Private Put In Fees On Private Property.

[cwc87]

Thanks for all your opinons. These comments are pretty much what I experience everyday. Dealing with the public has it upsides and downside. It is unsettling when I approach people using my river access and ask them for a $5 dollar fee when they already know that stopping at my store first would eliminate any hassle. When I see private boat owners throwing their trash in my dumpster and making a donut on the gravel bar or taking a paddle, vest, or cushion that clearly has my name on it that makes me earn my $5. Hmmn as I type this my employee just ask me if a guy paid his $5 to park and put in. Of course he did not even stop at the store to check in. Just another day dealing with the public. That's not your Van in my parking lot is it Gavin?

[Gavin]

It isnt my vehicle.....I dont float down there very often, but weve always parked and launched from the Northwest corner of the bridge. I've never had anyone approach us, much less ask for an access fee. (Weekdays and really early in the AM, do to the crowds down there)....Are you saying thats not in the bridge easement?....If not I'll pay your fee in the future.

[ozark trout fisher]

Thanks for all your opinons. These comments are pretty much what I experience everyday. Dealing with the public has it upsides and downside. It is unsettling when I approach people using my river access and ask them for a $5 dollar fee when they already know that stopping at my store first would eliminate any hassle. When I see private boat owners throwing their trash in my dumpster and making a donut on the gravel bar or taking a paddle, vest, or cushion that clearly has my name on it that makes me earn my $5. Hmmn as I type this my employee just ask me if a guy paid his $5 to park and put in. Of course he did not even stop at the store to check in. Just another day dealing with the public. That's not your Van in my parking lot is it Gavin?

I really do feel for you on the difficulties that you experience. It really is a bummer that people trash the place and take your stuff. That's the kind of crap that ruins the relations between landowners and fisherman/floaters in the Ozarks.

That said, I'm pretty tired of paying for what some irresponsible people do. Whenever I get into a discussion about property/river access rights, the landowners always point out that they have to deal with a lot of irresponsible people, slobs that litter, take too many fish, etc. But I don't do any of those things. I will pick up the litter I see and I'll release my fish. Why should I have to pay $10 for the idiots? Ten dollars honestly isn't an excessive amount, it's just the idea of paying to fish a navigable stream. I'm just not going to do it. If I have to pay for access, I'm going to fish or put in the canoe somewhere else. No disrespect intended. I just have a strict personal policy against paying for access. It just doesn't feel right to me.

All of my jerk opinions aside, if the highway easement isn't usable (I'm not familiar with the 8 Bridge on the Huzzah), then you more than likely do have the right to charge, at least legally. I was under the impression before it was pointed out otherwise that you were charging people to use the highway easement, which would be totally illegal and generally uncool. But apparently that's not the case, so I do apologize for that.

[gotmuddy]

I really do feel for you on the difficulties that you experience. It really is a bummer that people trash the place and take your stuff. That's the kind of crap that ruins the relations between landowners and fisherman/floaters in the Ozarks.

That said, I'm pretty tired of paying for what some irresponsible people do. Whenever I get into a discussion about property/river access rights, the landowners always point out that they have to deal with a lot of irresponsible people, slobs that litter, take too many fish, etc. But I don't do any of those things. I will pick up the litter I see and I'll release my fish. Why should I have to pay $10 for the idiots? Ten dollars honestly isn't an excessive amount, it's just the idea of paying to fish a navigable stream. I'm just not going to do it. If I have to pay for access, I'm going to fish or put in the canoe somewhere else. No disrespect intended. I just have a strict personal policy against paying for access. It just doesn't feel right to me.

The sad fact is that it takes only one bad apple to ruin it for everyone, and until we can get everyone to be civilized(read: never) the fee is more than acceptable. I would pay to park regardless just for safety.

If you floated blair bridge to dawt mill and used their nice boat ramp to get your canoe out would you pay the $5 fee they charge to use it? Do you think it is wrong to do so? I do not. A landowner does not own the water but they own the land where it buts up to the water and in my eyes the fact that you can float it does not take away their right to own the land next to the stream

[Mitch f]

The sad fact is that it takes only one bad apple to ruin it for everyone, and until we can get everyone to be civilized(read: never) the fee is more than acceptable. I would pay to park regardless just for safety.

If you floated blair bridge to dawt mill and used their nice boat ramp to get your canoe out would you pay the $5 fee they charge to use it? Do you think it is wrong to do so? I do not. A landowner does not own the water but they own the land where it buts up to the water and in my eyes the fact that you can float it does not take away their right to own the land next to the stream

Gotmuddy, I agree with you, it seems like the only reason we are even discussing this is because we have some bad apples out there that ruin it for everyone, as I stated before, I don't mind paying to keep away from the riff raff and hopefully find a more safe place to park my truck and trailer. It's just worth the extra money for my time, convenience and safety.

[gotmuddy]

Gotmuddy, I agree with you, it seems like the only reason we are even discussing this is because we have some bad apples out there that ruin it for everyone, as I stated before, I don't mind paying to keep away from the riff raff and hopefully find a more safe place to park my truck and trailer. It's just worth the extra money for my time, convenience and safety.

when I go to lake norfork I launch/camp at boggy point. mainly because it is the closest ramp to my house(~9mi) but also because it is free. With it being free I have to deal with the riff raff which can get bad at times.

[Flysmallie]

I would pay and not have any problem with it. But I'm used to paying it at the lakes so I guess it's not that big of a deal to me. I would rather pay someone and know that I'm helping them out rather than just park on the side of the road and hope for the best.

[jdmidwest]

It is your land and you have the right to charge whatever you want or block access to it all together. If you do charge, I would post the rates on a sign at the entry to let everyone know what is going on before they get unloaded and think otherwise. That should eliminate any confusion. I spend some of every summer in the areas around the Huzzah and the Courtois and have not seen anything worth 10 bucks, but I choose to wade and float more private streams. You have a liability if they get hurt and the expense of hauling off their trash. Even the Forestry Service has done away with hauling off the trash at their areas.

Last time I floated near Sam A Baker, a group had taken the 2 day float above the park. They had stopped at an old abandoned campground to spend the night. The awoke to find the new owner informing them they were trespassing, paid a camping fee of 15 bucks per boat and went on their way. There was no signs or anybody living there to check with when they got there and they did not expect to pay. They could have drifted down to the next gravel bar and camped free of charge.

On a normal weekend, I pay to camp at an organized campground. I pay $15 to $25 to park and have the person Shuttle me or the boat upstream. If I camp with friends and have more than one vehicle, that part is eliminated. Parking and access should be the same fee, but like I said, it is your land and you can do what you want. It seems like you are not doing it for the money, just to keep the access controlled. If you have a store, you have to remember, I will need some ice, food, and drinks too, and you will make a little money on that also.

[stlfisher]

I almost always stick to public water and public access so my opinion is probably not worth much, but it bugs me, that as many of these types of conversations we have had, I still don't know what is really legal and what is not. I'd rather not deal with it when I am trying to just go out and fish. The laws surrounding access and trespassing seem open to way to much interpretation. I spend the work week dealing with cr@p. I don't want to spend my day worrying if my left tire might be trespassing. I think in a situation such as this it is only ethical to post that it is private property and there are fees to park and launch your craft. It is not good business, IMO, to approach people after the fact, especially if there might be a gray area...which it sounds like might be the case. Be upfront and I have no issues otherwise my scamdar goes off.

[gotmuddy]

I can see no gray area if people are parking on his land. If people parking there is common place then I would post a sign with the prices and to stop at the store or you WILL be towed.