MoCarp

I think that is subjective....to me a "trophy" is a fish of any species too large to eat but too small for a wall hanger LMB In our area is 4-8 pounds with the pushing 9 being a wall hanger SMB 2-4 pounds and 5 pounds being a wall hanger Walleye 5-7 pounds with a 10 being a wall hanger yet in they last 15 years or so the really big walleyes we once had seem to be gone

"a small cadre of anglers realized that carp are actually difficult to hook, and once they are on the line, they fight with power an enough tenacity to test both tackle and an angler’s resolve. It is these qualities that earned the carp the nickname “freshwater bonefish.” Phil Monahan, Orvis I am sure your Wife/GF tells you that Old pregidous dies hard, like now otters get blamed for decimating SMB when the truth is more likely human over harvest....many a brown bass ends up on the plate...I would bet anyone would love a trip back in time floating the Meramec river before Europeans ever wet a foot...I am sure fishing would have been fantastic..prob a few more otters than now, yet today we want them gone.... whats a "nice"carp for you how long? how heavy? My dad never got into freshwater fishing....the size, number and table fair qualities made him spend those rare days fishing catching something bigger that the baits he used An interesting anecdote from my past...my brother and I were on a family camping trip in Cherokee NC....both of us were keen to catch a trout...we read field and stream and as 12 and 10 year olds were excited to catch a trout, we saw them mounted all over the tourist trap areas fish 5-10 pounds....we walked the banks trying to catch and came across a proud angler who informed us he had just limited out, and flipped open a wicker creel with grass in it with fish that were 8-9" long...the exact size of the cigar minnows we used for bait 2 week before...my brother was really disappointed and the look on his face made the man go into explain mode that those were nice fish for trout.....

done both......each has its own merits........if bronze backs AVG 8# with a shot at a 20# then it would be a no brainer.....if your eating them its a no-brainer..... carp are harder to fool...so a lesser angler may need to drop back to keep it simple..like popping bugs and bluegills on the bed..a sure bet....its fun but not particularly challenging...kinda like hunting 12 point bucks vs a doe....one a tad harder than the other

I love the way he puts the reel in the water on a big run in the summer in the large Ozark reservoirs, pods of carp cruse near bluff banks slurping insects that accumulate there, very scenic places....a float tube flyfishing on top would be an awesome... https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=carp+fishing+Korea&view=detail&mid=71EE3FEDA506CD167EF771EE3FEDA506CD167EF7&FORM=VIRE

it only works if they are in use at the time.....and it seems you may only get one or two warm ups before one of two things happen.....1) you get reprimanded for turning the headlights on or 2) you get a shore pass for turning the headlights on.........number two being preferable

agreed ...to many "old timers' pushing out fence rows tossing in old tires and setting it a blaze.....still see it in many a farm field as well....habitat is the key...I have a friend with a spring seep on his ground and I told him it would make a wonderful pond/wetland...his 1st response is it "would cut down on how many cattle he can keep"...this is the same guy who buys a rental house and cuts down all the trees "so they can't take out any power lines"...stupidity is rampant....its why tuff laws have to be put in place...one or two nimrods can jack up an area that could take decades to remediate....

from my understanding very little work was done on the spring river /neosho river/elk river.....from the ones that I have seen they are the ozark...however I think a full taxonomic test or DNA sample needs to be done from my understanding signs posted on please don't move rocks and could see some areas off limits during breeding...its more of what the feds want more than the states

personally I prefer slipping my hand in a pre-warmed victoria secret "34 DD" double barreled sling shot once every 30 min or so....

Some are quick to trash our state conservation Depts...yet they do a lot, since we have bee talking about smallmouth bass streams I found this to share

here read this S-L-O-W-L-Y ...I know for a fact genetic studies are underway in the SW Missouri.NE Arkansas, SE Kansas, and NE Oklahoma

spring river drainage in SW missouri..includes shoal creek center creek and north fork are the major streams...held in my hot lil hand hellbender eggs didn't know what the heck they were till year later

