educate the ones that would take any and all. If we as conventional fisherman try to do it then the response is going to be "clean your own camp up before coming into ours". The fact is they would be right and I think we still have to educate a lot of our own anglers about conservation and making a future for our kids to enjoy.

[fishgypsy]

When is conservation going to get off their butt on this topic?

When it becomes politically expedient to do so. And I think that's the point Chief and others are making- it's all well and good to gripe about it on internet boards, but at some point you're just preaching to the choir. The real work is bringing it to the attention of other anglers, the MDC, agents, and the general public.

My cell phone doesn't work in all areas of the state, particularly on a lot of the streams I fish. But I always carry a digital camera with me, and unless I've forgot to charge the battery, it works. Take pictures of dead fish, email them to agents along with a report of what you saw, where you saw it, that you're concerned for the resource, and that you'd like to see more enforcement at that access/stream. Most agents are pretty obliging to that sort of thing- they're looking for the bad guys too, and could use some extra eyes. I made a quick and dirty cheat sheet for my car- a list of agents in the counties I fish, along with their direct (home office) telephone numbers and e-mail addresses. Most of it's available online at the MDC website.

Increase awareness- write letters to the Conservation Commission and others. Join the Conservation Federation of Missouri and bring it up there as an issue. Join other advocacy groups- MSA, Stream Teams, Missouri Chapter of the American Fisheries Society, and make them aware of your concerns.

I understand we're all crunched for time, but for me the "When I get the chance to go fishing, I want to spend that time fishing," is a load of bull, and seems pretty selfish to boot. I understand the sentiment, and I'd love to spend all my time on the water fishing or floating, but invariably I'm picking up someone else's beer/pop cans, bottles, glass shards, food containers, styrofoam/plastic bait boxes, cooler parts, sandals, red NO MORE TRASH bags, popped inner tubes, snagging hooks, line, lures, watershoes, and other assorted crap. Should I have to? No, but sometimes you do things you don't enjoy for the benefit of the things you do enjoy. Just add snapping dead fish pics to the list. How long does it take to take a picture of a big, gigged, dead smallie? Five seconds? Ten seconds? Not a biggie. If I have to spend fifteen minutes or a half hour of my trip dredging up and taking pictures of stinky gigged fish, because I think the resource may ultimately benefit by my doing so, well then so be it.

I'm headed out on an extended MO fishing binge in a week or so- Meramec, Current, and NFOW are on my list of places to go. I'll see what I can do.

[ness]

Any reason not to share the Agent names, e-mail addresses and numbers? They're on the web, right? I'd put those in my phone today if I had them.

Lotsa folks have e-mail on their phones, but did you guys know you can text to an e-mail address? If you've got the capabilities, you could attach a picture too. That'd be a pretty effective way to communicate a violation, no?

[fishgypsy]

Any reason not to share the Agent names, e-mail addresses and numbers? They're on the web, right? I'd put those in my phone today if I had them.

Lotsa folks have e-mail on their phones, but did you guys know you can text to an e-mail address? If you've got the capabilities, you could attach a picture too. That'd be a pretty effective way to communicate a violation, no?

No reason, I just didn't know where all everyone fishes. Here's the link for finding out which agents patrol what counties, and their phone numbers. Most MDC email addresses are simply the person's first and last name, separated by a period, with the...suffix? @mdc.mo.gov. For example:

If the agent's name was John Doe, his MDC email would be John.Doe@mdc.mo.gov . It's not 100%, but I would assume you could contact the office the agent is working out of and request his MDC email address.

[Wayne SW/MO]

I am sure that some of the Giggers don't care what they get as long as it swims they figure it is fair game. We have a few bad apples in the conventional fishing world so I am not surprised that we would have a few in the Gigging world also. They may even be the same persons. Some people just could care less about the future or the environment and see it as it is there's and they are going to take all they want.

To put it into perspective however you have to bring the whole problem into today's world. It hasn't been that long ago that giggers who had no qualms about sticking a big trout or smallie had little chance of doing so. Enter stadium lights, strong lightweight poles and the historical habit smallies have of gathering deep holes, during the season, and you lose any advantage that the smallies have. If they can reduce suckers considerably, there is nothing to keep the same from happening to smallies. We talk about a few bag eggs, but how long do you think a school of smallies in a hole, maybe 300 yards long, will last? All this happening on a cold night miles from people, hunting without gunshots.

The enforcement and regulations either need to catch up with the technology, or the technology needs to be reduced to match the enforcement capabilities.

[ness]

No reason, I just didn't know where all everyone fishes. Here's the link for finding out which agents patrol what counties, and their phone numbers.

Doh!

Thanks for the link.

