Steady decline of the fish population.

[livingtofish]

Great topic, I too have fished Stockton for many years and while the catch rate for large bass has declined, the catch rate for numbers is good. I have had a couple of days this year when I personally boated over 50 bass, and with a buddy we were close to 100. I don't fish many Missouri lakes but I don't know of many where you could do a lot better. It does seem like the keeper ratio is down but I don't fish tournaments anymore so I don't care I just catch and release. I think we should give the Missouri dept of conservation a lot of credit because without there size limits, on bass, crappie and walleye the catch ratio would be much less. Just my opinion

[MoCarp]

4 hours ago, Walcrabass said:

MoCarp,

 

  You are correct about the Trotlining. The knowledge just isn't there as it used to be. Part of the reason is the expense for gas. It takes a lot of trips to the lake to maintain your lines. Another reason is if it is done correctly trotlining involves a lot of work. I was taught by what I consider to be some of the best. I have passed it on to my children. We do not trotline much any more but it still happens occasionally. One thing about the trotlining where the Flatheads are concerned. You better have a large freezer. A husband and wife team can put a lot of legal pounds of fish in it in a hurry !!!!!!!

I encourage the young fishing people to try this method of fishing. Very rewarding when you pull up one of those 40 pounders. Always remember to use a gaff to lift the line and another one for the fish. It will keep a hook out of your hand and also maybe prevent being pulled over the side of the boat to a watery grave by one of those hard fighting fish.

 

Walcrabass

There was a group well known at Stockton, retired men called "The Sarcoxie Gang" they mastered catching huge flatheads, a 70# were nothing to them, it took a fish over 100# to make them get pumped up...they would put the monsters in a cattle tank for a few days to "clean them out", I went once to help him clean one that weighted 126# on a feed store scaleI.....I  asked why they didn't submit one for a state or world record, and Karl in his late 70"s at the time said if we do that everyone will fish for them...he also said the hard part was holding them..not getting them to bite.....I was 19 at the time and worked with Karl, he told me his secrets as he had no children...I also brought back shark hooks from the coast when I went back on vacations to visit my folks in Mobile Al

3 hours ago, Mhyde said:

This is a very good discussion, and have enjoyed  reading it!!  Let me throw something else in that hasn't been mentioned yet,  "the brush pile program"  In the mid 90's the MDC along with the CoE really started to crank up and crank out new habitat structure throughout the lake. Some of this structure is marked but the green signs you see nailed to trees on the bank but many are not physical marked and can only be found by GPS and your electronics. I wonder how placing these structure has truly changed the fish movements and patterns? I often think once a bass finds one of these structures it will stay until it has to or is forced to leave. i think before this that the fish were force to move a bit more and there for more visible on electronics? also take in account all the structure's that have been sunk by citizens. just thought don't know if its relevant but just a thought.   

People have always sunk brush at Stockton and the state piles seemed to go poof......the big drought a few years back showed many piles near the signs gone...as a note a buddy and I were making rock piles, and dragging logs into some areas that would be great and a corps person made us stop.....

3 hours ago, Kramr said:

I know they have been stocking walleye yearly for awhile now. What other species of fish get stocked?

I'm just wondering here. Is it possible the yearly walleye stocking has had an effect on the shad population which would reduce the food available to other shad eating species.

I wonder that.....they stocked Mississippi Silversides in the past so I am sure they where trying to expand forage opportunities 

41 minutes ago, waterpossum said:

The  bass fishing on Stockton in the early to mid 80s on Stockton was horrible. in 1984 I bought a parcel of land (26 acres) just S of Ruark for a great price mainly because Stockton was so terrible. Grand and Table Rock were considered the  prime fisheries and Stockton not so much. The shad population, especially this year is phenomenal. I was out last Friday night fishing the  Stockton Friday Nighter tournament and have not seen that many shad in a long time. There was around  a total of 1, 200 keeper bass weighed in on Friday night this summer. Of that total about 80 were 4 lbs or better. That figures out to nearly 7%  I don't know is this considered above or below average as opposed to previous years?  No doubt the bass fishing pressure is greater than ever. In June there were 37 bass tournaments. May had 26.  Appreciate all the input to this topic. If you check out Missouri State Highway Patrol - Regattas you get an idea of the summer bass fishing pressure from tournaments.

LMB seems to have been the focus of management over the expense of other fishes, ........walleyes and smallmouths do better on rocky areas than LMB and smallmouth fishing was def better in the past....Personally I think they should go back to the Muskie/Northern-walleye.smallmouth model....they have tried to get weed beds started on a few areas and there are some....yellow perch would help a few issues, prolific prey for walleyes and smallmouths, meat to keep the game hogs happy....they should stock the native strain of smallmouths in Stockton and set a 18" 2 fish limit out of 6 bass and drop the LMB length to 14"..a few red ear sunfish would also be cool or rock bass....a more diverse population of fishes would be preferable.....walleyes and bass look thin on Stockton, and I know this is heresy but putting a limit on tournaments might drop pressure...

