Mdc needs to do some stocking

[bkbying89]

2 hours ago, MoCarp said:

and its debatable what is considered "trash fish" ...more anglers fish for common carp than Muskies in the USA...economically promoting eurocarp angling has ben an economic boon for the areas in the US that have done so....Waddinton NY a small town of less than a 1000 people cater to anglers who travel there JUST to fish for common carp.....Austin Texas and lake fork Texas are other areas that benefit from the economics.

Some lakes in Nebraska were clear and had great gamefish populations and were renovated anyways...not saying that some waters are overrun with carp...but most euroanglers are not interested in catching tons on dinks, but rather the larger fish 20# and better....the powers that be at the state level do not promote beyond the eradication of commons even though they have been there 140 years....Asian Ringneck pheasants directly responceable for displacing native game birds like prairie Chickens and German Brown Trout also on the ICU most invasive list are championed in Nebraska management for use.....you can have your cake and eat it too....the technology is there to do so without killing of the fish the dredge and dewatering method saves years of downtime to build back fish populations how long does it take to produce 10# walleyes?.....its applications allow to remove silt in only the worse parts of the lake as time /need/ or budget allows...granted it a newer way typically used for smaller waters but it is faster and less expensive compared to total renovation.......tell Darrel at the other forum MoCarp Said hello 

8

MoCarp, Just because the water of a lake is clear does not mean that the bottom isn't heavily silted. I will point to Bush's Wildlife Area in St. Charles County, Mo. After years of use a lot of the lakes needed to be drained, the bottom scraped of sediment and renovated. I live near there and it was an awesome thing to see. The fishing is now better than ever in the area despite heavy usage. The Pheasant didn't displace the  Prarie Chicken. Farming and land use changes were responsible for the decline of the Prairie Chicken and Sage Grouse. I can't speak to how much the Brown Trout has affected the habitat but in some cases they probably did. I know that out west they are encouraging people to take brookies, rainbows, and Browns in some waters so they can restore the native Cutthroat Trout that can't compete with the introduced species. Some of the rivers I fish have Browns stocked in them and the water is colder than the native Smallmouth like and the Browns don't reproduce successfully there the Rainbows do and I am glad they do. I haven't heard too many complaints from anyone else either. I do agree that European carp are here to stay and I am planning to give them a go on the Flyrod this year.

[MoCarp]

30 minutes ago, bkbying89 said:

MoCarp, Just because the water of a lake is clear does not mean that the bottom isn't heavily silted. 

agreed and removing all the carp from the Missouri River will not make it run clear like a mountain stream ether.

 

31 minutes ago, bkbying89 said:

I will point to Bush's Wildlife Area in St. Charles County, Mo. After years of use a lot of the lakes needed to be drained, the bottom scraped of sediment and renovated. I live near there and it was an awesome thing to see. The fishing is now better than ever in the area despite heavy usage. 

if you take an existing pond and start from scratch it will go through a boom period basically letting a lake not get fished for a few years will make even a swimming pool great fishing, at least for a while... its the restocking and rebalancing the pred/prey relationship and the new harvest regulations AND strict enforcement that changed once they reopened the lakes ..over time a water ages its called Eutrophication  it is the process in which lakes receive nutrients (phosphorus and nitrogen) and sediment from the surrounding watershed and become more fertile and shallow. ... The additional nutrients can cause algal blooms, additional plant growth and overall poorer water quality, making the lake less suitable for many outdoor uses, in time the lake goes back into what it was before renovation..then the cycle repeats and the lake gets renovated again, you tax dollars at work....next time your at Busch look around a few guys euro carp it regularly..fished with them on 33 a few times.

39 minutes ago, bkbying89 said:

The Pheasant didn't displace the  Prarie Chicken. Farming and land use changes were responsible for the decline of the Prairie Chicken and Sage Grouse. 

Yes man changed the habitat, just like man has changed most waters in the USA, farming and land use are responsible for many ills blamed on carp....yet management practices embraced the ringneck...and seem to eradicate the common carp....it can be argued that commons have had less impact on native fishes than asian pheasants have on native game birds.

43 minutes ago, bkbying89 said:

 I can't speak to how much the Brown Trout has affected the habitat but in some cases they probably did. I know that out west they are encouraging people to take brookies, rainbows, and Browns in some waters so they can restore the native Cutthroat Trout that can't compete with the introduced species. Some of the rivers I fish have Browns stocked in them and the water is colder than the native Smallmouth like and the Browns don't reproduce successfully there the Rainbows do and I am glad they do. I haven't heard too many complaints from anyone else either. I do agree that European carp are here to stay and I am planning to give them a go on the Flyrod this year.

its rare we don't have a watershed untouched in someway by man, a wonderful flower in a wheat field is a weed, a smallmouth bass in a califorina stream is an invasive species to be eradicated. the desperate efforts to re-establish what was here before man may be a futile effort in some cases

 

I will share a famous quote from Authors Buffler , Dickson.

