Creekin'...and conservation lessons.

[Al Agnew]

3 hours ago, tjm said:

No ramps. They put in and pick up off one lane "low water bridges" on dirt roads that are on 30' ROW so no room really to park anywhere, drag one yak up on the trailer then scatter gear out, pick gear up, go in the water to wash off load another yak, open a beverage, look at cars backed up waiting like they own the bridge, stop and talk, drag up another boat, repeat, wait for the straggler who is still a hundred yards up the creek and  do it all one more time. Sheriff put up no parking signs a few years ago and had quite a few vehicles towed for blocking the road way but the Facebook group tells all their members that the ROW is 60', parking is legal, and that  Elder v. Delcour means they can use the two hundred yard wide flood plain like it is public. I dislike Facebook groups too. But if these kayak people had to self-shuttle there wouldn't be groups of 12-20 several times a day.  They  will also drop them in from Walmart property that isn't really supposed to be public use  but is not locally managed nor monitored. 

I think paddle traffic puts pressure on the fish just as much as the actual taking of fish does, all the bottom disturbance makes an infertile stream more infertile, food chain is reduced and feeding times disturbed. But what do recreational boaters care about the environment or fish?  They just want to use that plastic boat and get wet.

 

As we're finding out over and over again, especially during these times, the root cause of all the ills is simply TOO MANY PEOPLE using the resource.  There will always be a certain percentage of the population who are complete doofuses, completely self-centered, apathetic at best to anything other than their own pleasure.  Maybe that percentage is increasing, but even if it isn't, the more people using the resource, the more people that percentage represents and the greater impact they have.  Whether it be paddle craft doing all the disturbing or jetboat wakes or swimmers or recreational bulldozer people that think they are helping the stream handle floods better but making things a whole lot worse, there are just too darn many people doing it.  I've just about come to hate the kayak craze, too.  And all the motorheads whose idea of fun is to see how many times they can go up and down the river in high speed jetboats.  And all the drunken idiots clogging up the BEST streams in the Ozarks.  Please don't say they all have a right to enjoy the rivers, too.  Eventually, we are all going to have to sacrifice some of these so-called rights or see the streams keep deteriorating.  And I know that few will agree with me, but if you are only using the river as a party place and not respecting the resource, or using it to make yourself look like a Youtube expert, maybe you DON'T have that right.  But things won't change.  We will continue to lose access because of pinheads who litter and vandalize, we will continue to find ever more crowded streams and ever more idiotic people, and we will continue to see streams and fisheries decline.  I'm kinda glad I'm getting old and don't have too many more years to enjoy these streams, because I think I saw them at their best, and they are never going to be that good again.

[semble]

I've noticed and increase of pressure on the areas I fish.  I usually only fish during the week and in a normal year can go weeks without seeing another boat.  I haven't had the river to myself for months and I'm seeing limb lines in pools I've never seen them in before.  Talked to a guy at a ramp a few weeks back that was headed out for catfish, said he normally fishes another river but hadn't been catching much and thought it was fished out due to all the pressure.

[semble]

My wife and I went camping last weekend.  Went to an out of the way campground that outside of holiday weekends normally only has a couple groups camping.  It was overflowing with people in trailers and side by sides.  Talked to a local couple and they said it had been that way since march and if you aren't there Thursday morning you are not getting a spot that weekend.  Hate to think about the water quality in the little creek nearby with a 100+ people camping  there every weekend and no facilities.

 

[Mitch f]

If they had a vaccine then all this crap will be over fairly soon, but we will still be managing the aftermath. Fishing lure Manufacturers are not able to keep up. I talked with a plastics manufacturer I know and his comment was that during economic downturns the fishing lure industry always goes gang busters. 

[MrGiggles]

54 minutes ago, Mitch f said:

If they had a vaccine then all this crap will be over fairly soon, but we will still be managing the aftermath. Fishing lure Manufacturers are not able to keep up. I talked with a plastics manufacturer I know and his comment was that during economic downturns the fishing lure industry always goes gang busters. 

The flu vaccine is what, 50% effective on a good year? And the flu has been around for centuries. 

That's what concerns me the most. Covid isn't going away any time soon, a vaccine isn't going to be a cure-all.

Getting a lot of Americans on board with vaccines is a challenge in itself nowadays.

