Something Wrong with Black River?

[Al Agnew]

Smallies actually thrive on cooler, nutrient rich waters. The upper Black is almost sterile and crystal clear. Not really optimum habitat.

Some of my best smallmouth come from waters that I could only see 3 to 4 feet in the green water.

That's true as far as it goes, but it doesn't mean rivers like Black River couldn't be a lot better than they are. I know of several streams that are almost as sterile and clear as Black River that still have produced the kind of fishing that anybody would be happy with...because they are a little more difficult to access and apparently have fewer catch and kill (or gig, spear, dynamite, trap and kill) anglers. Biologists have told me that certain streams are not good fishing because they do not have good habitat, but I know of a few creeks with terrible habitat that still produce excellent fishing for the same reason. I don't think we should write off any stream because of the perceived poor habitat.

[MOsmallies]

You actually saw a 4lb smallie removed from the upper Black. That is a pretty big fish for that stream. What exactly illegal was he doing, it certainly was big enough to keep. There is no law that states he has to kill it on the stream. Or was it simply the fact he was a local that made you assume he was breaking the law?

The rest I can see why you reported. But just to get riled because a local kept a big fish in a stream where you can keep one is not breaking a law.

Yes there are fish this big in the upper Black... Put on a snorkel during the summer and you will see. And I've seen a handful of 19" to 21" fish caught first hand. Depending on the time of year, these fish can range from 3 to 4.5 lbs. We did not call on this guy as he was doing nothing illegal. My exact quote was...

"We've called on each one of these that was illegal"

Live Basket to me is the same as a stringer. Regardless, there's a lot of locals on that river (and most rivers for that matter) with the catch and keep mentality. And in my opinion that is extremely detrimental on the big fish population. I may not agree with keeping big smallmouth, but there's nothing illegal about it. But we've hashed that out a million times here.

[rFisherk]

I've spent a lot of time on the various rivers and creeks here in the St. Francious Mountains and have noticed very little illegal harvest, or very little harvest for that matter. The common opinion is that smallmouth are no good because they are "wormy." I've also caught a lot of nice smallmouth from the East and West forks of the Black River, but nothing much over three pounds. In fact, other than a very few kids fishing at the public accesses, I've rarely seen anyone fishing, and in about five years of heavy use, I've only seen one other fishermen beyond a few yards of an access. They swim and they party, but they don't fish. The West Fork is one of my favorite places for underwater photography, so I've spent considerable time snorkeling there, and I've yet to see a bass much over three pounds.

The extremely clear water and solitude is what I like. Size is not important.

The only thing I see damaging the fish population of the Black River System is the winter harvest at Clearwater Lake, and I suspect that is taking a heavy toll, even though legal.

[Smalliebigs]

I have seen and caught several over three pounds out of the Black. Has it been less in the last 10 years?? oh hell yes.!!!!

I know this one was way over three....

and so was this one

I'm not going to argue whether the Black can produce nice fish, and I should have said the MDC doesn't have the stomach to do what needs to be done or have the man power to enforce what needs to be done for Missouri streams and rivers to produce nice Smallies. I agree with Al across the board with his take on why it won't happen. I also agree with Al, in that if a stream doesn't get hit or left alone it heals itself and becomes killer again and then it starts getting nailed again and the fish populations go down again......I call it the Ozarkian Tard Cycle......I have seen it come and go on soo many streams I fish. I'm used to it, it's not going to change.

[Smallieguy87]

The only portion of the black i have had the chance to fish was the east fork last summer. I caught plenty in the 12-15 inch range but nothing bigger. I do believe that the black river is most certainly capable of producing some 4+ fish. I currently reside in Blackwell MO. I'm literally a half mile from Washington state park, about 4 miles from Kingtson access, a little over two shakes of a midgets ear away from mill creek and the mineral fork off F hwy. The way some locals treat the Black isn't much different then how the locals tend to treat the rivers and streams close to me. I'm not going to say someone is wrong for keeping a 4lb smallmouth out of any of those waters if they aren't breaking laws but i certainly don't agree with it. In general larger bass spawn earlier and produce more eggs then smaller bass so keeping that trophy fish could hurt the population as whole.

[rFisherk]

I've caught a lot of fish over three pounds in the Black below Lesterville. I was talking about the upper forks, which are too small to be floated.

[Smallieguy87]

I've caught a lot of fish over three pounds in the Black below Lesterville. I was talking about the upper forks, which are too small to be floated.

Nice picture Ron.

[Al Agnew]

Ah, heck, Ron, I've floated the West Fork from Sutton Bluff down, and am pretty sure I could float above there...of course, I don't care what the bottom of my canoe looks like.

I know of several 20 inch class smallies that were caught in fish traps in the Middle Fork. If I could ever figure out how to turn the guy in without him knowing how I found out and his family then putting out a contract on me and the person who told me, I would

[LittleRedFisherman]

I know some guys that partake of the Clearwater winter fishing, I've never been up there, or plan on it, but It sounds like they can keep 5 per person up there? I know he keep everything he catches to, don't take long to add up at that rate.

[trouty mouth]

You actually saw a 4lb smallie removed from the upper Black. That is a pretty big fish for that stream. What exactly illegal was he doing, it certainly was big enough to keep. There is no law that states he has to kill it on the stream. Or was it simply the fact he was a local that made you assume he was breaking the law?

The rest I can see why you reported. But just to get riled because a local kept a big fish in a stream where you can keep one is not breaking a law.