15 Vs 16 Ft Old Town

[Nightbrew]

Thanks again guys, Justin how bad are the buffalos? Any cracks, or has the outer layer gone by the wayside? I grew up in Gainesville, my dad could probably run over pick one up. Al, do you think mad river has a boat that would meet my standards? Still concerned about the shallow arch bottom.

[Gavin]

The Disco 169....paddles better than the 158...drafts a bit less than my Wenonah Spirit II....wider ends....a 17' boat is no big deal to solo...with some practice. Bigger is better in a tandem canoe IMO....

[Justin Spencer]

Thanks again guys, Justin how bad are the buffalos? Any cracks, or has the outer layer gone by the wayside? I grew up in Gainesville, my dad could probably run over pick one up. Al, do you think mad river has a boat that would meet my standards? Still concerned about the shallow arch bottom.

outside on the ends are pretty bad, I fix them with F26 construction adhesive to give them strength. Insides are pretty good so they don't leak. If you are interested I can take a closer look at what I have left, they are out in the weeds somewhere.

[Flysmallie]

The Disco 169....paddles better than the 158...drafts a bit less than my Wenonah Spirit II....wider ends....a 17' boat is no big deal to solo...with some practice. Bigger is better in a tandem canoe IMO....

I have a 169 and can stand in it just fine. And I'm a large guy. I solo it all the time. Yep it's heavy. Yep it's not the fastest thing on the water. But it works and I can haul a lot of gear when I need to.

[Al Agnew]

As far as I know, all the Mad Rivers are shallow V bottoms, so they'd be worse than the shallow arch.

Lots of tandem canoes are doable for solo paddling. I'm just trying to suggest what will work best if you're using it 90% or more of the time solo, and also want to be able to stand in it comfortably. I'd still choose the Guide over the Disco in that case, but understand that everything is compromise. Fast, easy-paddling canoes are usually a little too tippy feeling for standing comfortably. Canoes that have all that primary stability are going to be more difficult to paddle solo. I'm still thinking it's pretty much a toss-up between the Camper and the Guide...with the Camper having a slight edge.

There are other choices out there, though. The Wenonah Fisherman might have the most primary stability of any of the Royalex canoes. It's short and very wide. It's an asymmetrical hull with the bow an inch taller than the stern, but would still work well turned around backward and paddled solo from the front seat.

[Nightbrew]

yeah, I have looked at the fisherman and was concerned about it being too short. There is the kingfisher 16'. I dont see any info from wenonah on the hull design ie flat, shallow arch, shallow vee. Al, am I wrong in saying that the shallow arch hulls have an initial wobble to them, more so than a flat bottom? thanks again

[LarrySTL]

Thanks everybody for their posts on this thread.

Also, add me to the list of folks who would love a "canoes, yaks, mods etc" forum.

[Gavin]

The Disco 169 is a fine boat for hauling too much gear...and two people...Had a beautiful Mad River Explorer 17 in the quiver for a couple months last year...late 1980's boat, royalex, cherry bottom, and the wood gunnels were solid...Great handling boat but that shallow V bottom did not sit well with my wife...She will stand and fly cast out of the front of my Wenonah Spririt II or a Disco...or most flat bottomed 16-17 boats...She didn't like casting out of the front with that V bottom, and no flat spot for her cocktail. Sold it.

[Al Agnew]

It all depends upon how wide they are. A wide bottom with shallow arch is still pretty much flat in the middle where it's widest. For instance, that Disco 169 is described as shallow arch, but the bottom is essentially flat in the middle third. I believe as a practical matter that you'd find the Guide to be as stable as the Camper, so I wouldn't let the shallow arch description scare you. I also believe you'd find the Fisherman a little more stable yet, and the Kingfisher still more stable, just due to the greater width at waterline. No doubt the Fisherman is short, and if you are planning to be fishing while paddling it tandem I wouldn't go that short. the Kingfisher is getting big enough and so wide that it would really be a barge to paddle solo. Again, it's all compromise. You won't find the perfect canoe for everything you want yours to do. You just have to decide which characteristics are the most important to you, and give up something with the others.

[Al Agnew]

Geez, guys, there IS a canoe and kayak forum already! Just scroll down the list.