Mdc "open House Forums" On Didymo To Be Held

[exiledguide]

I'm gonna go ahead and call BS on this.

Excuse me, snagged in outlet 3 has made all this up? He didn't fish all these streams for all those years.

[snagged in outlet 3]

I knew when I put that out there that it would ruffle some feathers. I also stated I care for my equipment in relation to diddy.

We did those trips, those are the facts. Here is link to this disscussion from 2005 long before it made mainstream news. And long before Outside bend knew what was up. To ban felt at this point is, well, pointless.

http://flyfishingarkansasandmissouri.yuku.com/topic/1140/Didymo

Pete

[Outside Bend]

Excuse me, snagged in outlet 3 has made all this up? He didn't fish all these streams for all those years.

The quote you reference was about the role education plays in preventing the spread of invasive species. In a nutshell I said there's a place for education, but all the education up to this moment really hasn't changed the discourse, so what's the point in continuing down that avenue? If education isn't getting the job done, perhaps it's time for legislation.

I never claimed SIO3 is making anything up. How long didymo has been present in AR without incident is irrelevant- it's an issue NOW, it's affecting fisheries NOW, and the problem needs to be addressed NOW.

And the claim that claim didymo won't spread to Missouri because it hasn't happened yet is silly- I haven't been in a car wreck yet, but that doesn't preclude me from being in a car wreck tomorrow. Unforseen events do happen.

And as I said earlier, didymo has already demonstrated its ability to adapt and colonize areas very different from those where it's native.

[flytyer57]

I am sure that what OB was calling BS on was the part about the education.

There has ben plenty of education on this subject. All one need do is pick up a flyfishing mag once in a while and read about it. People here have posted numerous articles on the subject.

Some people just don't want to listen, and if they don't, education on the subject will not work.

[Outside Bend]

I knew when I put that out there that it would ruffle some feathers. I also stated I care for my equipment in relation to diddy.

We did those trips, those are the facts. Here is link to this disscussion from 2005 long before it made mainstream news. And long before Outside bend knew what was up. To ban felt at this point is, well, pointless.

http://flyfishingarkansasandmissouri.yuku.com/topic/1140/Didymo

Pete

Because felt soles can't transfer sediment from one stream to another? (it's been shown they can.)

Because felt soles can't carry viable didymo cells and other invasive critters? (it's been shown they can.)

Because felt soles are easy for anglers to completely disinfect? (it's been shown they're not.)

Because we can't control wildlife hygiene? (We can't, but we know didymo invasions mirror people habits, not wildlife habits.)

Because felt sole bans are unenforceable? (As unenforceable barbless hooks, unleaded flies/lures, and many other fishing regulations.)

Because felt soles have been used for years without without incident (again, that doesn't preclude didymo invasions from ever happening, and even in its native range didymo can be innocuous for years before becoming an issue.)

So what is it, exactly, that makes banning felt soles pointless?

[Chief Grey Bear]

I hope they ban felt if for no other reason than to peese off all the snotty fly fisherman.

[flytyer57]

I hope they ban felt if for no other reason than to peese off all the snotty fly fisherman.

I already got rid of the felt so it won't peese me off.

Oh wait, I fish buggers and streamers so I'm not a "snotty fly fisherman."

Carry on...

[little bronzie]

Good points were not that far apart. My concerns are that most the people that fish these streams do not live near the meetings that are scheduled. Also if your talking about Taney couldn't the water left in my engines cooling system after leaving The white river end up in Taney? I first waded an Ozark Stream in 1957 at Alley Springs State Park and almost all of my adult life my free time has spent chaseing smallmouths and the last I want to see is anything happen to these streams but I find it kind of funny that this has become an issue only after a new sole has been marketed by Sims, Orvis, etc. that don't work as well as felt. My whole issue is safety, if these new soles worked as well as felt I,d be the first one to buy them. The only info I get about them are from the marketing division of the manufactures. If someone who wadefishes the James or the Finley, Castor,Upper Big Piney, Marble Creek, East and middle forks of the Black river,St Francis tells me that these soles work as well as felt I will have no problem using them.

I've had my Simms boots for over a year and have yet to take a spill. Metal studs, that screw into the bottom of the boots were also bought but I haven't "felt" the need for them. If I waded on more large flat rocks I could see where the studs might be more safe. I bought the boots because it's just a matter of time before Missouri has it's first case of diddymo. I kayak fish a lot(with waders) and also stream wade. I could be in the Maramec one day and the Big Piney, Little Piney or Gasconade the next and conseration area lakes also and could transport a lot of plants or organisms that don't naturally occur from watershed to watershed. This was another big factor in my making the switch from felt to rubber soles with no regrets. I always make sure to sponge out any water that gets into the hull of the kayak. This is another point of entry for invasives. Our trout parks already have or will be initiating wader wash stations soon, hoping to encourage people to use them.

[troutfiend1985]

Troutfiend-

The chances of being caught without a license in MO are pretty low, yet most folks still buy the license. The chances of folks being caught using bait in a Blue Ribbon section, or keeping too many, or keeping undersized fish- they're all pretty low. That doesn't prevent us from putting those regs on the books, and often times just the possibility of being caught in the wrong keeps folks honest.

That's fine OB, but just use that logic and take it to the next maximum. It only takes one person to screw up a fishery right? Regulations are great, and they serve their purpose, but without enforcement this is just paper. It's not as easy to spot someone wearing felt soles as it is to spot someone poaching or keeping over their limit. If the MDC does ban felt, ok but that better not be the last step or the purpose that this regulation is to serve will be frustrated. Regulations need enforcement, and to me this seems to just seems to be a tax on the abiding citizen, as a fishery could be decimated by one idiot who chooses not to abide by this regulation. With the lack of enforcement in MO, this is a real issue that needs to be addressed.

The fact that this conversation is still going on is Exhibit A in how the educational messages of various state and federal agencies as well as a number of NGO's isn't working- if it were, we'd all be on the same page. IMO we've tried the education route, and it's got us about 30% of where we need to be. Sometimes you need the carrot as well as the stick.

No. Just because people don't necessarily agree with a ban of felt does not mean that education is not working, and there are some holes in the felt transfer theory. SIO3 is a great example. Just because some people see an issue in a different light does not mean that educational messages are failing. We've had this one before, I know the theories, I wash my waders and boots every time. . . I understand why there is a push to ban felt, but there are still gigantic questions out there about the transfer of this substance. I still want to know why the heck Didymo has been here for years in the White, and not in MO. Are there going to be restrictions on boats etc. ? We've had that discussion before on this forum and there was no answer. These are the issues that people are pointing to OB, and hopefully these issues and concerns will be brought up in the meeting. You have your views, that's fine but the mere fact that there is awareness of the issue of didymo shows that the education process is reaching people, is getting people to form opinions on the issue and getting people actively engaged with this subject matter.

[Chief Grey Bear]

With the lack of enforcement in MO, this is a real issue that needs to be addressed.

Do you have any information to prove there is a "lack of enforcement"? I keep hearing this but nobody provides any evidence to substantiate their claim.

No. Just because people don't necessarily agree with a ban of felt does not mean that education is not working, and there are some holes in the felt transfer theory. SIO3 is a great example.

Well not really. Does he know with out any doubt that he had diddy on and/or in his felt? Merely fishing waters that have been known to be infected in certain areas does not constitute the harbor of diddy in ones sole. And his he claiming that he was purposefully stepping in diddy and knowingly trying to spead it to other steams? In other states??