fishinwrench

I'm asleep at the vise, repetition overload.... I need something new to tie. Show us the FLY. What was it ?

How was it guys ? I had to spend the weekend...(oooh I hate this word)....Shopping.

Would there be any benefit for the swmo chapter if I waited until it's formed to sign up ? Or does it not matter which chapter you join through ?

I guess in Kansas that limits you to Green Sunfish and Bullheads

Chief, I've read over the MSA website and I must have missed the "astounding hateful rhetoric" that you are referring to. Can you give me an example ?

Matt, While it may be true that alot of us here live too far away from Kirkwood to be active meeting/outing attending members of MSA, there are plenty of us who are active MDC Stream Team members with most of our work aimed at protecting smallies and their habitat. I considered joining MSA several years ago but I couldn't see how my silent membership in MSA would benefit the cause much....even though I still thought the tee-shirt looked really cool If increasing your member list creates a louder voice then I'll gladly join up. One question first though....Did your latest newsletter give reference to this "White Paper" ? This was a document that I had no idea even existed until Wayne stumbled across it and posted it here. I also got the impression that Al wasn't aware of it until then either. Stream Team headquarters had left us with the impression that the "study" had not even made it to Gravois cr. yet, even though the completion date was posted to be in 2004. So, was MSA "on top of this" so to speak, or were you as suprised as I was ? Wrench

It isn't a dead horse, or they would not be re-evaluating PDT. I just wish I knew what caused them to backstep on that one.

We had a B.A.S.S. federated club going for 7-8 years that scored on paper like that on L.O., it started out with 30 some members but participation gradually petered out to less than 10. That was a bummer, cuz I always thought it was the best format ever for club tournaments, and for qualifying teams to the state championship. The only drawback we ever had was multiple ties for big Bass. So we ammended the rules so that each angler could bring in one fish over 3 lbs. to be weighed, and big bass was a side pot among those who chose to enter on the morning of the tournament.

ok, but they "evaluated it"....then for some reason have decided to RE-evaluate it. My thinking is that they should not refuse to RE-evaluate the whole darn plan. Don't count on it. The difference there lies between educating yourself to earn a wage, VS. educating yourself out of passion for something. As an example, I have a much greater desire to educate myself on river and fish related issues than I do Outboard motor design and function. On the first topic I can't get enough info to satisfy myself....but on the later I don't study any deeper than I need to.

Does anyone know why the PDT river is being RE-evaluated ?

Ok, I'm in. But I'm going to pick an argument that I'm confident I can win, so I'm only going to (primarily) address the criteria in regards to Gravois cr. And I plan to question their reasons for giving Big Buffalo the designation years ago, while denying other (larger/better creeks) in the same region. When I get a reply I'll post it. Wrench

I know exactly how they "evaluated" Gravois cr.... They pulled over at the TT bridge (which isn't even part of the creek, it is still backwater from the lake at that point), looked over the side, and made their decision. Had they taken a 2 mile trip on McCaslin rd. they would have looked over THAT bridge and saw Smallmouth, because they are always there in the bridge pool...among the boulders, logs, gravel and broken bedrock (ya know, smallie habitat). Further upstream from MsCaslin at the low-water bridge they would have seen more smallies, and more "habitat" in all directions. There isn't a single place to access the creek where you don't always see fish (including smallmouth) and plenty of habitat and deep pools. They simply did not evaluate properly, that's all there is to it. But yet just over the hill, Buffalo cr. which is nothing more than a gravel lined ditch gets protected from gravel dredgers, atv's, and pollution. This is just a crock, screw it ! I don't even know why I waste my time trying to make this point, it's a done deal. Somebody pull Dablemont in to this...He'll make some noise.

They appear to be making up the rules as they go. I know all of the Lake Ozark tribs very well, and I can't see any consistency or actual thought being displayed in that White Paper. Big Buffalo was made a SMA a long time ago. But Gravois cr. and Cole Camp cr. do not exceed the required criteria ? C'mon ! These streams needed a designation such as that to help protect them and to make folks aware of their importance. Both Gravois and Cole Camp are excellent little smallie factorys ....Big Buffalo on the other hand is too small, except in a few isolated pools, to support more than a few fish over 10-12 inches. But nevertheless they have closed the book on it, and the odds of it being re-opened and re-evaluated is not in our favor.

LOL Absolutely. I'd even buy him dinner on the way home if his efforts actually paid off. Spoken by a guy that stayed up all nite nursing a Beta fish back to health in a cereal bowl after he was discovered half dead and dried out on the living room floor.

I just read through that again (with a fine toothed comb) and that is totally absurd. Did they even get out of their truck during these "studys" ? It doesn't look like it. Would anyone care to take a short hike with me so I can show you what they consider a "habitat rating" of 1 (the lowest rating given) Are these people really trained in fisheries biology ? They never got out of their truck. Period. That is the only explanation for that rating, that I can fathom.

That stinks ! I've worked really hard at getting one of those streams designated, so that some regulation concerning "use" could begin before it's too late. Now it looks like they are completely out of the park now. I wonder why our Stream Team higher-ups didn't pass that memo down to us ? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Venting Sarcasm below.... They forgot to list the streams actually shitcanned under.... criterion #9 Streams dropped from consideration under criterion 9: are cleverly listed under other criterions, but because of a few influential landowners with signifacant county "pull", and our fear of stepping on their toes regardless of the fact that they have raped enough resources from the drainage area to retire happily to any destination of their choosing.....Are nevertheless being cancelled for any further SBB MANAGEMENT AREA consideration. Areas cancelled under criterian #9 include: GRAVOIS CREEK That's the kind of straightforward talk I'd prefer to hear, ya know.... the truth. DAMMIT ! (sorry phil)

There is "catch and release hunting", in the form of wildife photography. And if you use a Zoom lense of more than 4x you're a putz

I'm the type that would leave you after the first 30 minutes, and let you find your own ride home.

Me too, and take pride in it

I think Eric simply voiced a thought that almost everyone here had. But in this PC arena some are pretending to be absolutely appalled by it. Lighten up for Pete's sake. If I caught a state record using an "indicator", there's about 30 guys I'm aware of that would run me through the ringer, and rib me at every oppurtunity. I think he made a good point when he said... How full of it are you, if you stand behind a curtain and redicule someone for saying out loud what you yourself think...or have thought ? Nobody is taking anything away from the man that caught the record fish. But do we wish he had caught it stripping a PMS after dark at Rebar.......darn straight.

IMO the angler is due sincere congrats. The net man...you GOTTA respect. And if it was me I would have kept the fish, without question. I'm sure there's a lot of pounder Rainbows that are REAL glad he got kept

Yep, my daughter and one of her friends stood on one of the handicapped jetty's and caught a dozen or more on a John Deere mini-jig just dipping it around in the boulders there, and were putting them in a bucket. I made them quit and release them because I wasn't sure it was cool to be doing that. Although I wouldn't mind trying them for bait on a few holes in Z3

Spring river is reasonably close. Although I've never fished it so I don't know much about the hiking/camping in the area. The fishing is reportedly pretty decent though.

Now that you mention it, you DO look a little pale When we were kids we used to drink out of the town branch (looked clear and didn't taste bad). When I think about the source, and where that water came from it amazes me that I'm alive to tell about it.

Eric, That's a trout boner