Identification

[Chief Grey Bear]

All of the fish I showed are from the exact same river. All with in less than 10 miles.

[tom bell]

Looks like a smallie mixed with Kentucky

[Feathers and Fins]

Playing with Neosho's again Brit.

[Chief Grey Bear]

Nope. But as you can see there is a vast and distinct diversity in markings among fish of the same species in the same waters.

Is that fish a hybrid? It is certainly a possibility. It certainly has some markings that can make for a valid argument. Some of those same markings though, I find missing in other photos posted here that also claim to be hybrids. So short of a DNA test, I guess we will never know. All we really have are opinions. And we all know what we think about my opinions.

[Al Agnew]

You're right in that the hybrid photos I've sent don't all show the same characteristics. As Wayne said, hybrids don't have to be half and half, they can backcross with either species. And individual fish can vary, as well. However, when you catch a lot of smallmouth, you get to know the characteristic patterns even with the variation, and when a fish in the hand has a pattern that is different from every other smallie you've ever caught, even if the difference is subtle, you notice it. And since smallies and spots DO hybridize, and both species are found in the waters you're fishing, the simplest explanation is a hybrid.

However...it is certainly true that hybrids are rarer in the streams where both species are native than they are in the streams where the spots invaded. For instance, I've never caught a hybrid in the St. Francis, where both species are native and the ratios are probably pretty similar to the southwest streams you fish. I'm sure it occasionally happens there, but it is far more common in Big River, just across the divide but a stream where spots aren't native.

Of course, you know that those smallies, and the hybrids, that we photographed can and do change color and either obscure the pattern or make it more prominent, often in minutes, in response to stress, water conditions, bottom composition, etc. A smallmouth that is almost entirely unmarked in the water will have those beautiful vertical bars and blotches by the time you get it to the boat. The pattern doesn't change...the darker spots and bands and bars and blotches are always the same shape and in the same place on the same fish, but they appear and disappear on that fish in response to its environment. So while the photos of hybrids I posted may not have the pattern of yours showing, if you gave them a few minutes they might have begun to show a similar one.

[Mitch f]

Chief, I think most people can look at the first photo you posted and say beyond a reasonable doubt that it's a hybrid.

[Chief Grey Bear]

You're right in that the hybrid photos I've sent don't all show the same characteristics. As Wayne said, hybrids don't have to be half and half, they can backcross with either species. And individual fish can vary, as well. However, when you catch a lot of smallmouth, you get to know the characteristic patterns even with the variation, and when a fish in the hand has a pattern that is different from every other smallie you've ever caught, even if the difference is subtle, you notice it. And since smallies and spots DO hybridize, and both species are found in the waters you're fishing, the simplest explanation is a hybrid.

However...it is certainly true that hybrids are rarer in the streams where both species are native than they are in the streams where the spots invaded. For instance, I've never caught a hybrid in the St. Francis, where both species are native and the ratios are probably pretty similar to the southwest streams you fish. I'm sure it occasionally happens there, but it is far more common in Big River, just across the divide but a stream where spots aren't native.

Of course, you know that those smallies, and the hybrids, that we photographed can and do change color and either obscure the pattern or make it more prominent, often in minutes, in response to stress, water conditions, bottom composition, etc. A smallmouth that is almost entirely unmarked in the water will have those beautiful vertical bars and blotches by the time you get it to the boat. The pattern doesn't change...the darker spots and bands and bars and blotches are always the same shape and in the same place on the same fish, but they appear and disappear on that fish in response to its environment. So while the photos of hybrids I posted may not have the pattern of yours showing, if you gave them a few minutes they might have begun to show a similar one.

I don't disagree at all.

Chief, I think most people can look at the first photo you posted and say beyond a reasonable doubt that it's a hybrid.

Except for the three biologist I sent it to. Can't get them to commit one way or the other.

[Mitch f]

I don't disagree at all.

Except for the three biologist I sent it to. Can't get them to commit one way or the other.

Chief, with all due respect, I can't believe a biologist would have a tough time figuring that out. So exactly what did all three biologist say? I know one thought it was a spot, which I really am doubting his credibity after that. What did he other 2 say? Not willing to commit is one thing, but I think they could go out on a limb and make an educated guess from experience. Unless they are fresh out of school. I think SIUSaluki has a fisheries degree and he knew instantly it was a hybrid.

[Chief Grey Bear]

If you will recall Mitch, in that inital correspondence he stated, "My first impression is it looks like a Spotted Bass...." which is apparently your impression too as you call it a hybrid.

Without having the fish in hand, all they will say is it appears that it might have hybrid type characteristics. And they also all stated as Al did about changes in appearance. Which we all knew. The terms possible, could be and may be, are not real strong commitments. Saying it looks like it could be one and it is one are two different statments. And it is that experience, which you seem to think they lack, that keeps them from making a possitive determination. Fish can take on many different characteristics that can make them appear one way or the other. I am sure they have seen far more smallmouth than most of us in their careers and that maybe why they won't put a definite determination on it.

I havent' said one way or the other either. And I won't. You jus like to argue with anything I say.

[Old plug]

Chief, I think most people can look at the first photo you posted and say beyond a reasonable doubt that it's a hybrid.

DNA is all that is all that is beyond reasonable doubt to me. I think that is why the biologist say that. That is the way it is with everything.