Would You Support This Legislation?

[Justin Spencer]

It would have to be put directly to hiring enforcement on rivers where the money is raised, and something like that would probably have to be voted on by the individual counties. I would not be opposed to it on a county basis because then it can go case by case. Statewide I don't see happening, and I can guarantee we would have our lobbyist (yes outfitters play the political game too) on top of anything that might hurt our business, and raising prices on a demographic that already is trying to save money definately wouldn't help us.

[kevthebassman]

Justin, like Al and a few others have said, I don't see how it could hurt business to tack a couple of extra bucks onto a rental. People pay more for a pack of smokes than I'd ever ask them to pay to float the rivers.

You yourself have said that you don't allow that kind of wild debauchery to take place in on your campground, and you do it to keep the place family friendly, and your bottom line is why you do that. It's all well and good to have a family friendly campground, but if your family friendly campground serves a river full of wild drunken debauchery as seen on the Meramec and other rivers close to St. Louis, the families are still going to stay away.

[Justin Spencer]

Those crazy rivers help my business, if everyone can stay close to home and have a pleasant experience why will they need to drive 5 hours to come see me? If the counties that have those crazy rivers want to pass a tax or a law limiting canoes then let them do it, I'm happy with my river, and don't want to raise prices.

[Chief Grey Bear]

Al, you've laid out an excellent argument, and Midwest Troutbum gets it.

I don't think anyone expects this to be a cure-all, and I know I don't expect the rivers to be a Sunday school. But if we could get some money raised by users of the river who heretofore have been riding for free, and get that money spent exclusively on enforcement of the laws on the river, we could hopefully check some of the worst of the nonsense.

I get it just fine. So do others. It may be you that is having a little trouble. WE all are paying to use the river. Whether you use it or not. Nobody is getting a free ride.

Out of the thousands of miles of waters in this state you want to concentrate on a couple of hundred???? Or should we have this enforcement for all streams??? That is one hell of a lot of LEO'S!!!

You want everyone to conform to your standards??? How often do you fish these waters that you want to control??

[ozark trout fisher]

You want everyone to conform to your standards??? How often do you fish these waters that you want to control??

This sort of links back to the other thread about enforcement of rules on Missouri streams...No one is wanting anyone to "conform" to our standards. All we're looking for a significant enough law enforcement presence to curb some of the blatantly illegal/dangerous stuff that is going on. Three dollars just doesn't move the meter when you're talking about a service that already costs between $25 and $40. It wouldn't by any stretch fix all the problems, but it can't hurt to have a few more boots on the ground, can it?

[Daryk Campbell Sr]

.... Side note, due to this board, I have learned that Justin's floats are family friendly and I will strongly consider bringing mine down. If this thread goes no-where, at least I have a new idea for my family on a weekend. :-)

[Justin Spencer]

.... Side note, due to this board, I have learned that Justin's floats are family friendly and I will strongly consider bringing mine down. If this thread goes no-where, at least I have a new idea for my family on a weekend. :-)

Don't come expecting a completly peaceful experience. We are not completely immune to the craziness that can happen, but we do our best to keep it from happening. The kids more than likely will hear the f-bomb more than once, and will see some drunk people. We try to separate our campground to have those more family oriented on one side, and those without kids on the other. The main thing we try to be is honest with our guests as to what can be expected, and we are only a phone call away from being in the campground at all hours to stop bad behavior. As someone who has never been on the "CRAZY" rivers on a Saturday, I can't imagine what they look like, but from what I have heard our river is nothing like these.

If you take off on the 8:00 shuttle you can get ahead of the biggest partiers and have a wonderful experience on the river, even on a Saturday.

[Chief Grey Bear]

All we're looking for a significant enough law enforcement presence to curb some of the blatantly illegal/dangerous stuff that is going on.

Like what??? I floated the Elk a few weeks ago and didn't see anything that was blatantly illegal and or dangerous.

I would also venture to say there were about, and you may think I am nuts when I say this, but it looked like there were 2 or 3 thousand people. Maybe more. There was several times I would just take a look from one end of the river to the other and it was SOLID people! You could have walked the length of the river and never got your feet wet! No kidding!!

I kept an eye out for some skin but all I saw was, and again I am not kidding, 300lb women out there! Now that is blantantly illegal!!!

[ozark trout fisher]

Chief, I'm glad you didn't have to deal with the crap I'm talking about on your float. And I'm not saying that it is rampant everywhere. It seems like there are certain stream stretches that are much worse than others, and I'm not even talking about the most crowded areas-just places where the wrong type of crowd tends to gather...everything from drunken jet-boaters, to drug use and nudity in the canoe rental crowd. It doesn't seem to me that it's a coincidence that those are usually also the areas where law enforcement presence is minimal.

I don't have major issues with big crowds. People have the right to enjoy the river. But the relative lawlessness that pervades some stream stretches needs to stop. That's where this little tax could come in-patrolling these types of areas.

[Jerry Rapp]

this is really a funny topic. Most of you guys are just like tournament bass fishermen. You expect to own the river/lake and everyone else to just leave you alone. If you visit bass fishing forums you hear the same whining about bass fishermen being treated like second class citizens and they should have respect when they are out fishing on THEIR lake. It is all public water. PUBLIC. If you want privacy you have to buy your own river/lake and keep everyone else off of it. We are taxed to death already and 16 Trillion in debt as a nation. Cities are going bankrupt over debt, and many states are not far behind. It is a big world out there beyond our lakes and rivers, and until spending at all levels gets under control, there will be no solution to anything.