Quote

Standing on clear-cut hillsides with a bucket of garbage in each hand, they looked down on the rivers, saw carp swirling happily in the mess humans had created, and made a correlation - albeit the wrong one - between the rise of carp and the fall of game fish. Either ignorant of or blind to the damages they themselves had wrought on the landscape, people looked past the dredged and straightened channels, drained wetlands, eroded riverbanks, and waters laden with human and industrial waste, saw carp roiling in the shallows, and accused them of wrecking the water. 

 

[MoCarp]

2 hours ago, snagged in outlet 3 said:

No it's not.....it's a carp

a 10 billion dollar a year carp...just remember that...

 

[MoCarp]

 this is because euro anglers spend big $

[Ellros]

Well, tbh, when I say "trash fish" I mean overpopulation of carp and gizzard shad in some waters.  And the white perch infestation in certain NE lakes.

[MoCarp]

19 minutes ago, Ellros said:

Well, tbh, when I say "trash fish" I mean overpopulation of carp and gizzard shad in some waters.  And the white perch infestation in certain NE lakes.

I talked to a Kansas biologist recently and they now have successfully use a measured application of rotenone to thin down gizzard shad with out harming other fish....I think a couple of lakes in Kansas use walleyes and hybrid stripers to keep white perch at bay.....its all about balance any fish population can get out of hand and needs adjusting to seek angler goals....

 

[inshore]

u know maybe we should look at the lake  and the anglers who fish tr. with all the tournaments big and small how many are mishandled at the boat at the weigh in in the tank at the point of release at the boat and at the dock. somewhere in all this handling fish are dying big % little % it's still a dead fish many sink to the bottom and are out of sight. add this to the people who actually like a fish dinner every now and then. probably more than we catch & release people think. also the lake is changing it's becoming a spot & smallmouth lake because of the topography of the lake itself. the pressure on tr is unbeileivble with everyone wanting their piece. the pollution is terrible when I moved here in 85 I never saw an algae bloom. we never had 100 or 1000 yr floods u could see fish on beds at 20ft. . with all this being said it's still a great lake and on the right day can be the best. the problem as I see it we have just loved this lake to death.

[MoCarp]

1 hour ago, inshore said:

u know maybe we should look at the lake  and the anglers who fish tr. with all the tournaments big and small how many are mishandled at the boat at the weigh in in the tank at the point of release at the boat and at the dock. somewhere in all this handling fish are dying big % little % it's still a dead fish many sink to the bottom and are out of sight. add this to the people who actually like a fish dinner every now and then. probably more than we catch & release people think. also the lake is changing it's becoming a spot & smallmouth lake because of the topography of the lake itself. the pressure on tr is unbeileivble with everyone wanting their piece. the pollution is terrible when I moved here in 85 I never saw an algae bloom. we never had 100 or 1000 yr floods u could see fish on beds at 20ft. . with all this being said it's still a great lake and on the right day can be the best. the problem as I see it we have just loved this lake to death.

I saw a post somewhere where kimberling city dumps turd water in TR...then all the growth since then....I know the water isn't as clear as it was in the 80's

[Wesley]

This comes up every year about crappy. They don t need to stock more. At flat creek last year april16 I was down. I counted 52 boats. CLEANING THE LAKE OF CRAPPY. I was down the whole week it was like that every day. Think how many fish ARE TAKEN. 1/32 over the size and they take them. Too easy to catch them. It is fishing pressure!!  They should for the month of April no crappy fishing from point 15 for at least 2 miles up the James and flat creek. Think about it in two years you would catch a lot of 2-3 lb crappies. I fished those rivers before the internet and always caught 2-3 lb crappies. Now everybody posts what and where they catch fish and the wonder WHY the fish are smaller and less fish. Nothing matter with the lake. FISHING PRESSURE 

[Basfis]

I’m not a TR year round fisher so what I see is winter thru April. My first TR trips were CPA, heartland, and a couple BASS invitationals 1997- 2003. Took some time off until 5-6 years ago. 

I catch way more and bigger smallies, fewer and smaller spots and largemouth seem about the same. Total numbers better now than then.

I’ve made a few trips to the upper white that didn’t remind me of years past and left me looking at other areas. KC seems at least as good or better than the past. Same for the dam. James, seems similar which is hit and miss for me. 

Snot on the rocks seems the same.

Clarity seems to change with the weather like it should. Bunch of rain, dirtier. Cold and dry clears it. Mid summer I’d guess it stays turning with the ever growing boats. 

I will say there seems to be less 4-5lb LM. Anecdotal from weigh ins. That same phenomenon seems to happen everywhere except LofO which is some kind of freak lake for consistency. It’s filthy, high traffic and pounded on.

I don’t think I’m any better at catching them now than then and seem to catch more. FWIW I just can’t make myself fish slow and revert to finesse only as a last resort. 10lb is as light as I’m willing to go, I can’t read a graph to save my life, am clueless fishing vertically and have never fished a ned. I do rig my son a ned up and he whacks them, so I fish something else for his sake.

just a different view. I look forward to the rock in the spring.