Brown trout spawn

[Gavin]

Thinking you have shadow bass in SWMO, they look blotchy, Ozark bass on the White R Streams to your South East. Northern Rock Bass to the North & East of you.

[tjm]

I thought Al said shadow bass in this area, but the Elk inventory by MDC after 1998 lists Ambloplites rupestris and no other Ambloplites that I can find.
Interesting that in that USGS page it says 

Quote

 Rock Bass were extensively stocked in Missouri by state personnel during the 1930s and 1940s (Pflieger 1997).

So a Mo. biologist is the source of some of the stuff they posted.

And on this page https://nas.er.usgs.gov/queries/FactSheet.aspx?SpeciesID=372  USGS says about the Ozark bass

Quote

This species has been widely introduced into nonnative drainages in Arkansas and possibly into the Osage drainage in Missouri (Cashner and Suttkus 1977; Lee et al. 1980 et seq.; Robison and Buchanan 1988; Page and Burr 1991; Pflieger 1997).

It seems the Centerton hatchery didn't realize they had a new species and they just passed them "rock bass" out.  About half the town of Centerton and several nearby areas drain into the Elk so it'd not be surprising if the Ozark bass are here and not recognized. 

[Gavin]

Catch them, look at the examples, and make your own ID. S/b good enough. They are good eats!

[Al Agnew]

I've seen photos of the rock bass in SW MO, and those I saw looked like shadow bass but I didn't look close at the anal fin, which is the easiest way to tell them from northern rock bass.  I just glanced at Pflieger's book and misread which species was supposed to be in the Elk/Arkansas system, so I was wrong on that...the original "Fishes of Missouri" was written before the species were split, but the revision in 1997 has all three species, and shows the SW MO streams having northern rock bass.  Still, they could be hybrids, because the photos I saw looked like shadow bass.  If you have or can get a decent photo, or the next time you catch one, take a look at the anal fin.  If it is pretty clear with very little or no blotches on it and a black edge, it's a northern rock bass.  If it has a blotchy anal fin without a very dark outer edge, it's a shadow bass.  I also suppose it's possible that there could have been Ozark bass stocked in those streams, but they are pretty distinctive and easy to tell from the other two species.

22 hours ago, tjm said:

 

22 hours ago, tjm said:

I thought Al said shadow bass in this area, but the Elk inventory by MDC after 1998 lists Ambloplites rupestris and no other Ambloplites that I can find.
Interesting that in that USGS page it says 

So a Mo. biologist is the source of some of the stuff they posted.

And on this page https://nas.er.usgs.gov/queries/FactSheet.aspx?SpeciesID=372  USGS says about the Ozark bass

It seems the Centerton hatchery didn't realize they had a new species and they just passed them "rock bass" out.  About half the town of Centerton and several nearby areas drain into the Elk so it'd not be surprising if the Ozark bass are here and not recognized. 

 

 

[tjm]

They all look like perch to me. I have caught lots of sunfish that look like hybrids of some sort, never any pictures and don't usually remove them from the water if I can bump the barbless hook out. If I don't forget,  I'll pay attention to the fins next spring. I'm pretty sure I've caught some splotchy fish here before, but... There was I believe a note on one of those pages saying maybe the fish in Eastern OK were shadow X rockbass.

[Johnsfolly]

On 12/9/2019 at 9:02 PM, fishinwrench said:

Tavern has Goggle-eye as well.

Maries does not.

Little Niangua does not.

Weableau does, and it's a trib of Truman.   

Pomme river does.

Have to call BS on your armchair biologist distribution statements. Catch plenty of rock bass in the Maries over the last two decades.

[fishinwrench]

6 hours ago, Johnsfolly said:

Have to call BS on your armchair biologist distribution statements. Catch plenty of rock bass in the Maries over the last two decades.

Well that's cool 👍.    It actually has been 2 decades since I fished it.  My dad owned the property on the Osage just below the slough on the Osage city side, so I fished the lower Osage and the Maries alot when I was younger.  Never once saw a goggle-eye come from it.  

Never caught one out of the lower Osage either, but Tavern was always loaded with them.