[Mhyde]

Does anyone know for sure that the MDC does or doesn't stock any bass in Stockton? Wondering if a new infusion of gentics wouldn't help the lake out. 

[Big Keene]

7 hours ago, Walcrabass said:

Big Keene,

  All I can say is this...................... my buddies and I must really be doing something wrong. We DEFINITELY are not catching the 6 to 9 pounders like yesteryear. Maybe all of us older guys need to get retrained in our fishing tactics.

 

Wally

for me fish that size have always been so rare that its hard to count them in even anecdotal evidence. 

there may be less really big fish, ive never had any luck with them. and depending on how far back we are talking about, then of course. its just that my averages have stayed pretty consistant. 

personally, i would have to say that its getting better. thanks to everybody on here, it seems like i catch more and better fish every year. 

BUT...i dont have nearly the experience of most of the people on here. i am still learning new tactics and methods every year.

 

[Walcrabass]

Waterpossum,

  Interesting about the 4 pounders from the tournaments. I can tell you that 30 to 40 years ago it was not uncommon to catch 5 or 6 fish that were over 4 pounds in the same day/evening.

Mhyde,

 Concerning the genetics thing.............. Missouri is not interested in improving the "Genetics" of their Bass Population. Other states around us are doing just that and with great results. Here in Missouri we seem to be just concerned with the fact that people can catch a fish. Hence the lack of attention to the swelling Kentucky Bass population in our lakes. Just read this forum and see how many more of these Bass are being caught in Stockton now that just three years ago. Their growing population will not stop............... as they rarely reach the 15" length limit so they can be legally removed from the lake. Wait until you see what the next ten years brings................

 

Walcrabass

[livingtofish]

Seems to be lots of interest in this subject. I agree that the largemouth doesn't seem to change much from yr. to yr. Lots of 14in. to 147/8 but not a lot of keeps. I also don't see a lot of gizzard shad but many of the threadfin that very small. Table rock and loz are full of gizzard shad and their bass size seems to run larger and the fishing pressure on these lakes is higher than Stockton. I don't know of any other reason other than forage that the bass on Stockton don't grow very fast. I was told several years ago, by a fishery biologist, that very few smallmouth make it to 15in on Stockton and could never understand why that was and I guess we will have the same problem with the spots.

[MoCarp]

5 hours ago, Walcrabass said:

Waterpossum,

  Interesting about the 4 pounders from the tournaments. I can tell you that 30 to 40 years ago it was not uncommon to catch 5 or 6 fish that were over 4 pounds in the same day/evening.

Mhyde,

 Concerning the genetics thing.............. Missouri is not interested in improving the "Genetics" of their Bass Population. Other states around us are doing just that and with great results. Here in Missouri we seem to be just concerned with the fact that people can catch a fish. Hence the lack of attention to the swelling Kentucky Bass population in our lakes. Just read this forum and see how many more of these Bass are being caught in Stockton now that just three years ago. Their growing population will not stop............... as they rarely reach the 15" length limit so they can be legally removed from the lake. Wait until you see what the next ten years brings................

 

Walcrabass

The "share a lunker" program in Texas was/is a smashing success..something that should happen here...as far as spotted bass dropping the limit to 12" seems reasonable

4 hours ago, livingtofish said:

Seems to be lots of interest in this subject. I agree that the largemouth doesn't seem to change much from yr. to yr. Lots of 14in. to 147/8 but not a lot of keeps. I also don't see a lot of gizzard shad but many of the threadfin that very small. Table rock and loz are full of gizzard shad and their bass size seems to run larger and the fishing pressure on these lakes is higher than Stockton. I don't know of any other reason other than forage that the bass on Stockton don't grow very fast. I was told several years ago, by a fishery biologist, that very few smallmouth make it to 15in on Stockton and could never understand why that was and I guess we will have the same problem with the spots.

smallies get harvested too fast, they are very aggressive........ a slot limit on bass in Stockton would be preferred...... but bass blasters might revolt,

6 bass limit

12" on spots,

only 2 can be smallmouths

min 18" on all but spots

only one bass of any species over 21"

selective harvest works.....

[MoCarp]

why can't we grow Crappies like Mississppi? or walleyes like MN? 

Giant redears like AZ? or mammoth yellow perch? well Bullshoals looks like its on its way to massive jumbo perch

[Terrierman]

On ‎8‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 2:20 PM, Kramr said:

Phil, how do you know who your MDC fisheries biologist is?

Call MDC and ask would be first pick.

[Terrierman]

25 minutes ago, MoCarp said:

why can't we grow Crappies like Mississppi? or walleyes like MN? 

Giant redears like AZ? or mammoth yellow perch? well Bullshoals looks like its on its way to massive jumbo perch

Mainly cause you're not in Mississippi or Minnesota for two.