Ozark are also in the spring river system

shhhh its a secret

interesting observation, what do you think causes that? jet boat wakes? moving trees right up to the waters edge?.. there is a spot below grand falls near an old quarry on shoal creek that had its trees removed right up to the waters edge about 17 years ago..the last huge flood we had ripped that side of the river down and widened it by 40 yards!....created a huge gravel bar in the middle of the river....that bank it been stable for years even without the trees but once the old quarry bridge was removed the erosion happened..... or the snails that also host <--still changing hearts and minds one post at a time agreed man can obliterate spotted bass if efforts are truly made.....Passenger Pigeons, American Bison, the collapse of the Newfoundland Grand Banks cod fishery...we all remember cod fish sticks were cheap and plentiful..yet whole thing went belly up in the early 90's.....yes man can impact I asked a couple guys I know about that...if the only thing they had to do was concentrate on the spotted bass issue...its a work load thing we would need 4x the biologists just to keep pace to the normal things..like shock surveys waters are now only every 3 years...and many waters no longer get sampled..the asian carp issues, zebra mussels and invasive aquatic weeds tend to take priorities and pull our biologists away from the "fun stuff"....The makers of policy only direct actions to the most immediate needs...SMB genetics....and hellbender studies...are examples..just need more biologists to get more done these are areas that SMB alliance could fund studies with grand money to universities..for specific studies..also orgs like Muskies inc even pays for more aggressive stocking......I am sure working with the proper state agencies and groups would do amazing things yes that was me.......many times its hard for some to believe the hard numbers...as an example the shut down of the snapper fisheries in the gulf...fisherman catch the wiz out of red snappers right now..just can't keep them..numbers are growing as are the sizes..yet peoples livings were crushed with the bans on harvest...makes people salty....like anything..if someone have an ax to grind, they almost always have an interest.....in the end numbers don't lie....the truth to the matter is we don't have all the answers...almost all problems I have seen in any fisheries issue is 2 fold ...habitat...and over harvest......I was asked by a biologist on benthic mapping of streams.....MDC has no ability to do that..yet in Kansas they can map most any small lake with software available for off the shelf sonar.....not as applicable..so we have a cool carp angling bit of kit called the deeper.....with a boat are attached to a yak..you can get detailed benthic maps in a stream......would be useful to chart how gravel movement...bank eroding..pool depth etc..I will expect an every 3 year survey on some streams start and for the 1st time give hard numbers on streams...you heard it here first! SMB alliance could buy one and yak up some nice maps for your local MDC biologist..bet he'd love you for it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOhW3iyVBRI

Thats like saying don't put criminals n jail because they will just keep doing it...its like weeds in the garden...with effort they can be controlled Thats just what I would expect from a deticated fish stabber all warm water fish get them....with skill they can be removed..personally I'd like to see a NO CREEL on all SMB under 22" then only one

the Taurid Meteor shower events we see have a few interesting theories worth a read it is suggested that the remnants of a comet has caused cataclysms through out earths history, destroying ancient civilizations and causing mass extinctions..the discovery of the megalithic structures of gobekli tepe in the late 90's has pushed back the dates of our rise from hunter gathers from 5k years ago to more that 10k..roughly the end of the last Ice age..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFlAFo78xoQ

ok heres the deal....you don't stock SMB nilly willie...you go to whatever river...you shock up brood stock....not just any brood stock..but the best examples you can get...spawn them..return the young to the stream mom n pop bass came from....in fact I know from my contacts at the MDC we are doing a DNA fin clip study its suggested we have several strains in SW Missouri...I can tell you the elk river SMB are different from spring river shoal creek..yet both are comparatively, different having the larger gape, with their maxillary bone (or jawline) extending back well behind the eye of the fish; the maxillary bone of the northern smallmouth bass only extends up to the eye, but not further...our "neosho strain" yet the elk river fish are typically longer and leaner that spring river drainage fish...I think when a push for a call from TN strain SMB to be stocked in Grand lake it lit a fire under state agencies....TN river strain SMB would do very well in Grand.....and those fish would most likely spread up both the elk river and spring river drainage..........how that would play out is anyones guess I think those are some good observations