[Mitch f]

21 minutes ago, MrGiggles said:

The flu vaccine is what, 50% effective on a good year? And the flu has been around for centuries. 

That's what concerns me the most. Covid isn't going away any time soon, a vaccine isn't going to be a cure-all.

Getting a lot of Americans on board with vaccines is a challenge in itself nowadays.

Agreed, but I think it will at least get people back to work. 

[jdmidwest]

My scenario worked out perfect.  i rolled in afternoon and confronted 2 parties, one invited and the other the Ahole neighbor that owns property that joins us.  Neither knew the ones from Friday but knew quickly where I stood.  The mess was still there and we stayed at the house and did our thing.  While we were there, fight broke out and invited party slugged it out with Ahole.  All ended up leaving with tails between there legs.  Found out about it this morning.   The one I worried about turned out to be a good Ally, more trust worthy than what I expected.  Took some research from other family members to get the whole picture.  Dropping a gate in next weekend to stop it all.

The gam cam showed 20 different vehicles throughout the week from the party crowd.  One night, it lasted until after 4 am, catching a bunch of people.    It missed the dually that really caused the stir on Friday but caught the Razor Side by Side and the little Side by Side that have been coming down the creek bed from other locations.  Let MDC agents see that as the creek beds are getting wore slick from a bunch of city slickers that bought a 10 acre property upstream and have moved in 10 high dollar campers and running amoke on everyone trespassing.

No shots fired and no law called.  Yet.

A few phone calls and I found out info on most of what I had been seeing on the game cam this spring.  The caddie that went thru one nite was a thief with a known record.  Still looking for the little late nite Japanese extended cab that came thru, he is unknown.

[Mitch f]

1 hour ago, jdmidwest said:

My scenario worked out perfect.  i rolled in afternoon and confronted 2 parties, one invited and the other the Ahole neighbor that owns property that joins us.  Neither knew the ones from Friday but knew quickly where I stood.  The mess was still there and we stayed at the house and did our thing.  While we were there, fight broke out and invited party slugged it out with Ahole.  All ended up leaving with tails between there legs.  Found out about it this morning.   The one I worried about turned out to be a good Ally, more trust worthy than what I expected.  Took some research from other family members to get the whole picture.  Dropping a gate in next weekend to stop it all.

The gam cam showed 20 different vehicles throughout the week from the party crowd.  One night, it lasted until after 4 am, catching a bunch of people.    It missed the dually that really caused the stir on Friday but caught the Razor Side by Side and the little Side by Side that have been coming down the creek bed from other locations.  Let MDC agents see that as the creek beds are getting wore slick from a bunch of city slickers that bought a 10 acre property upstream and have moved in 10 high dollar campers and running amoke on everyone trespassing.

No shots fired and no law called.  Yet.

A few phone calls and I found out info on most of what I had been seeing on the game cam this spring.  The caddie that went thru one nite was a thief with a known record.  Still looking for the little late nite Japanese extended cab that came thru, he is unknown.

Man, I’m darn glad I don’t have to deal with that crap. Kuddos brother!

[jdmidwest]

27 minutes ago, Mitch f said:

Man, I’m darn glad I don’t have to deal with that crap. Kuddos brother!

Its just small town MO.  Come on down some time and enjoy the compound..  Jerry Springer ain't got nothing on Wayne County.

[Al Agnew]

3 hours ago, MrGiggles said:

The flu vaccine is what, 50% effective on a good year? And the flu has been around for centuries. 

That's what concerns me the most. Covid isn't going away any time soon, a vaccine isn't going to be a cure-all.

Getting a lot of Americans on board with vaccines is a challenge in itself nowadays.

I just don't think there is any predictability about how effective a possible Covid vaccine will be.  Some viruses, including some flu strains, respond very well to vaccines, others don't.  But I agree that this isn't going away any time soon and that a vaccine won't be a cure-all.  However, what you have to really hope for is that, given time, the medical establishment will figure out effective treatments that will make dying or being permanently damaged by contracting this disease a lot rarer than it is now.  If you have a 50% effective vaccine AND a really good recovery rate without permanent effects, it really does become like the typical flu, and the country gets back to some semblance of normal.  But we're going to be going through some tough times until that happens.