First Float

[fishinwrench]

1 minute ago, MObassin95 said:

Wonder if the MDC should start culling some out. Or maybe start stocking rainbows. 

They knew this would happen when Dawt mill dam was left to its demise.   There was controversy, but nobody elected to fund it's reconstruction.

[fishinwrench]

7 minutes ago, MObassin95 said:

Interesting. I’ve been wanting to fish Bryant Creek for a while now. Hopefully no stripers there. Heard it’s a good smallmouth stream. 

Every stream that flows into Norfork lake is going to have stripers run up it during the Spring, or after a flood, you can bank on that.     They probably aren't residents of the creek though. 

[MObassin95]

34 minutes ago, fishinwrench said:

They knew this would happen when Dawt mill dam was left to its demise.   There was controversy, but nobody elected to fund it's reconstruction.

Interesting. I would like to talk to someone who fishes the river regularly and see if they’ve noticed a difference in trout fishing. The MDC website states fishing isn’t as good as pre 2017 flood, but doesn’t give specifics.

[Al Agnew]

I don't know why I can't get this comment to not be in bold type, so I'll just keep typing...

The reason you didn't catch many smallmouth is because that section is simply too cold for a good smallmouth population.  There aren't many bass in the North Fork between where the big springs come in and Dawt Mill, though they get more common the closer you get to Dawt.  The upper river has a good population of smallmouth.

The flood of 2017 did great damage to the trout population in two ways.  One, it wiped out a lot of the aquatic insect life.  Two, and in my opinion far more important, it scoured most of the trees out of the banks along the river, exposing it to the sun a lot more than it had been.  The river is warmer now in the summer because of that exposure.  I floated the entire trout section in 2018, in MAY, and measured water temps in the lower half of the trout section at 71-72 degrees.  I think it's simply too warm now for the trout to thrive except in the first few miles below the springs.

There was a big controversy among trout anglers about the removal of the mill dam at Dawt.  They knew it would allow the stripers to move farther up into the trout water.  It did.  And there is no doubt that the stripers are doing a number on the already suffering trout population.  In a way it's funny...one introduced species being decimated by another introduced species.

[Brian Wise]

Hey guys, long time no see!  I heard through the grapevine that there was a discussion on the river, stripers, trout, dams, floods, etc and thought I would pop in.

First, it doesn't surprise me at all to hear about pods of stripers above Rainbow Spring.  This is something that has happened for several years, and is a yearly occurence.  The stripers usually move in sometime around Memorial Day and will usually stay until sometime in October.  When they enter the river, they are literally scattered from "The Forks" (the headwater of Norfork Lake, well below Dawt Mill) all the way to the put-in at Hammond......seriously, I saw one in the pool at Hammond which probably means they will go higher than that---I just haven't seen them above that.  They are NOT in the river all year long, period.

MDC refuses to cull any of these fish.  Their excuse is that it would be very expensive shocking, keeping the fish alive, and releasing them back into the lake (which it honestly would be.)  MDC is taking a completely literal hands-off approach to the whole issue.  

The trout fishing since the flood has not been what I would call productive.  You 'can' catch fish on the upper end of the Blue Ribbon section, but it takes work.

One could blame the poor trout fishing on the stripers and the Dawt Mill dam being removed.  I personally don't know exactly where I stand, because no matter what excuse you throw on the table there is an argument against it.  If you totally blame it on the stripers, you have to remember that we consistantly had stripers in the river for 7 years before the flood, even before Dawt Mill Dam was breached.  In those years, all it took was for Norfork Lake to back up over Dawt Mill and the stripers had free roam of the whole river.  Those 7 years before the flood are what I would call the glory years of the NFOW.  

The flood was obviously the most devastating thing to happen to the river in anyone's memory.  This was a massive, massive event on a scale that no one alive had ever seen--and it changed the river dramatically.  The riparian corridor was basically moved to the base of the hill on either side of the river valley.  But, in the last couple of years this has started to get better.  We are seeing TONS of good growth close to the river, and the trees that we are seeing are getting big enough that they are doing just fine with higher water events that we tend to have.

In my eyes (note: these eyes are not educated, just having observed the river go from horrible fishing in the late 90's to phenomenal fishing in the 2000's and guiding on the river through that whole time) the river will never be exactly the same since the floods, stripers, etc....but we 'are' seeing a light at the end of the tunnel. 

Now to get MDC to step up and at least try to do something good for the river......

If you want, here is the Fisheries Biologist for the NFOW.  Nathan.Recktenwald@mdc.mo.gov

[MObassin95]

59 minutes ago, Brian Wise said:

Hey guys, long time no see!  I heard through the grapevine that there was a discussion on the river, stripers, trout, dams, floods, etc and thought I would pop in.