I have noticed that carp run larger in water with zebras ..blue cats also eat them as do many duck species..as far as a solution...I don't think thats the issue...it more of carp taking advantage of a food source...in some AZ lakes Redear sunfish have exploited them and has produced mammoth fish.....the places where the population of mussels exploded had lots of nitrate driven food....the great lakes were basically sewers and the zebras cleaned up the water so much so it had a positive impact on fish....will reducing or killing off the carp from a water have an impact? sure, but to what extent the mussels are suppressed to my knowledge has never been studied..it has been reported on this forum that zebras occur at great depths in bull shoals...if they are more prevalent at depth, the 2 questions are this A; is it because of wildly fluctuating water levels that we see in white river chain of lakes?...or B; that fish like Common Carp, Blue Catfish, Drum and Redears are able to effectively control numbers in the shallower depths these fish typically feed..the take on this is shellfish flavors in bait may be a good choice for cat/carp baits

I didn't kill the fish, its a borrowed pic...somewhere I have a pic of carp poop on a mat with crushed zebra shells in it..and a bass pic with a plastic worm hanging out its bunghole as far as fish cleaning skills, I have seen some godawful crappie butchering at Mutton on Stockton

interesting observation...boats have been documented in bank erosion, ....the ability to release fish you don't want to keep becomes an issue with jet boats..as well as fish pathogens.....IMHO spotted bass are more prolific than SMB.... water quality nationally got better because of new laws from the 60's nearly 70's..I know the explosives plant in Carthage dumped NG water right into center creek and below it the fish populations changed dramatically..canoeing once there was a pipe blasting water into the creek..my canoe buddy and I got extremely sick...pounding headaches, classic symptoms of working in the "powder" the upper reaches of center creek... above the powder plant is smallmouth water, below spotted bass....at one time we had another powder plan near Carl Junction so for over 100 years we have had that changing the dynamics of center creek...not the least was mining waste water issues..many documented fish kills etc ...zinc is a big time anti biological yet downstream from the areas in center creek is dominated by spotted bass...Center Creek would benefit from native SM bass reintroductions to mediate 100 years of habitat degradation..interestingly the warmer water streams feeding the spring river basin have few spots mostly LMB (dry fork) but North Fork is a more turbid stream and it has more spots...and they are some of the most heavily farmed areas in Jasper Co as a side note all the water used in the bulk of Jasper Co is well water...that has a huge impact on the aquifers that feed the streams, anyone has seen how wet weather makes springs run stronger.. and springs stabilize water temperatures. any sex chemicals should effect both spots and SMB the same...as far as growth rates SMB lose out to most all black basses I thing SMB seem more aggressive I think spots just put out more YOY giving their shape they would have bigger egg sacks and more eggs? tossing that out there agreed...silt not with standing IMHO stocking more smallies and removing more spots is the long term solution..shock boats removing spots couple times a year ....

Big Carp can feed heavy on the little clams...their mouths can be extremely tough so using very sharp hooks are a must

I think Missouri has a wanton waste law..its not enforced much buffalo and carp are commonly tossed on the bank...and you have made a good point perhaps donated signage by MO Smallmouth Alliance??? be a great social to get some together and put up signs in partnership with the MDC or local Government love it pet poop...and any other septic issues.....weeds suck up a lot of those nutrients yet we have very little in our waters.......wildly fluctuating water levels and rock bottom composition limits that...I hate to say it but there may in time be a silver lining in critters like zebra mussels

Try inside bends of that main channel, look for balls of bait, slab spoons near bottom for eyes bass/crappie/whites will be higher up..I liked tipping the hook with a 1" piece of crawler....you will also pick up some huge SMB this way..live minnows deep on fireball jigs are an option

My take is this..why does someone hire a guide? limited time/knowledge to learn a water...to ether A catch many fish...or B.. Trophy hunt...if you are a bass fisherman and go to lake fork ..I'd bet you go out with a guide to catch a trophy..but if you go out with a guide on LOZ thats prob not the case. I would bet the VAST amount of anglers do not fish with a guide....so why do they fish? Trout are not everywhere...so you go to Taney for Trout (sometimes other less chased species).... sitting with bait out can be a relaxing way to catch fish for some.... but others like more effort like night fishing for browns..... many anglers go through an evolution....from catching limits for the pan..to trying for that one fish for a lifetime.. or watching kids have a blast easy fishing.......

quality signage at put-in and take out points work...I remember the voluntary C&R signs on Taney years ago....