2003 M D C 10 Year Trout Plan

[Chief Grey Bear]

I just found this and thought you trouters would like to read it. I haven't read all of it yet, but there is a depth of information here.

http://mdc4.mdc.mo.gov/Documents/25.pdf

[fishinwrench]

Several things in there immediately jump out at me, I'll steer clear of the controversial ones since I'm not in the mood to start a rhetorical debate that I'm sure we've had before, more than once.

But there are two easy things I'm curious about that someone here probably can answer....

1. Why do you think Meramec Springs has a steadily declining number of "tags sold" ? I know My reasons for not going there very often, but I'm curious what other peoples reasons are for routinely bypassing it.

2. How was the data from pages 30-34 compiled ?

Was there an angler survey mailed out to Tag holders, and did anyone else here get to participate in the survey ?

I apparently missed out on it somehow.

[ozark trout fisher]

Several things in there immediately jump out at me, I'll steer clear of the controversial ones since I'm not in the mood to start a rhetorical debate that I'm sure we've had before, more than once.

But there are two easy things I'm curious about that someone here probably can answer....

1. Why do you think Meramec Springs has a steadily declining number of "tags sold" ? I know My reasons for not going there very often, but I'm curious what other peoples reasons are for routinely bypassing it.

2. How was the data from pages 30-34 compiled ?

Was there an angler survey mailed out to Tag holders, and did anyone else here get to participate in the survey ?

I apparently missed out on it somehow.

I have a few ideas regarding your first question. According to the people I've talked to, a lot of folks are just getting tired of the channelized, "high fence" nature of Maramec Spring. The way they have "improved" the stream has made it so there are basically just a series of long, slow pools. That's great for the meat fisherman who wants a quick limit, but those who are looking for something a bit more sporting often walk away disappointed. As fly fisherman, and catch and release fisherman steadily become more common on our trout streams, it seems that those folks would be trying to steer clear of Maramec Spring, thereby reducing the number of tags sold. Those who are looking for more classic trout water are going to just bite the bullet and drive the extra 45 minutes to Bennett or Montauk, or one of the wild trout creeks. That's my best explanation anyway.

[Chief Grey Bear]

1. I know My reasons for not going there very often,

2. I apparently missed out on it somehow.

I think I may know.

[laker67]

But there are two easy things I'm curious about that someone here probably can answer....

1. Why do you think Meramec Springs has a steadily declining number of "tags sold" ? I know My reasons for not going there very often, but I'm curious what other peoples reasons are for routinely bypassing it.

2. How was the data from pages 30-34 compiled ?

Was there an angler survey mailed out to Tag holders, and did anyone else here get to participate in the survey ?

I apparently missed out on it somehow.

It would be interesting to know how they selected the survey people. The first time I heard of a limit reduction was around 03 or 04. At bssp they were requesting a voluntary reduced limit to aid in future stocking numbers. I was told that new hatchery additions were on the way, but it would be 07 before any increased production could start. This was told to me by Mike Mitchell at bssp. He said that voluntary limit reductions would allow them to continue stocking at the same rates. Well, we know that did not happen as well as no new hatchery renovations and additions. Somewhere around 04, the limits were reduced to four fish officially. If they surveyed anglers on the creek or by mail, I was not one either FW.

As far as Meramec's declining trout tag sales, you're guess is probably the same as mine. It has never been a fly rod friendly stream. I think big numbers of fish were only released on holidays and derby days.

[troutfiend1985]

Several things in there immediately jump out at me, I'll steer clear of the controversial ones since I'm not in the mood to start a rhetorical debate that I'm sure we've had before, more than once.

But there are two easy things I'm curious about that someone here probably can answer....

1. Why do you think Meramec Springs has a steadily declining number of "tags sold" ? I know My reasons for not going there very often, but I'm curious what other peoples reasons are for routinely bypassing it.

2. How was the data from pages 30-34 compiled ?

Was there an angler survey mailed out to Tag holders, and did anyone else here get to participate in the survey ?

I apparently missed out on it somehow.

As to number 1, I don't know. Did you notice that Roaring had a decrease in tags sold? That struck me as odd, I can understand Meramec because I have heard negative comments about this area, but I really like Roaring.

This repart is also dated, the last survey year was 2001, so I wonder if the tags sales are representative of what 2008 and 2009.

I read some of this and I would really like to see more managed areas and more catch and release seasons. The only catch and release area that I know of outside the trout parks is at Hickory during the winter.

[laker67]

As to number 1, I don't know. Did you notice that Roaring had a decrease in tags sold? That struck me as odd, I can understand Meramec because I have heard negative comments about this area, but I really like Roaring.

This repart is also dated, the last survey year was 2001, so I wonder if the tags sales are representative of what 2008 and 2009.

I read some of this and I would really like to see more managed areas and more catch and release seasons. The only catch and release area that I know of outside the trout parks is at Hickory during the winter.

Between 05 and 07, all of the trout parks experienced reduced tag sales. It was so bad at bssp, that some of the local shops either closed, sold out, or considered selling out. Some like Larry's even cut back on hours of operation. Bssp had fewer and smaller fish in the creek. About this same time, taney recieved an influx of new fishermen. And they were not just the seasonal crowd, they were fishing year round. I know that alot of these new people were park fishermen because most still had park tags on their vests. Some say that it was based on the economy, but I say it had to do with the quality of fish available at the parks. Bssp has improved it's quality and quanity in the past two seasons probably out of necessity. This is a good topic. Thanks to everyone's response.

[Chief Grey Bear]

It would be interesting to know how they selected the survey people.

The one and only time so far that I have participated in a angler survey conducted by the MDC, I just happen to be at the right place at the right time.

It was in mid 90's at Bushwhacker Lake. It consisted of nothing more than a young, rather nice looking, college aged, intern or assistant that had a clipboard and number of questions that she would ask if you were willing to participate. As she was easy on the eyes, apparently she liked and was concerned about the outdoors, a very sexy trait, I was single at the time, I was a willing participant.

She spent the weekend at the boat ramp asking all the anglers a series of questions regarding the management of the lake. What questions I do remember had to do with the bass management and the slot limit.

Anyway, I think that is how the surveys are done.

[wily]

i too was at the right place at the right time.

i was at roaring river in the late 90's or so with my father in law.

he wouldn't leave until he got his limit, so i was just killing time waiting on him, when a mdc agent asked if i'd like to participate in the survey.

only took about 5 minutes...only about 20 questions.

most of the questions were geared towards quality versus quantity.

[Phil Lilley]

I don't know about other places but here on Taney they have creel checkers, what we call them, that work the whole lake on foot and from a boat. They come in the shop all the time for coffee and to warm up. Not sure but I think they've been at it this time for about 12-18 months but this stint is up Jan 31st. They ask fishermen a number of questions.