May 31 Report

[dtrs5kprs]

dtrs5, that is an instant classic!

And true to boot. Sometime I will have to go into detail on Wife and the view of the Northern Lights from Kimberling City

[SKMO]

Well to chime in on the snake issue my opinions are:

99% + of the snakes you see in the water are non-poisonous. The majority on TR are in fact Northern Water Snakes, also called Banded Water Snakes.

see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Water_Snake

I have only seen one copperhead in the water, and that was on a creek, but that said.... any snake can swim if it has a reason to. From a garter snake to a rattler, all can swim, but most choose not to. I have been bitten twice by a copperhead, and had 3 dogs bitten. I would compare it to a bad red wasp sting but not sure I ever got a full dose.

I have seen 4 cottonmouths that I could positively identify as such in 21 years of fishing this lake. One was on a dock on the Kings River, and the other 3 were above the Cape Fair Bridge. But I have floated Flat Creek from Stubblefield to EE and on to the lake maybe 8 times, and I think we saw water moc's 6 of those times, so there is a for sure healthy population in the Flat Creek drainage. Infested ? Depends on your definition. Seeing one or two on a float trip reminds me I am sharing the water with other predators and just adds to the experience for me.

On the fishing I have not much to add except a couple puzzlements:

1) Topwater bite is kind of lame for me right now. Yeah I can scratch a few fish early but usually this time of year I can count on some nice topwater fish from dead dark-thirty, unto breaking dawn, to the time the sun clears the hills. Sure I had some good topwater a short while back like everyone else, but the post-spawn, predictable "set your watch by them" topwater thing where you are surrounded with pods of fish for 90 minutes just ain't happening for me.

2) I can't pick up on the threadfin. I pretty much video fish from here on out and normally go on point when I see the threadfin balls as I am sure the predators (and my quarry) is close by. I can't find them (threadfin) right now. Winter die off? Maybe. For sure they are still out there, but all Spring I have been catching fish puking up 4-6" gizzard shad, not the norm in my boat.

Hint: Keep your boat at 20' or more and keep your back to the bank. Cast toward the Bayliners. The fish are positioned under the powerboats.

The shoreline is for sissies.

[Sam]

It's time for a snake story. The only good thing I can think of about increased population and fishing pressure here in the Ozarks is that people pretty well have the snakes stomped out. They used to be thick around the streams, and fishing these rivers with my grandpa in the 1950's and 60's I'd take a pellet gun or a .22 along and shoot snakes. We didn't mind the brown water snakes so much, but there were lots of cottonmouths too, and those things just look mean.

Once I turned 16 and could drive I got to do a lot more fishing, often by myself. One trip, I'd borrowed my dad's fly rod and was fishing below Bell Ford on James, between Fordland and Marshfield. I was standing at the top of a hole, wading belly-deep with chest waders, and I had a metal stringer with snaps clipped on a loop at the waist of those waders. The whole stringer was underwater, and my fish were tugging on the stringer - tugging hard actually. Yank, yank, YANK. Wait a minute - I'd looked at those fish not too long ago, and they were pretty much dead!

I got ahold of the stringer and pulled the fish up to see - and a cottonmouth as big around as my wrist had the bottom fish, a 10" goggleye, almost swallowed. When I pulled the snake's head above water he started thrashing around and hitting me with his tail and body, but he wasn't letting go. Now, the snake was attached to the fish, which was attached to the stringer, which was attached to me. If I'd been thinking rationally I'd have unsnapped the stringer from my waders and let it go, but somehow I wasn't thinking rationally at the moment - I ran.

Up on the bank and about 40 yards down a sandbar, the snake got tired of rocks hitting him in the head as he was dragged behind me, and he let go. I turned and chucked a couple of big rocks at him, but he escaped back into the water. I threw that bottom fish away, and during the whole incident I never dropped or damaged my dad's fly rod (I knew better).

I know this story is out of place here on the Tablerock forum, but I thought you guys might enjoy it. It was a close encounter of the worst kind, but at least he couldn't bite me while he had his mouth full.

[Bill Babler]

Sam, I had a similar story, but I for sure was not attached to the stringer. Had one get a big bluegill I had on a stringer fastened to a willow on my inlaws pond bank one time. I unlike you gave him the stringer and the fish. I was not that mad at him. Don't know if it was a cottonmouth or not. Really did not care.

Had a nice visit with SK, while I was in the Barber shop waiting to get both my top and bottom two hairs cut. On the thread fin issue, we probably had one of the biggest die-offs in my guiding career here. It lasted as long as I have ever seen, and may be some of the issue. SKMO reported them spawning this morning in high numbers were he was fishing. Good Sign.

The only Cottonmouth I have ever see on the Rock, was when I was with Bill Anderson on a fish servey in 04. We had 2 between the electrodes, that evening and the biologist identified them as such, so I knew they were. Short very dark and extremely thick, with the snow white gaping jaws. We also had 10's of other harmless water snakes about, but the college boys, pointed out the biters.

