Mdc Killed An Elk

[OzarkFishman]

I still don't have a definite opinion, but can you really make the point about grazing ... How many deer are there???

We can all agree that a moose wreck is worse. How many more deer wrecks will there be???

Numbers don't lie ... I would rather not look up the numbers and do the math tonight, but I can in the morning if you want.

Again, no opinion yet ... trying to stay OBJECTIVE.

[Outside Bend]

I still don't have a definite opinion, but can you really make the point about grazing ... How many deer are there???

We can all agree that a moose wreck is worse. How many more deer wrecks will there be???

Numbers don't lie ... I would rather not look up the numbers and do the math tonight, but I can in the morning if you want.

Again, no opinion yet ... trying to stay OBJECTIVE.

Deer/car accidents account for less than 5% of auto accidents most years in Missouri, and there's more than a million whitetails in the state. MDC is managing for 400 elk. We're talking about vanishingly small chances of anyone actually hitting one.

[Gavin]

Sorry Tom...you have defended the MDC's efforts vigorously, but I still dont see the value proposition relating to stocking elk in Missouri..They are neat to look at, but we have penned elk all over the state for folks to gawk at and snap photo's. I'll give the department major cred if they can grow enough elk to support a significant hunting season but that prospect seems highly unlikely considering that the target goal is 400 elk. Elk tags (if ever available) will be as scarce as honest men and gold tickets in Wonka Bars.

[jdmidwest]

A herd of 30 deer overgrazed an alfalfa field of ours one season to the point that it affected the hay crop. Elk need alot more than a whitetail daily. Properly hunted, the deer population was trimmed and it never happened again.

Elk are going to be managed differently, obviously no hunting seasons.

[Outside Bend]

A herd of 30 deer overgrazed an alfalfa field of ours one season to the point that it affected the hay crop. Elk need alot more than a whitetail daily. Properly hunted, the deer population was trimmed and it never happened again.

Elk are going to be managed differently, obviously no hunting seasons.

So you're saying when wildlife is properly managed, its negative interactions with people can be minimized, right?

I'm not sure how MDC repeatedly saying "Hunting is proposed to be implemented as soon as possible after the elk become established," indicates there will obviously be no hunting season. Yes it's only 400 animals, but western states are currently planning gray wolf seasons with an established population of only 100-150 animals. There may only be 200 bighorn sheep in a given western mountain range, yet those small populations are managed for hunting. Moose and mountain lion have pretty low densities out west, yet managing those populations for hunting isn't an issue. If other states can manage game populations of animals in the hundreds, we shouldn't have an issue with it.

[ColdWaterFshr]

OB, then why not bison, too? They probably outnumbered elk in Missouri once upon a time.

[OzarkFishman]

Let's not forget that we are not making the decision about what animals are re-introduced. There is plenty of data (other states) to see how to implement the elk restoration. While MDC has conversations with the public (via public meetings), they still have the final say.

I don't know if other states have ever tried to re-introduce bison in a non-fenced area ... ever seen Dances with Wolves. Those herds would run through a highway full of traffic and the cars would lose. Not saying that an elk wouldn't dominate a car, but those bison stampedes are crazy. Without concrete data on whether or not a bison re-introduction would work, non of us can make an objective decision ... even then, MDC would have to approve and agree to use their $$$ to fund the project (let's not get political on whether their money is their's or our's or both).

The original topic of this thread was whether or not it is correct for the MDC to shoot a straying elk. I still haven't been able to come to a conclusion on what I think. There is not enough information on the process of control for me to decide (maybe you all that have your definite opinions can share what you know that I do not).

While we can squabble over if MDC should have brought elk back or not ... it is done. Now (IMHO), we should talk about the process that MDC is using to control/grow/maintain the herd.

[jdmidwest]

It was hard to BBQ a tranqulized elk, they had to shoot it.

[Outside Bend]

OB, then why not bison, too? They probably outnumbered elk in Missouri once upon a time.

Bison aren't elk. Different animals, different habitat requirements, different implications when reintroduced. It's a red herring.

I don't see much ecological value in reintroducing bison- cattle basically fill the same niche, have the same effect on the landscape. But if there were substantial public support for it, if MDC thoroughly studied the issue and developed a means for introduction while addressing landowner concerns and disease issues (as they have with elk), I wouldn't be opposed.

[hank franklin]

The whole elk thing is stupidity. All about politics, nothing about conservation. Experiments in "conservation." Adventures in politics. Stupid stupid stupid.