Upside Down...a Bead Head Question

[esox niger]

I'll be honest...I was afraid to ask this question for fear of looking really stupid, until i read another post on another forum. Its often occured to me that with a bend down eye and a bead head....the fly will ride hook point up....it should even fall hook point up(maybe) so why are all of these bead head flies I see tied with wing case on the side that will ride down? take the prince nymph for example...I had always thought the white biots would ride on top of the fly...but with a bead head do they? Can anyone explain why things seem to be upside down? or is this just a case these flies being dead drifted more than swung or stripped.

Thanks

-C

[jdmidwest]

I have always seen them float point down with the bead slightly higher than the shank of the hook. The tippet and current seems to make them do that. Maybe in still water it would be the other way around.

I usually put a few wraps of lead wire on the hook and tuck it under the larger side of the bead and hold it in place. Straight eye or down bend, the hook point rides down.

[Wayne SW/MO]

That's a great question. The only thing I can come up with is that it was a habit that followed the dry fly. Streamers and dries pre-date nymph's. Streamers were tied on straight or up-eye hooks and the bend held then upright with the help of a flat, vertical body.

[esox niger]

Interesting from both of you! I tied one up on a straight eye and bent it in my vise. the bend is not as sever as a down eye but I'm going to have to pay special attention to the ride.

[fishinwrench]

I can tell you that my beadhead strip leeches and sparkle minnows with down-eye hooks ride hook point down when attached with a loop knot.

The angle of the tippet has alot to do with it. Flys in the kitchen sink with 18" of line tied to them don't always act the same when attached to a 9ft+ leader at more realistic fishing angles. A bead will only keep the hook point up if it is positioned near the bend of the hook..... I'm pretty sure.

Someone is gonna have to do some snorkling, or playing in a pool to find out for certain though.

I remember reading a study done on TD vs. STR vs. TU eye hooks, and the TD eye was decidedly better suited for hook point penetration because it reduces flex/bending between the eye and the hook point when pressure is exerted on it. Scud type hooks with TDE were the hands down winner in the ease of penetration tests, as were wide gap worm hooks like the Owner/Gami's.

[Trout Commander]

That's a great question. The only thing I can come up with is that it was a habit that followed the dry fly. Streamers and dries pre-date nymph's. Streamers were tied on straight or up-eye hooks and the bend held then upright with the help of a flat, vertical body.

So tell us what it was like when the first ever nymph was tied.

[eric1978]

Do you guys think it even matters on nymphs? If drifted freely they'll just kinda roll and tumble on the bottom anyway, yeah? I mean imagine when a real nymph gets dislodged and swept up in the current...I'm sure it doesn't drift in an upright, fixed position. That would look about as natural as this:

[duckydoty]

So tell us what it was like when the first ever nymph was tied.

Bwaaaahaaaahaaaaa!!!!!

Now that's just wrong TC

[Wayne SW/MO]

So tell us what it was like when the first ever nymph was tied

I thought I told you, they baked up a bunch of passenger pigeons to celebrate. I tell you things and tell you things and it goes in one ear and out the other.

Nymphs I think are prone to roll around like Eric says. I've watched them many times when sight fishing and I just didn't see them drift with any consistant atitude. Upside down seemed to be the normal for a lot of them and I suspect the tie makes a big difference. If most of the material is on top of the shank then whether it is bouyant or not will have some effect.

[Outside Bend]

Do you guys think it even matters on nymphs? If drifted freely they'll just kinda roll and tumble on the bottom anyway, yeah? I mean imagine when a real nymph gets dislodged and swept up in the current...I'm sure it doesn't drift in an upright, fixed position. That would look about as natural as this:

Not to mention I've never seen a natural nymph with a big glittering glob on the top of their head.

I want to say most beadheads ride with the point down, but I've never really paid attention, either. Fish like them, and apparently they're not paying attention to the orientation of the hook's point, either