Smallmouth, Rock Bass Survey

[Outside Bend]

There's really no black helicopters or cloak-and-dagger involved with this stuff guys- it's a random statistical sample, not everyone gets a survey. There's no compelling reason for them to stack the deck; think about it and you'll realize it wouldn't be in their interest to alienate the angling public. You don't bite the hand that feeds you.

The survey is just that: a survey, to characterize the state's angler demographics and attitudes regarding stream smallmouth/rock bass fishing. If you think MDC could do a better job, let them know. If you'd like to see an area managed a different way, let them know. Leave it to some of y'all to MDC makes a management decision you don't like, then whine some more when MDC asks for your input regarding management decisions

[fishinwrench]

The survey is just that: a survey, to characterize the state's angler demographics and attitudes regarding stream smallmouth/rock bass fishing.

Sure, but if you want an accurate result why not solicit participation from everyone that purchases a fishing license every year ? If I wanted to get an accurate assessment (via survey) of "angler attitudes" in regards to Spotted bass should I only ask Al A and Eric to participate ?

"Black Helecopters" ? Dude this ain't the Drake, take off your designer buff and drop that BS, cuz I know where you're headed with that comment.

[troutfiend1985]

I have no clue how many fishing licenses MDC sells, but I imagine that giving a survey to everyone would be an absolute nightmare for the management. I hope I wasn't coming off as a conspiracy theorist, I was just curious as to how the determination process was made.

[ozark trout fisher]

I didn't get a survey- I wish I did though.

I don't personally place a lot of weight in the theory that those living next to a water should be the only ones that should have a say in it's management. Rivers are resources of the state, not just the folks that live on it's banks.

Oneshot, I don't have a problem with you keeping some fish to eat. That's understandable, and I think that the regulations on any given river should allow some common species to be kept and eaten. It's an important part of the process for some people, and I can respect that. But it's also important to keep healthy fish populations in the river for future years... It isn't all about today, and unregulated harvest just isn't sustainable.

It's good that the MDC is getting public opinion on the issue of smallmouth bass management. But I hope they leave the final decision to their biologists.

[Outside Bend]

Sure, but if you want an accurate result why not solicit participation from everyone that purchases a fishing license every year ?

Because of the time and expense involved. The premise that you don't have to sample every organism in a populations isn't foreign to these folks. Yes, they could send a survey to every angler in the state- then someone would have to be paid to enter survey cards from every angler in the state, many of whom view the state's smallmouth management in similar ways. To me it doesn't matter that every angler gets a survey card, but that those anglers who do get a card are representative of the states' anglers as a whole.

I guess I don't see why the state agency charged with managing smallmouth sending out a survey about the state's smallmouth management should be met with cynicism. I see it as a good sign, that they're looking for suggestions, that they're reaching out to their constituencies. Not receiving a survey doesn't mean you can't get involved- you can still contact MDC and share your opinions.

[Gavin]

You cant ask everybody....its just not cost effective..

I do a bit of sampling when I do financial & compliance audits...my software does most of the work in regard to sample sizes and confidence levels.... but you can usually test 25-30 random items and get a pretty good feel for a population (is the data junk or decent? What is it trying to say?) Test 100, and you usually get about the same result particularly if its a non-stratified population.

Thats just a start though....sometimes it takes allot more items (200,300,500, more) to satisfy the confidence level..

A couple of years ago the permit vendors were supposed to ask if you fished for smallmouth when they sold you a fishing license...bet they are drawing from that pool for the surveys. I didnt get a survey...Could someone reveal the questions?

[jdmidwest]

The survey system is flawed due to the fact that the majority of permit vendors fail to ask the right questions when you get your permit. I have had vendors blow thru the questions quickly, especially at a C store with a line of people behind you. They have plenty of time to sell lottery, but the licenses are low income items. The new electronic license system is a joke as far as data collection.

I remember the smallmouth question and I received the survey. I also was asked about the walleye a few years ago and ended up in an argument with the vendor over my answer, at Wally World. She said "are you sure, nobody ever says they fish for them". She was not used to anyone fishing for them in the area I live as most walleye are located in other parts of the state.

The new waterfowl survey is a joke too. When you show up to get a Migratory Bird Card in Sept., you are supposed to remember the number of birds you killed in the previous season 7 or 8 months ago. Old days, you had a card to fill out during the season and mailed it in. This way, you are just guessing.

[ness]

Do you suppose that if everyone that is chosen to participate in the survey checked the box that indicated that they kept smallmouth rather than releasing them, that it would have a bearing on the regulation decisions they are "supposedly" trying to decide upon ?

Seems to me that they have chosen a specific caliber of anglers to send these things to... a target audience if you will. I probably got it because of my Stream Team affiliation and because of my personal inquirys to specific biologists in the past, but none of my neighbors recieved it, and they "fish" all the time, all over the place.

Don't you think MDC already knows what the results of this survey will indicate ? I do.

It will indicate that smallmouth are targeted frequently, and that they are almost always released. Duh !

Man, that's messed up.

How do you suppose they determine 'caliber' when they're sending these out? You think they've got lists of medium-caliber fishermen, stream team volunteers or people that have spoken to biologists? Nope.

It's a survey, and they sent it to a small sampling of license buyers for the purpose they surely stated on the survey. Folks figured out a long time ago that a random sample of a large population can be just as effective as surveying the whole population, with a lot less trouble and cost.

They're looking to learn and possibly make some changes to their management of the resource. Nothing sinister here.

[oneshot]

They did a Survey on Bonus Tags for Deer on alot of CA next year Bonus Tags were not allowed but I have a feeling MDC had their mind made up so the Survey didn't mean squat.

I really think the MDC decides to make changes but runs these Surveys just to look good.

oneshot

[OzarksRiverman]

I got the survey, and replied. I don't have suspicion about the intentions of the MDC.