Meramec River Shooting

[Terrierman]

It really hit home when I read about the shooting. I've had my share of issues with land owners in Ar. Folks in Mo are truly lucky. I pray this wont affect stream law in Mo. In AR, landowners can practically march you out and we have very few streams to float and fish compared to MO in a legal manner. I fish a lot in Mo because of the freedom I was provided to be in those streams. Landowners cannot prohibit you from moving in the stream and they have to file a complaint against you. As with both states, idiots are to blame for issues on the stream.

There are a lot of issues we don't know about which happen on these streams all the time or occasionally make the news like a drunk stabbing among floaters. This shooting will be added to that long list. Floating and fishing is a huge economic advantage to Mo. By giving landowners rights such as in AR, it would shut down shuttle services. The judge will find foolishness and the male bravado played into this shooting and not river rights. My condolences to the victim's family.

We should all learn from this as to keep in the stream, respect land owners, open our eyes and ears to be aware of issues while we are on streams. That could have been any of us an any certain day given luck may or may have not been with us.

I can promise you it would not have been me, for a whole list of really good reasons. Number one being I don't put myself in those kind of situations, ever.

[fishinwrench]

The part about river rights that chaps my @$$ is that fishermen who drift the river quietly and do not alter the atmosphere of it much... are forced to take the same side as loud, splashing, screaming and shouting party crowds.

The MDC will escort you off one of their (our) accesses if you are involved in a bigtime PAR'TAY! on a MDC access gravel bar, will they not?

Having the right to be there shouldn't mean having the right to create as much noise and disturbance as you possibly can.

If and when anything goes before the courts that involves river/stream access there needs to be some separation between those seeking to maintain legal access to them. You shouldn't have to allow free-roaming partys in order to allow fishing. And you can bet your hind end that there won't be a single party floater doing any legwork to secure river access rights.

[Mitch f]

This legislature is dominated by Republicans. When's the last time you remember a Republican doing anything you liked?

(ducks and runs for cover)

Thought Phil was against this kind of dribble

[Terrierman]

Thought Phil was against this kind of dribble

It's a joke son.

[Old plug]

I do not think most land owners worry about fishermen. But none of us like the problem that comes with some summer people. But the core of the problem wrench is the law. It has been on the books different ways and where there is no law there are things like directives. if you go into the courts you would get different interpretation in different courts. These guys on here seem to be looking for a legislative action in the form of a law. I have no idea what is on the federal books about this. I don't think it would matter anyway in this state. These guys in Jeff city think they can pass something that trumps federal law.

[Justin Spencer]

. And you can bet your hind end that there won't be a single party floater doing any legwork to secure river access rights.

That is something you are very wrong about. I don't expect anyone who is not an outfitter to understand how passionate most of these people are about their vacations to the river. Most of these people come from the cities where they work hard to make a dollar. Camping and canoeing or renting a cabin or RVing is an affordable way for them to take their families, or get together with a group of friends and enjoy the outdoors. You don't get to see the excitement these people have on Friday nights when they get to the river and go sit in it in a lawn chair and drink a few beers getting away from the stresses of their normal lives. Many people tell me this is the highlight of their year and they look forward to it all year long. The majority of the problem floaters are those from nearby areas that come out for the day, wreak havoc and go home. It isn't fair to the majority who are out behaving themselves to be lumped together with the rest. It is like getting rid of fishing because some people poach.

[Feathers and Fins]

I was thinking about this today. I hunt many of the creeks and rivers for ducks, I have never had a problem and met many land owners. Sure they asked what I was doing and when I told them they were actually more than helpful and pointing out where the birds liked to be and in more than a few cases called a neighbor to see if they were there and sent me to them ( the birds)

So why is it I can hunt these areas and have nothing but good interaction with land owners yet floaters cant? Only thing I can think of is I am not out here drinking and trashing the place. I am certainly Making noise and without doubt above highwater mark in many cases yet NEVER had one issue with them. Heck I have even been invited out of the river and on to some of the stock ponds by the owners. Something is different in this picture can you find it?

[Jack Jones]

Feathers, I've never seen you, but I'm gonna take a stab at it and guess that when you are out hunting you are (A) dressed like a hunter, ( don't have long hair, or if you do it's washed, groomed, and well kept, © you're not drinking (as you said), or if you are it's discreet and you're not stumbling, and (D) you actually seem to be participating in the sport of hunting and demonstrating an appreciation for nature. I also suspect you don't mouth off or argue with the landowners either.

Now.....next season please grow your hair out and don't wash it, wander around with overalls and a bottle (plastic, of course) of whiskey in one hand. Then walk onto these same people's property and see how friendly your interactions are.

[fishinwrench]

That is something you are very wrong about. I don't expect anyone who is not an outfitter to understand how passionate most of these people are about their vacations to the river. Most of these people come from the cities where they work hard to make a dollar. Camping and canoeing or renting a cabin or RVing is an affordable way for them to take their families, or get together with a group of friends and enjoy the outdoors. You don't get to see the excitement these people have on Friday nights when they get to the river and go sit in it in a lawn chair and drink a few beers getting away from the stresses of their normal lives. Many people tell me this is the highlight of their year and they look forward to it all year long. The majority of the problem floaters are those from nearby areas that come out for the day, wreak havoc and go home. It isn't fair to the majority who are out behaving themselves to be lumped together with the rest. It is like getting rid of fishing because some people poach.

I hope that you're right. If that's the case then the fishermen and the river party'ers together far outnumber river front land owners and as a whole pay more in taxes annually. Therefore we (the river users) will have it our way when it's all said and done.

The party-float crowd is not as passionate about the rivers as the fishermen are though, or they'd make it to the river more than once/twice a year....NOBODY is THAT busy. I'm still betting that they'd cry harder over a closed mall or a favorite restaurant than they would a closed river.

[Justin Spencer]

I hope that you're right. If that's the case then the fishermen and the river party'ers together far outnumber river front land owners and as a whole pay more in taxes annually. Therefore we (the river users) will have it our way when it's all said and done.

The party-float crowd is not as passionate about the rivers as the fishermen are though, or they'd make it to the river more than once/twice a year....NOBODY is THAT busy. I'm still betting that they'd cry harder over a closed mall or a favorite restaurant than they would a closed river.

I agree they aren't as passionate as some fishermen, but there are a lot more of them. I don't think there will be anything said and done and things will stay the same (nice and confusing).

I must say I bet most river fishermen would take the party crowd on Saturdays over 20 catch and keep fishermen on their favorite stretches of river, the fishermen would cause much more damage to the resource, and would also be acting legally.