First, it doesn't surprise me at all to hear about pods of stripers above Rainbow Spring.  This is something that has happened for several years, and is a yearly occurence.  The stripers usually move in sometime around Memorial Day and will usually stay until sometime in October.  When they enter the river, they are literally scattered from "The Forks" (the headwater of Norfork Lake, well below Dawt Mill) all the way to the put-in at Hammond......seriously, I saw one in the pool at Hammond which probably means they will go higher than that---I just haven't seen them above that.  They are NOT in the river all year long, period.

MDC refuses to cull any of these fish.  Their excuse is that it would be very expensive shocking, keeping the fish alive, and releasing them back into the lake (which it honestly would be.)  MDC is taking a completely literal hands-off approach to the whole issue.  

The trout fishing since the flood has not been what I would call productive.  You 'can' catch fish on the upper end of the Blue Ribbon section, but it takes work.

One could blame the poor trout fishing on the stripers and the Dawt Mill dam being removed.  I personally don't know exactly where I stand, because no matter what excuse you throw on the table there is an argument against it.  If you totally blame it on the stripers, you have to remember that we consistantly had stripers in the river for 7 years before the flood, even before Dawt Mill Dam was breached.  In those years, all it took was for Norfork Lake to back up over Dawt Mill and the stripers had free roam of the whole river.  Those 7 years before the flood are what I would call the glory years of the NFOW.  

The flood was obviously the most devastating thing to happen to the river in anyone's memory.  This was a massive, massive event on a scale that no one alive had ever seen--and it changed the river dramatically.  The riparian corridor was basically moved to the base of the hill on either side of the river valley.  But, in the last couple of years this has started to get better.  We are seeing TONS of good growth close to the river, and the trees that we are seeing are getting big enough that they are doing just fine with higher water events that we tend to have.

In my eyes (note: these eyes are not educated, just having observed the river go from horrible fishing in the late 90's to phenomenal fishing in the 2000's and guiding on the river through that whole time) the river will never be exactly the same since the floods, stripers, etc....but we 'are' seeing a light at the end of the tunnel. 

Now to get MDC to step up and at least try to do something good for the river......

If you want, here is the Fisheries Biologist for the NFOW.  Nathan.Recktenwald@mdc.mo.gov

Great insight, thank you. Did the flood affect the Smallmouth population like it did the trout? My wife and I saw tonnes of life in and around the river, so that’s a good sign. Maybe some species were less affected by it. 

[MObassin95]

14 hours ago, Al Agnew said:

I don't know why I can't get this comment to not be in bold type, so I'll just keep typing...

The reason you didn't catch many smallmouth is because that section is simply too cold for a good smallmouth population.  There aren't many bass in the North Fork between where the big springs come in and Dawt Mill, though they get more common the closer you get to Dawt.  The upper river has a good population of smallmouth.

The flood of 2017 did great damage to the trout population in two ways.  One, it wiped out a lot of the aquatic insect life.  Two, and in my opinion far more important, it scoured most of the trees out of the banks along the river, exposing it to the sun a lot more than it had been.  The river is warmer now in the summer because of that exposure.  I floated the entire trout section in 2018, in MAY, and measured water temps in the lower half of the trout section at 71-72 degrees.  I think it's simply too warm now for the trout to thrive except in the first few miles below the springs.

There was a big controversy among trout anglers about the removal of the mill dam at Dawt.  They knew it would allow the stripers to move farther up into the trout water.  It did.  And there is no doubt that the stripers are doing a number on the already suffering trout population.  In a way it's funny...one introduced species being decimated by another introduced species.

Thank you for the insight! I guess I’ll try above Hammond next time I fish it. 

[MObassin95]

Oh, I did see one monster brown trout. Probably 20+ inches. 

[Brian Wise]

10 minutes ago, MObassin95 said:

Great insight, thank you. Did the flood affect the Smallmouth population like it did the trout? My wife and I saw tonnes of life in and around the river, so that’s a good sign. Maybe some species were less affected by it. 

The closer you get toward Norfork Lake the worse the flood was.  Don't get me wrong, the flood affected the whole river but it was definitely worse in the heart of the trout water.  Seems like smallmouth populations above Rainbow Spring weren't hit as hard as the trout.

[MObassin95]

2 hours ago, Brian Wise said:

The closer you get toward Norfork Lake the worse the flood was.  Don't get me wrong, the flood affected the whole river but it was definitely worse in the heart of the trout water.  Seems like smallmouth populations above Rainbow Spring weren't hit as hard as the trout.

Interesting. Thank you!