Copperheads on the other hand I have seen for years. They are beautiful. Compeletly bronze with the classic V shaped head and a true pit-viper. I have pinned many and always examine their fangs to make sure, but have seen enough so I know them. Like SKMO, have never seen one in the water. Usually on the roads at night or early or late soaking up heat.

Lady that owned the Timbers Resort was bitten one night several years ago after dark walking in flip-flops. They also had another guest bitten by one. With the research I have done, there has never been a fatality of a human by a copperhead bite. When she was bitten, the way she explained it to me was like being stung by two red wasps. YUCK

Cottonmouth is another story.

Completely agree with SK. You all had better start looking deeper for the bass type fishes, and it might be time to put those topwater baits away and work that jig, early and often.

Good Luck

[denjac]

My cousin and her husband are both professors at SMU. He is a herpetologist. One of his best collecting sites for cottonmouths is the Eagle Rock area. So they are out there!

[glennL]

guys... you're beginning to scare me now...

[techo]

Wow! This is one of the most interesting threads. I love the stories and there are quite a few great writers here. We don't much care for snakes and they give me the heepy jeebies. Fishing this weekend and when it is warm out....we often jump in the lake for a cool down. Not so sure I will be jumping in now!

[dtrs5kprs]

It's time for a snake story. The only good thing I can think of about increased population and fishing pressure here in the Ozarks is that people pretty well have the snakes stomped out. They used to be thick around the streams, and fishing these rivers with my grandpa in the 1950's and 60's I'd take a pellet gun or a .22 along and shoot snakes. We didn't mind the brown water snakes so much, but there were lots of cottonmouths too, and those things just look mean.

Once I turned 16 and could drive I got to do a lot more fishing, often by myself. One trip, I'd borrowed my dad's fly rod and was fishing below Bell Ford on James, between Fordland and Marshfield. I was standing at the top of a hole, wading belly-deep with chest waders, and I had a metal stringer with snaps clipped on a loop at the waist of those waders. The whole stringer was underwater, and my fish were tugging on the stringer - tugging hard actually. Yank, yank, YANK. Wait a minute - I'd looked at those fish not too long ago, and they were pretty much dead!

I got ahold of the stringer and pulled the fish up to see - and a cottonmouth as big around as my wrist had the bottom fish, a 10" goggleye, almost swallowed. When I pulled the snake's head above water he started thrashing around and hitting me with his tail and body, but he wasn't letting go. Now, the snake was attached to the fish, which was attached to the stringer, which was attached to me. If I'd been thinking rationally I'd have unsnapped the stringer from my waders and let it go, but somehow I wasn't thinking rationally at the moment - I ran.

Up on the bank and about 40 yards down a sandbar, the snake got tired of rocks hitting him in the head as he was dragged behind me, and he let go. I turned and chucked a couple of big rocks at him, but he escaped back into the water. I threw that bottom fish away, and during the whole incident I never dropped or damaged my dad's fly rod (I knew better).

I know this story is out of place here on the Tablerock forum, but I thought you guys might enjoy it. It was a close encounter of the worst kind, but at least he couldn't bite me while he had his mouth full.

My only Q is...How did you manage to throw the rocks and levitate / run / plane off all at the same time? That is great stuff, esp since you are still able to tell it.

[dblades]

I've seen more cottonmouth the last few years than I ever have. There have always been a few in Flat Creek, I used to see one occasionally when I fished it as a kid and granddad talked about cows getting bit by them. However, two years ago I was idling into a long cut on the White, above the mouth of Kings River. I noticed something swimming across the cut throwing a good size wake, curious I motored up to see what it was. I lived and fished in Florida for about ten years and this cottonmouth was larger than anything I ever saw down there. It must have been close to five feet long and looked as big around as my leg.

[Sam]

My only Q is...How did you manage to throw the rocks and levitate / run / plane off all at the same time? That is great stuff, esp since you are still able to tell it.

You know how hard it is to get up out of deep water and onto the bank - not that time it wasn't. I probably looked like a cartoon character, running on water. Once up on the sandbar I wasn't about to quit moving, and I was trying to get the stringer unclipped from my waders when I saw the snake let go and head for the river. He was really going and I turned around and missed him with a couple of rocks - his lucky day and mine too, I guess.

Before my time, my dad was fishing with a preacher on the James River on a Saturday. The preacher got his lure caught in a bush, didn't see a cottonmouth in there, and got his hand bit when he reached for the lure. Dad said the hand and arm swelled up and he was hurting pretty bad - a doctor tried to get some of the poison out, cleaned the wound, and bandaged the hand. The guy was feeling better the next day and he went to church and preached with a bandage on his hand - so I think maybe cottonmouths aren't quite as dangerous as they look. I still don't like them one bit, though.