[Forsythian]

I couldn't stay away forever, just a quick hit: I'm real happy to see the amount of levelheadedness on this this thread, especially from those associated with the smallmouth alliance. Listen, I haven't put a smallmouth on a stringer in 20 years, and my son has been raised the same. There are giggers who'll blindly deny there is a problem in our ranks, but I'm not one of 'em. If anything, I'm more frustrated than those of you who are haters, because smallmouth fishing is affected AND I have a legion of cannibalistic "sportsmen" who don't want me to eat suckers in January.

'Course there will be those (Wayne et.al.) who are convinced all giggers are scoundrels, and there's no convincing them otherwise. Clearly, a gigger has at one time peed in your Wheaties... and for that I am sorry. I appreciate Taxidermy's honesty, and there's a bunch of you all who could save yourselves some time typing by just cutting and pasting his post.

Bottom line- Al this is especially targeted to you- the "argument" that enforcement is impossible is flat wrong. It is flat-out wrong and it is disingenuous for those of you out there to say there's nothing to be done except to take it away from everybody.

I'm telling you, if there was a CA rig with a jet boat parked at the slab at Hootentown one night, Delaware access another night, the word would get out all up and down the James River. They wouldn't even have to launch the boat... just be there at dusk. Come talk to the folks setting up, let them know you're there. Maybe you'll be back, maybe not. Maybe you'll launch, maybe you won't. This is all I ask, a token presence. A little outreach. The CA's are more than welcome in our camp... I'll bring an extra chair and we'll feed 'em.

Until then, it's dishonest to say the laws can't be enforced... no attempt is being made.

On a happier note, I am the proud owner of my first large-arbor fly reel, and I've got a new vest on the way! I'm gonna sit by the fire tonight, watch a movie, and organize some tackle... good times

[Chief Grey Bear]

What time are you talking about CGB? It's not legal to harass people on the water or take up a role of vigilantes. How do you propose to carry out this plan? You realize these people are leaving an access and traveling up or down river, seldom alone, in the dark of night? How do you propose that they be watched? The truth is I've known a few who would probably send you for a swim, at least if they did it wouldn't surprise me.

This is a job that requires legal authority and the threat of closures to bring under control. Our job is to convince the MDC that we don't see any proof that points to sources other than gigging.

If you weren't so hell bent on doing nothing but complaining......uh.....Look...... if you would use the same amount of time and energy thinking of constructive ways of combating the problem as you do concocting reasons why you can't, you would most likely stand a better chance of fixing the problem. At least somewhat.

Again, I will offer some thoughts. Maybe this time you build upon them instead of continualy tearing them down. Nobody is talking about HARASSING anyone. A simple 5 minute converstation will suffice. All you simply have to do is start with a little small talk like we all have, and before departing just let them know that this area is known for Wildlife Code violations and that your group is keeping it under surveillance. Let them know that you work as a group and you also have the local agent on speed dial. Now don't do this in any type of threatening tone, just normal conversation tone.

Don't forget, I have lumped in two threads with one thought. Last week it was "regular" fisherman that were taking all of the brownies on opening weekend. So I am saying that if you ran a few local access' a couple of times a month for one summer, the word would be out.

Anyway, it is not as hard to figure something out as you are making it out to be. I do appriciate the invitation to go swimming. I don't take too kindly to threats, so anytime they would like to talk about it, I will more than happy to oblige.

[Wayne SW/MO]

'Course there will be those (Wayne et.al.) who are convinced all giggers are scoundrels,

That's simply not true, in fact you won't find where I've ever posted anything about banning the practice. All giggers, no, but I've known a few that have no problem sticking anything that swims and it doesn't take many to clean out a river. I'll be the first to admit tat some areas and rivers show little, if any, illegal gigging, while others have these sudden drops in fish populations.

CGB if you think that was a threat from me you need to reread the post, slowly.

[eric1978]

I understand we're all crunched for time, but for me the "When I get the chance to go fishing, I want to spend that time fishing," is a load of bull, and seems pretty selfish to boot.

It's not selfishness FG, it's just a matter of what's realistic and what's not. I too carry out a bag of other people's garbage when I float, but if I see a beer can 100 yards up a hillside, I'm not parking the canoe and making the hike to get it. I truly admire and appreciate the time and effort that some folks put in to take care of our streams, but some of us just aren't blessed with that kind of time.

I think I made about a dozen trips to a stream in 2009, all of which were one-day trips or shorter. I saw a grand total of one gigging boat last year, because I just wasn't out there at night very much. And I tell you what, I don't know if they had illegal fish or not, but I wasn't about to play "vigilante conservation agent" and check their creel. That's not my right or my job. If I would have seen them in violation I would have certainly reported them as soon as I could, but I can't promise you I would have confronted them right then and there, because they could have been dangerous nut-jobs for all I knew. There's only so much an ordinary citizen can safely do.

I wish I had the ability to be more involved, but I don't, and that's just reality, not selfishness.